From: owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 1997 6:38 PM To: krnet-l-digest@teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V1 #166 krnet-l-digest Wednesday, November 12 1997 Volume 01 : Number 166 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 17:21:53 PST From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: Re: KR: Ellison woes >From: BSHADR@aol.com >Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:15:32 -0500 (EST) >To: krnet-l@teleport.com >Subject: KR: Ellison woes >Reply-To: krnet-l@teleport.com > > >KRNetheads: > >This message was from Robb Mokry. He has a KR2 with an Ellison carb problem. > Anybody have any thoughts or ideas he can chase to solve this problem? > >Randy Stein >BSHADR@aol.com >Soviet Monica, CA > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > >Lean rear cylinders ...still >Actually the right bank is leaner than the left (pilot side). I therorize >the reason is the fuel orifices (Ellison) at full throttle are greater on >the right side of the bore and either the fuel drips or flows along the right >side of the manifold tube until it reaches the 90 degree bend where it splits >to go right or left and it is easier to take the more gradual turn to the >left than the sharp abrupt turn to the right. > >remedy? > Couple of questions- first, everybody is assuming you're running a VW; answers could differ based on the engine (and engine size) you've got this on. Second, have you talked to Ellison? You're running their preferred setup for getting best vaporization, I think, but they may have some info based on the symptoms. I don't know that it would be liquid droplets or incomplete vaporization- kinda unlikely. What is the manifold made of? Last question- is there any way to rotate the Ellison on its mounting plate, either 90 or 180 degrees? I assume not, since the throttle linkage setup governs, but that would allow you to test your hypothesis about the uneven flow from the orifices in the unit. If you rotated it and the other side became the lean or rich or hot side, you'd have your culprit. Nah, too easy. Oscar Zuniga Medford, Oregon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:54:06 -0500 From: Marty Hammersmith Subject: Re: KR: Ellison woes >I am comtemplating welding a "splitter" a V in section pointing into the >incoming charge, so as to channel (split) the fuel toward the right left >distribution tubes. Yep, I believe you are on the right track. Runner length can sometimes be used to fine tune the mixture but if it's blatantly one side or the other, you need to even the flow at the Y. Proper balance is something you'll just have to kind of sneak up on. You'll probably put a little lip in there to help direct the flow then slowly grind away on one side or the other until the plugs look even and temps show some balance. Like I said, it's just kind of something you'll need to sneak up on. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 20:30:34 -0600 (CST) From: flesner Subject: KR: trailing edges Fellow builders, I'll share a few ideas I used on the trail edges of the wing , rudder , and elevator. Mine are all finished and turned out great with little hassle so I speak from experiance. My first step with each of the trail edges was to sand the trail edge straight from end to end flush with the trail edge of the template. This was done while the foam was still a block. I then used a permanent marker with a 1/16 inch (approx.) point and drew a straight line between ribs or templates depending which surface I was working on. This line will be your trailing edge. Now you have a referance to work to. The problem with sanding the foam is that it sands more or less along the length depending on the pressure on the sanding board and more importantly , how well the foam is supported along it's length (this translates to pressure applied). Now, support the foam well while sanding. For the elevator amd rudder you can use your work table. For the wing trail edge you should use some type of jig to hold a nice straight length of anything you care to use as a support. Anything from an 8 foot level to a straight board will work as long as it remains straight under the pressure of sanding. If the sanding process is not uniform along the length you will quickly notice because of the distance from your line. The last little "nibbles" can be done with a smaller sanding block as you close in on perfection. DO NOT sand away the line. You will want to leave the trail edge about 3/32 to 1/8 of an inch thick so leave the line. More on this later. When you are totally finished with that side , lay up the glass and let it cure. After cured and before flipping it over, draw another straight line on the cured glass from templet to templet and sand down to the line again. You now have a straight trail edge on one side so flip it over. Next sand down the second side but make sure to leave the foam 3/32 to 1/8 inch thick at the trail edge. Glass and let cure the second side. Sand the trail edge straight on the second side. You now have a perfectly straight and true trail edge, glassed on both sides with the foam showing at the trail edge approx 3/32 of inch. Next the final touch. Using a dremel tool with a small wire wheel or a hand-held small wire brush, take out the foam approx. 