From: owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com] Sent: Thursday, November 13, 1997 12:48 PM To: krnet-l-digest@teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V1 #167 krnet-l-digest Thursday, November 13 1997 Volume 01 : Number 167 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 18:59:21 -0800 From: MARVIN MCCOY Subject: Re: KR: Homemade propellers EagleGator@aol.com wrote: > > Does anyone know anything about the ads in Sport Aviation and Kitplanes for > plans to make your own props? The prices are low, but I don't want to waste > my money, either. - -------------------------- Rick: I found two small books on the subject that give enough information to build a prop. One is "Propeller Making" by Eric Clutton 913 Cedar Lane Tullshome, TN. 37388 The other is a small pamphlet titled "propeller Carving" by Garth Ness 881 Emory Ct. Upland, CA 91786 I can't remember what they cost was but they were not a lot of money. I think they were both good. Or at least I got information that I can use from both of them. I do not know anything about the ads for building a machine to carve your own propeller. But it might be interesting to try it. Hope this helps. Marvin McCoy Seattle, WA. North end of Boeing field Mr.Marvin@worldnet.att.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:10:49 From: Austin Clark Subject: KR: Trailing edge glassing Thanks everyone for all the ideas. Since I had already glassed one side and sanded the other, I milled a piece of spruce to reinforce the trailing edge. I will flox these in place and then use a mold to wrap the wetted glass around the edge to the cured side. Austin Clark KR2S Pascagoula MS ICQ 4988381 ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 19:46:04 -0800 From: Robert Covington Subject: Re: KR: Homemade propellers > >The other is a small pamphlet titled "propeller Carving" by > > Garth Ness > 881 Emory Ct. > Upland, CA 91786 > > I can't remember what they cost was but they were not a lot of >money. I think they were both good. Or at least I got information that >I can use from both of them. > I do not know anything about the ads for building a machine to >carve your own propeller. But it might be interesting to try it. > Hope this helps. > >Marvin McCoy >Seattle, WA. North end of Boeing field >Mr.Marvin@worldnet.att.net Sure that isn't Garth "Hess"? There is a guy in my EAA chapter that goes by that name, but I didn't know he did a prop booklet. Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 20:48:11 -0800 From: "parley t. byington" Subject: Re: KR: New pictures Mike I sent you a reply for visiting me when you are in town for comdex this weekend, did you get it? Anyway if you would like to come over and see my bird (N54PB) when you are in town just give me a call at 565-6550. I will give you directions on how to get here or come and show you. I still have my plane in my garage but it is very close to going to the airport. Hope to hear from you. Regards Parley ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:19:36 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: New pictures At 08:48 PM 11/12/97 -0800, you wrote: >I sent you a reply for visiting me when you are in town for comdex this >weekend, did you get it? >Hope to hear from you. > Boy I don't know if I got it or not, my email (Pacbell) has been whacked lately! I decided not to go to Comdex this year. We couldn't figure out what to do with the K-9 (our dog sitter is out of town) and a boarding kennel is out of the question since our last incident with one. So I will stay here and hold down the fort (work on my KR) while the wife does the Comdex thing. Thanks for the offer and I would like to make it out and visit sometime before Christmas if that's ok? ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine Ca. mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 21:41:21 -0800 From: hjfine@wave.net Subject: Re: KR: KR2 for sale At 02:03 PM 10/25/97 -0500, you wrote: >WHAT IS R A H ? I'm interested!!! > >Rich McCall >1518 Holly Lane >Junction City, KS 66441 > >Patrick Flowers wrote: > >> This popped up on r.a.h this morning: >> >> > For Sale KR2 N76KB 175 Hours TT. Hapi 1835 Slick Mag. Elt, some instru. >> > Deihl gear conversion. Needs work, wing and canopy damage. Built in 1978. >> > $3000 OBO contact: Harold Shoemaker via E-Mail or 319-396-3651. >> >> -- >> Patrick Flowers >> Mailto:patri63@ibm.net > >If this is still for sale, please let me know. Thanks. Hank > > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:18:16 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Here's the JPG KR patch file. Dana, Thanks. Gee, if this was on a website, people could look at it, and if they just happened to have the iron-on stuff in the printer, they would be accidently making T-shirts. Since I don't have this on my website, I don't have to worry about any copyright issues. -- Ross KR2616TJ@aol.com wrote: > > Duhhhhhhhhh, it would have helped if I would have attached the KR patch file. > check it out. > > Dana Overall > http://members.iclub.org/kr2616tj/ still under construction > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > [Image] ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:28:02 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Ellison woes Rob, You are using gravity feed? I had a discussion with a local EAAer who didn't think the header tank would provide enough pressure for this. Have you tried a boost pump and do you get the same results? How about flipping the carb upside down, and seeing if your problem moves? (This is possible for me as I don't have the linkage done. but you might have interference problems) I know this might be a