1/4 inch or so into the trail edge. This really is not difficult at all. Use a shiney flox mix (resin rich) to fill the trail edge and let cure. I used a mixing stick but a small puddy knife should work o.k. This really is a lot easier than it sounds. Fill the void well by pressuring in the flox. When the flox is cured, pull a piece of sand paper around the trail edge to finish it or cup a piece in your hand to sand it out. This will give you a very true, straight, rounded trail edge that looks absolutely great. I think it gives you a lighter trail edge also without a lot of flox and filler. Any questions? Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 21:41:06 -0500 (EST) From: bvermeul@concentric.net Subject: Re: KR: video >My mistake. When is the projected release date for the '97 KR gathering >Video? > > >Jeffrey E Scott wrote: > >> On Mon, 10 Nov 1997 18:42:22 -0800 "John F. Esch" >> writes: >> >Has been a projected date for the '97 KR gathering? >> > >> >John F. Esch >> >Salem, OR >> > >> > >> Friday, Saturday, Sunday, September 18 - 20, Perry, OK >> ------- >> Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM >> jscott.pilot@juno.com >> See N1213W construction and first flight at >> http://fly.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: >> //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm > > Let's see now. Half a month in Europe, kidney stones, a move of the household, demanding clients, more demanding clients. I know, excuses, excuses, excuses, but they are all true. The original date for completion of the 97 Gathering Video was Nov. 15. Yikes, that's this weekend. I think we'll be close gang. Maybe only a couple of days off. I'll be sure to post a notice on KRNet when it's completed. From the footage I've logged so far (15 hours), it looks like it should be another good video. Of course, I'm partial. (like a mother who thinks that ugly baby is beautiful) Remember, if you flew your KR to Perry or dragged it in on a trailer, you'll be getting a free copy of the video. Keep saying it over and over. "Patience is a virtue....Patience is a virtue.... Patience is a virtue" You're a great bunch of guys....Thanks for all your support and kind comments. Video Bob ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:01:03 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges At 08:30 PM 11/11/97 -0600, you wrote: > Fellow builders, > > I'll share a few ideas I used on the trail edges of the > wing , rudder , and elevator.................. Good stuff, another way is to use hot wired cores and all sanding of trailing edge issues are gone! :o) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine Ca. mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 22:47:14 -0500 (EST) From: JEHayward@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Elevator Trailing Edge Question In a message dated 97-11-11 15:27:16 EST, you write: << I had LOTS of problems with the trailing edge. I ended up building up a large blob with FLOX, then sanding it to shape. There was one tip here to use a mylar strip over a streight piece of metal/wood to get a true trailing edge, that sounded like a good idea. >> I was wondering if anyone had tried using a triangular piece of balsa wood and covering that with fiberglass and fairing it into the wing. Jim Hayward ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:39:06 -0800 From: hjfine@wave.net Subject: Re: KR: Dallas KR At 10:13 PM 11/10/97 -0600, you wrote: >At 08:02 PM 11/10/97 -0800, you wrote: >>Well, >> Are we talking Dallas TX, or Dallas OR? >> >> -- Ross > >Sorry, Ross. Dallas, TX. Too far to drive from OR to look at a "boat". I >still haven't heard from the guy yet... >Kerry Miller >Royse City, TX >40 miles East of Dallas, TX >(Considerably farther South of Dallas, OR) > >Howdy Kerry: Did you try to make contact with the owner of the boat in Dallas? Has he not gotten back to you? Thanks for trying. I'll standby. Question: If I'm in favor of restoring the rule of law based upon the US Constitution, what political party should I join? Take care buddy, Hank in Oregon > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:34:24 -0500 (EST) From: MikeTnyc@aol.com Subject: KR: Newsletter, woodworking tips Courtesy of my office, which has finally hooked up to Netscape, I was finally able to download and print the old KROnline newsletters last night (except December, which apparently doesn't exist anymore?) and I must say I was tremendously impressed. It's too bad they're so time-consuming to produce and somewhat difficult to obtain with low-end equipment. Even if no more are done, I'm glad I have these -- has anyone considered sending a copy to Monte Miller for inclusion in the KR Newsletter? He recently said he was having trouble getting enough good submissions. Although I'm not building a plane right now, I've recently been doing woodworking around my house (a fixer-upper) and hit on two woodworking tips that some people may not have thought of. Both are for handsaws and use hot-melt glue: 1. Quick & Dirty Scarfing: Take the two pieces you want to scarf and glue them together in a lap joint with hot-melt glue. Then clamp the stock in a vise and saw through the lap joint at a suitable angle with a thin saw. Now you can get the hot-melt glue off with a hair-dryer and glue the newly-scarfed diagonal (which never got any hot-melt on it, so it's all set for the real glue). Since the two pieces are cut together, lack of perfection in cutting will cancel out to some extent. (You can also choose to use the hair-dryer after the joint is done, keeping the extra wood to aid in clamping. Be warned that you'll have to clean the hot-melt off the saw afterwards. 2. Cutting round stock evenly: It is difficult to know where to start cuts on each side so they'll meet in the middle. Glue the stock to the workbench or a smooth table with hot-melt glue. Now run a right triangle, scraper blade, etc., down both sides, keeping it perpendicular to the table. This will give you marks on both sides 180 degrees apart for starting the cuts, and the glue (unlike clamps) will not get in the way. Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 21:50:59 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: KR: Layups and AS&S flub up! Sports fans, well after what seems like weeks of adding foam to the bottom of the wing stubs (have I ever mentioned how much I hate urethane foam?) I was finally glad to glass the bottom of the right stub! Looks pretty darn good too! I finished up with the very last batch of a Aeropoxy gallon kit and decided I would apply a little glass to another area of the plane. After preparation I started to mix up a small batch of Aeropoxy from a new kit. Well,...it seems that some dilrod at AS&S decided to tape quart size cans of resin to gallon size cans of resin to make up a kit. Something wrong with that picture though,.....NO HARDNER!! ARGH! Well things could have been much worse I guess, like I could have been in the middle of the stub wing layup and discovered the most heinous error! Well this will delay the trip to the airport by a week because I cant get to AS&S till Friday to exchange it. Oh well the wife is going out of town Friday for several days so that will give me plenty of uninterrupted garage time this weekend and next week after work. Anyway if you recently were shipped Aeropoxy from AS&S you may want to check it and make sure you have hardner AND resin. Mike "I hate urethane foam with a passion" Mims ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine Ca. mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 22:51:55 -0800 From: tomstokes1@juno.com (Wayland T. Stokes) Subject: Re: KR: video Bob How much and when do you want the money sent to you for a copy of the video. I heard later you were taking orders at PerryKOSK but I guess I messed that Course trying to keep herd on 2 kids did distract me some, especially when my 2 year old decided to beat on Bobby Muse's wings. Tom in Reno NV On Tue, 11 Nov 1997 21:41:06 -0500 (EST) bvermeul@concentric.net writes: >>My mistake. When is the projected release date for the '97 KR >gathering >>Video? >> >> >>Jeffrey E Scott wrote: >> >>> On Mon, 10 Nov 1997 18:42:22 -0800 "John F. Esch" > >>> writes: >>> >Has been a projected date for the '97 KR gathering? >>> > >>> >John F. Esch >>> >Salem, OR >>> > >>> > >>> Friday, Saturday, Sunday, September 18 - 20, Perry, OK >>> ------- >>> Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM >>> jscott.pilot@juno.com >>> See N1213W construction and first flight at >>> http://fly.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: >>> //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm >> >> >Let's see now. Half a month in Europe, kidney stones, a move of the >household, demanding clients, more demanding clients. I know, >excuses, >excuses, excuses, but they are all true. The original date for >completion >of the 97 Gathering Video was Nov. 15. Yikes, that's this weekend. I >think >we'll be close gang. Maybe only a couple of days off. I'll be sure >to post >a notice on KRNet when it's completed. From the footage I've logged >so far >(15 hours), it looks like it should be another good video. Of course, >I'm >partial. (like a mother who thinks that ugly baby is beautiful) >Remember, >if you flew your KR to Perry or dragged it in on a trailer, you'll be >getting a free copy of the video. > >Keep saying it over and over. "Patience is a virtue....Patience is a >virtue.... Patience is a virtue" > >You're a great bunch of guys....Thanks for all your support and kind >comments. > >Video Bob > > ------------------------------ Date: 12 Nov 1997 00:51:37 GMT From: Franciscoeiza@evnet.satlink.net (Francisco Eizayaga) Subject: Re: Re: KR: rotax 582 Thanks Dave, I'll be in touch. Francisco Eizayaga. ******************************************** Send via E.v. Net BBS UUCP (admin@evnet.satlink.net) ******************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 06:27:08 -0600 From: Kerry Miller Subject: Re: KR: Dallas KR At 07:39 PM 11/11/97 -0800, you wrote: >>Howdy Kerry: Did you try to make contact with the owner of the boat in >Dallas? Has he not gotten back to you? Thanks for trying. I'll standby. >Question: If I'm in favor of restoring the rule of law based upon the US >Constitution, what political party should I join? Take care buddy, Hank >in Oregon Ummm, I don't know of one! I'm Republican 'cuz it's closer than Democrat to the constitution, but there just isn't a big difference any more. I've voted Libertarian in the past, but it seems like they never get anywhere. I guess I'm a Republican in name only, I'll vote for anybody who I think is on the right track. They are few and far between... I still haven't heard from him, I'll take the number with me to work today and try to catch him. Kerry Kerry Miller, WD5ABC "I own that I am not a friend to a very 8991 FM 35 energetic government. It is always Royse City, TX 75189 oppressive. It places the governors http://www.flash.net/~kmiller indeed more at their ease, at the kmiller@flash.net expense of the people." Thomas Jefferson, 12/20/1787 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 12:27:08 -0600 From: Kerry Miller Subject: Re: KR: Dallas KR At 07:39 PM 11/11/97 -0800, you wrote: >>Howdy Kerry: Did you try to make contact with the owner of the boat in >Dallas? Has he not gotten back to you? Thanks for trying. I'll standby. >Question: If I'm in favor of restoring the rule of law based upon the US >Constitution, what political party should I join? Take care buddy, Hank >in Oregon Ummm, I don't know of one! I'm Republican 'cuz it's closer than Democrat to the constitution, but there just isn't a big difference any more. I've voted Libertarian in the past, but it seems like they never get anywhere. I guess I'm a Republican in name only, I'll vote for anybody who I think is on the right track. They are few and far between... I still haven't heard from him, I'll take the number with me to work today and try to catch him. Kerry Kerry Miller, WD5ABC "I own that I am not a friend to a very 8991 FM 35 energetic government. It is always Royse City, TX 75189 oppressive. It places the governors http://www.flash.net/~kmiller indeed more at their ease, at the kmiller@flash.net expense of the people." Thomas Jefferson, 12/20/1787 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 07:16:26 -0600 From: ejanssen@chipsnet.com (Ed Janssen) Subject: Re: KR: Newsletter, woodworking tips >2. Cutting round stock evenly: It is difficult to know where to start cuts >on each side so they'll meet in the middle. Glue the stock to the workbench >or a smooth table with hot-melt glue. Now run a right triangle, scraper >blade, etc., down both sides, keeping it perpendicular to the table. This >will give you marks on both sides 180 degrees apart for starting the cuts, >and the glue (unlike clamps) will not get in the way. > >Mike Taglieri Good ideas, Mike. With the above idea, I've done the same thing with good results when cutting large dia. plastic pipe with my recip. saw. Also, before I glued/clamped the stock to the cutting surface I draw a straight line on the surface, same direction as the cut, so I had a exact reference line for placing the square on both sides of the stock. Ed Janssen ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 05:51:30 PST From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: Re: KR: Newsletter, woodworking tips >From: MikeTnyc@aol.com >Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 23:34:24 -0500 (EST) >To: krnet-l@teleport.com >Subject: KR: Newsletter, woodworking tips >Reply-To: krnet-l@teleport.com > >Courtesy of my office, which has finally hooked up to Netscape, I was finally >able to download and print the old KROnline newsletters last night (except >December, which apparently doesn't exist anymore?) and I must say I was >tremendously impressed. It's too bad they're so time-consuming to produce >and somewhat difficult to obtain with low-end equipment. Even if no more are >done, I'm glad I have these -- has anyone considered sending a copy to Monte >Miller for inclusion in the KR Newsletter? He recently said he was having >trouble getting enough good submissions. > >Although I'm not building a plane right now, I've recently been doing >woodworking around my house (a fixer-upper) and hit on two woodworking tips >that some people may not have thought of. Both are for handsaws and use >hot-melt glue: > >1. Quick & Dirty Scarfing: Take the two pieces you want to scarf and glue >them together in a lap joint with hot-melt glue. Then clamp the stock in a >vise and saw through the lap joint at a suitable angle with a thin saw. Now >you can get the hot-melt glue off with a hair-dryer and glue the >newly-scarfed diagonal (which never got any hot-melt on it, so it's all set >for the real glue). Since the two pieces are cut together, lack of >perfection in cutting will cancel out to some extent. (You can also choose >to use the hair-dryer after the joint is done, keeping the extra wood to aid >in clamping. Be warned that you'll have to clean the hot-melt off the saw >afterwards. > >2. Cutting round stock evenly: It is difficult to know where to start cuts >on each side so they'll meet in the middle. Glue the stock to the workbench >or a smooth table with hot-melt glue. Now run a right triangle, scraper >blade, etc., down both sides, keeping it perpendicular to the table. This >will give you marks on both sides 180 degrees apart for starting the cuts, >and the glue (unlike clamps) will not get in the way. > >Mike Taglieri > Hi, Mike- Yes, the KROnline Newsletters are excellent. I printed them out, put them in my 3-ring, and they are definitely 'keepers'. Too bad the photos don't print out too keen on the laser (compared to the detail visible in the photos). This points out the value of archiving these on CD-ROM, where they will be retrievable in their full content and detail. BTW, the December issue IS available... try going to the www.krnet.org page, or somebody else's page that has links to it- I think it's the issue that was originally offered as the 'sample' issue, and has details on the nosewheel ideas (for whatever reason anybody wants a nosewheel). Plus the now-famous hint on using OIL-IMPREGNATED BRONZE BUSHINGS (not O*lite) for elevator hinges, as on Mark Langford's KR. Hey- you sound like a hot glue type of guy. You got something against duct tape, or what? I thought I'd follow your lead and use hot glue for other tough household chores. I hot-glued my shoes to the bench last night- makes it real easy to polish them, but they sure look clunky today at work since I used my scroll saw to cut away the scrap plywood I glued 'em to, and the hair dryer is an absolute HANDS-OFF as far as the wife and daughters are concerned. Any tips on how to get this plywood off? ;^) Oscar Zuniga Medford, Oregon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:57:00 -0800 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: Ellison woes BSHADR@aol.com wrote: > This message was from Robb Mokry. He has a KR2 with an Ellison carb problem. > Anybody have any thoughts or ideas he can chase to solve this problem? > > Randy Stein > BSHADR@aol.com > Soviet Monica, CA > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Lean rear cylinders ...still > remedy? > I am comtemplating welding a "splitter" a V in section pointing into the > incoming charge, so as to channel (split) the fuel toward the right left > distribution tubes. > Turbulance? > What do you think of introducing some turbulance in the manifold? I have ram > air inlet that is covered with a foam "sock" filter tube (therby negating any > ram induction pressure) - I may remove the foam sock and fabricate a aluminum > funnel to fit the cowling to see if that helps create some turbulence. I > talked to Dan Diehl who said weld a swirl plate in the intake aft of the carb > to get the charge spinning but this sounds much easier than it is (as I have > tried) and I have a very short straight run aft of the carb berore the 90 > degree split. Roughen up the intake walls? > Am I missing anything here? If you agree I will try the splitter and no air > filter first. > > Rob This is outside of my area, so I will just throw these out for comment. I think you are on the right tack. Talk to Ellison first. How about inducing more turbulant flow prior to the injectors, i.e. a swirl plate just inside the air intake. If not swirl plates downstream of the injectors, how about a set of labyrinth plates that change the airflow direction several times. - -- Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 09:00:19 -0800 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: Elevator Trailing Edge Question JEHayward@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 97-11-11 15:27:16 EST, you write: > > << I had LOTS of problems with the trailing edge. I ended up > building up a large blob with FLOX, then sanding it to shape. > There was one tip here to use a mylar strip over a streight piece > of metal/wood to get a true trailing edge, that sounded like a > good idea. >> > > I was wondering if anyone had tried using a triangular piece of balsa wood > and covering that with fiberglass and fairing it into the wing. > > Jim Hayward I milled a spruce trailing edge for the elevator and it was a pain. Balsa might work better, but the glass-to-glass joint works fine as long as the edge is supported. I would do it that way again. - -- Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 06:32:14 PST From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR: Prop question Hi, Netters There was a post a while back from somebody who is building a database on props used on KRs, but I can't find it. My question is, and I know this will vary all over the place based on what type of gear and engine setup are used, but what is the practical limit for prop diameter on the KR? The side views I have really aren't scaleable, and no dimensions are given. Jeff, did you mention that you were turning 60"? I think I saw some 60" props listed, but nothing bigger. Thanks Oscar Zuniga Medford,Oregon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 09:43:59 -0500 From: Robert Moreland Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges I speak not from experience, as I have not yet come to the place in my project where I would be concerned with trailing edges. This is what I intend to do. Measure the angle of the trailing edge off the blueprint. Rip a piece of wood out of a 3/4 inch board at that angle. The cross setional dimensions would be a trapazoid approx 1/8" x 3/4 x 3/8. Glue it to the foam blocks and use it as a snding guide when you are shaping the wings. It will be straight, light weight, and strong. What else can you ask for? flesner wrote: > > Fellow builders, > > I'll share a few ideas I used on the trail edges of the > wing , rudder , and elevator. Mine are all finished > and turned out great with little hassle so I speak > from experiance. > > My first step with each of the trail edges was to sand > the trail edge straight from end to end flush with the > trail edge of the template. This was done while the > foam was still a block. I then used a permanent marker > with a 1/16 inch (approx.) point and drew a straight line > between ribs or templates depending which surface I > was working on. This line will be your trailing edge. > Now you have a referance to work to. The problem with > sanding the foam is that it sands more or less along the > length depending on the pressure on the sanding board > and more importantly , how well the foam is supported > along it's length (this translates to pressure applied). > > Now, support the foam well while sanding. For the elevator > amd rudder you can use your work table. For the wing > trail edge you should use some type of jig to hold a > nice straight length of anything you care to use as a > support. Anything from an 8 foot level to a straight > board will work as long as it remains straight under > the pressure of sanding. If the sanding process is > not uniform along the length you will quickly notice > because of the distance from your line. The last > little "nibbles" can be done with a smaller sanding > block as you close in on perfection. DO NOT sand away > the line. You will want to leave the trail edge > about 3/32 to 1/8 of an inch thick so leave the line. > More on this later. When you are totally finished > with that side , lay up the glass and let it cure. > After cured and before flipping it over, draw another > straight line on the cured glass from templet to templet > and sand down to the line again. You now have a straight > trail edge on one side so flip it over. > > Next sand down the second side but make sure to leave > the foam 3/32 to 1/8 inch thick at the trail edge. > Glass and let cure the second side. Sand the trail edge > straight on the second side. You now have a perfectly > straight and true trail edge, glassed on both sides with > the foam showing at the trail edge approx 3/32 of inch. > > Next the final touch. Using a dremel tool with a small > wire wheel or a hand-held small wire brush, take out the > foam approx. 1/4 inch or so into the trail edge. This > really is not difficult at all. Use a shiney flox mix > (resin rich) to fill the trail edge and let cure. I used > a mixing stick but a small puddy knife should work o.k. > This really is a lot easier than it sounds. Fill the > void well by pressuring in the flox. > > When the flox is cured, pull a piece of sand paper around > the trail edge to finish it or cup a piece in your hand > to sand it out. This will give you a very true, straight, > rounded trail edge that looks absolutely great. I think > it gives you a lighter trail edge also without a lot of > flox and filler. > > Any questions? > > Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 11:31:34 -0500 From: "Richard Parker" Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges After all that extensive discussion on trailing edges I think I've just decided not to use any. I'm going to use all leading edges. ;-) Rich Parker (plans in the mail) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:41:06 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges At 09:43 AM 11/12/97 -0500, you wrote: >I speak not from experience, as I have not yet come to the place in my >project where I would be concerned with trailing edges. This is what I >intend to do...... I speak from experience, trailing edges are NOT hard if done right! There have been some good ideas shared here on the krnet and all should work. Sand one side of your foam (or hot wire your cores) and one side only. Glass it, let cure, bondo (with just a little bondo) a nice straight piece of wood to the glassed side near the trailing edge. Sand the second side to shape then remove the last 1/2 inch of foam. Either fill this area with flox or sand a nice transition so the second layup of glass will flow down onto the first layup. If you decide to use flox, just add enough flox to fill the area where the foam was removed, wetout the glass and your done. If you use the glass to glass method, just fill the area with dry micro after cure. Its REALLY easy to get nice even straight trailing edges, trust me! ____________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine CA http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 08:49:55 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges Stopped by the garage this morning to do a little razor trimming on the glass I wetout last night. Looks REALLY cool! I actually have an airfoil on my KR! Woo Hoo! But they are too short for flight, doh!!! ?<---use your best Homer Simpson impression By the way,.. trailing edge looks really good but I agree Rich,. the leading edge looks better! :o) ____________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine CA http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 15:30:11 -0500 (EST) From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Subject: KR: Trailing edge glassing. This is somewhat different than the reinforceing of the edge itself. To allieviate the problem of having the glass itself not wrapping itself around a sharp edge I ended up using gutter material. Get with your local continuous gutter man, he will have lots of four to five foot pieces of junk he will give you or sell you for next to nothing. Wax the white side and bend it on a break. You can then add any amount of additional angle you need. Place this material over the sharp edge (ie. trailing edge of rudder, elevator or wing) with peel ply between. It works great and you don't have to make wood buildups using duct tape. The resin will not stick to the material and it can be reused. Dana Overall, Richmond KY http://members.iclub.org/kr2616tj/ still under construction ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:51:18 -0600 From: Kerry Miller Subject: KR: Big oops! Sorry guys, I replied to the wrong address, again... Either way, I still haven't gotten hold of the guy in Dallas. It's bad enough that I replied the wrong way, but I got my message back twice! Kerry "red-faced" Miller Royse City, TX ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 17:53:18 -0700 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: Re: KR: Prop question On Wed, 12 Nov 1997 06:32:14 PST "Oscar Zuniga" writes: > >Jeff, did you mention that you were turning 60"? I think I saw some 60" >props listed, but nothing bigger. > >Thanks > >Oscar Zuniga Yep, 60x66, but don't assume that most KR's can turn that diameter. I'm sitting on some tall gear legs that allow me to use that length of prop. When you get to that stage, just tip your airplane over on it's nose as far as you think it might go on a muffed wheel landing or takeoff with a little too much tail up, then give yourself about another 6 inches for gear flex and you should be in good shape. One of Jeff's rules of thumb for builders. :o) - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://fly.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 19:39:30 -0800 From: Robert Maniss Subject: KR: Resin post curing process In Ron Alexander's article (Composite Construction - Part II in the November "Sport Aviation") he has a couple of paragraphs about the importance of post curing the resin. How are the rest of you handling that and what are your suggestions? Have ordered the book "The Basics of Fiberglass" from AS & S but haven't received it yet. Any suggestions for other reading? I really appreciated the demo at Perry by you, Mike, and (Rick?). Any and all help welcome. Thanks. Bob Maniss (If a stealth bomber crashes in a forest, will it make a sound?) ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 20:58:55 -0600 From: John Roffey Subject: Re: KR: video bvermeul@concentric.net wrote: > > >My mistake. When is the projected release date for the '97 KR gathering > >Video? > > > > > >Jeffrey E Scott wrote: > > > >> On Mon, 10 Nov 1997 18:42:22 -0800 "John F. Esch" > >> writes: > >> >Has been a projected date for the '97 KR gathering? > >> > > >> >John F. Esch > >> >Salem, OR > >> > > >> > > >> Friday, Saturday, Sunday, September 18 - 20, Perry, OK > >> ------- > >> Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM > >> jscott.pilot@juno.com > >> See N1213W construction and first flight at > >> http://fly.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: > >> //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm > > > > > Let's see now. Half a month in Europe, kidney stones, a move of the > household, demanding clients, more demanding clients. I know, excuses, > excuses, excuses, but they are all true. The original date for completion > of the 97 Gathering Video was Nov. 15. Yikes, that's this weekend. I think > we'll be close gang. Maybe only a couple of days off. I'll be sure to post > a notice on KRNet when it's completed. From the footage I've logged so far > (15 hours), it looks like it should be another good video. Of course, I'm > partial. (like a mother who thinks that ugly baby is beautiful) Remember, > if you flew your KR to Perry or dragged it in on a trailer, you'll be > getting a free copy of the video. > > Keep saying it over and over. "Patience is a virtue....Patience is a > virtue.... Patience is a virtue" > > You're a great bunch of guys....Thanks for all your support and kind comments. > > Video Bob Hey Bob, glad to see your busy! Please announce when the video is ready for market here on the net. I'll come over there to pick mine up. John Roffey (your Mich Neighbour in Fort Gratiot) jeroffey@tir.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:15:58 -0500 From: david Subject: KR: "Santa Claus" Santa made an early visit to my house to see me today and guess what? He traded in his sleigh for a BIG truck that says "Yellow Freight" :) He delivered my cowling, canopy, turtledeck, wheels, brakes (cleveland), engine mount, starter, landing gear (Diehl taildrager), and a bunch of other stuff!! I love "Santa" Maybe if I am real good, he will bring me my engine from Great Plains? (hint hint) Well, off to the garage. :) David Batton p.s. my goal is to have it ready for avionics and engine stuff by Spring/Summer ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:37:45 -0500 (EST) From: EagleGator@aol.com Subject: KR: Homemade propellers Does anyone know anything about the ads in Sport Aviation and Kitplanes for plans to make your own props? The prices are low, but I don't want to waste my money, either. Cheers! Rick Junkin EagleGator@aol.com St. Charles MO ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V1 #166 *****************************