stupid suggestion, but hey, thats what I'm here for. I had a VW trick book that had a lot to say about a plenum chamber just under the carb for a VW, perhaps a spacer block could be fabricated 1" thick to play with this idea easily. These are just worthless ideas, I have absolutely no idea if they will work. -- Ross BSHADR@aol.com wrote: > > KRNetheads: > > This message was from Robb Mokry. He has a KR2 with an Ellison carb problem. > Anybody have any thoughts or ideas he can chase to solve this problem? > > Randy Stein > BSHADR@aol.com > Soviet Monica, CA > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Lean rear cylinders ...still > Actually the right bank is leaner than the left (pilot side). I therorize > the reason is the fuel orifices (Ellison) at full throttle are greater on > the right side of the bore and either the fuel drips or flows along the right > side of the manifold tube until it reaches the 90 degree bend where it splits > to go right or left and it is easier to take the more gradual turn to the > left than the sharp abrupt turn to the right. > > remedy? > I am comtemplating welding a "splitter" a V in section pointing into the > incoming charge, so as to channel (split) the fuel toward the right left > distribution tubes. > > __________________________ > to right bank (lean) ____________ V ____________ to left bank > (rich) > l l > l l > carb > > Turbulance? > What do you think of introducing some turbulance in the manifold? I have ram > air inlet that is covered with a foam "sock" filter tube (therby negating any > ram induction pressure) - I may remove the foam sock and fabricate a aluminum > funnel to fit the cowling to see if that helps create some turbulence. I > talked to Dan Diehl who said weld a swirl plate in the intake aft of the carb > to get the charge spinning but this sounds much easier than it is (as I have > tried) and I have a very short straight run aft of the carb berore the 90 > degree split. Roughen up the intake walls? > > I really like the idea of keeping the carb under the engine so I can keep > gravity flow for fuel and not have to rely on a fuel pump. But I remember > Steve Bennett put his carb up top and used short intake runners and got the > temps in line and picked up 175 rpm. > > Am I missing anything here? If you agree I will try the splitter and no air > filter first. > > Rob ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:31:05 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Ellison woes Rotating the Ellison is possible, the carb doesn't care where it goes. But the fuel inlet, and the linkages are a problem. If you can do the tests on the ground, then perhaps there is a chance. I think that they frowned on two of the four possible installations, with the metering get vertically mounted, but I may have imagined it. The carb does come with a pretty good installation manual, and the suggestion to call Ellison is a good one I think. ( I can't wait to have this problem! My engine hasn't been started yet). Oscar Zuniga wrote: > > >From: BSHADR@aol.com > >Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:15:32 -0500 (EST) > >To: krnet-l@teleport.com > >Subject: KR: Ellison woes > >Reply-To: krnet-l@teleport.com > > > > > >KRNetheads: > > > >This message was from Robb Mokry. He has a KR2 with an Ellison carb > problem. > > Anybody have any thoughts or ideas he can chase to solve this problem? > > > >Randy Stein > >BSHADR@aol.com > >Soviet Monica, CA > > > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > >Lean rear cylinders ...still > >Actually the right bank is leaner than the left (pilot side). I > therorize > >the reason is the fuel orifices (Ellison) at full throttle are greater > on > >the right side of the bore and either the fuel drips or flows along the > right > >side of the manifold tube until it reaches the 90 degree bend where it > splits > >to go right or left and it is easier to take the more gradual turn to > the > >left than the sharp abrupt turn to the right. > > > >remedy? > > > > Couple of questions- first, everybody is assuming you're running a VW; > answers could differ based on the engine (and engine size) you've got > this on. Second, have you talked to Ellison? You're running their > preferred setup for getting best vaporization, I think, but they may > have some info based on the symptoms. I don't know that it would be > liquid droplets or incomplete vaporization- kinda unlikely. What is the > manifold made of? Last question- is there any way to rotate the Ellison > on its mounting plate, either 90 or 180 degrees? I assume not, since > the throttle linkage setup governs, but that would allow you to test > your hypothesis about the uneven flow from the orifices in the unit. If > you rotated it and the other side became the lean or rich or hot side, > you'd have your culprit. Nah, too easy. > > Oscar Zuniga > Medford, Oregon > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:35:16 -0800 From: Ross Subject: KR: [Fwd: KRNET-L] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------98891AF7D8CDC1285E90DF7A Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is a forward from a new KRNETTER... READ ON (I just added 5 new members today... I wonder what the headcount is) At any rate, to send email to krnet, mail to: KRNET-L@teleport.com -- most of us use lowercase, but then a 1 and l look like the same. (one and Ell). -- Ross - --------------98891AF7D8CDC1285E90DF7A Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: TomKR2S@aol.com Received: from mrin79.mail.aol.com (mrin79.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.189]) by smtp3.teleport.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with ESMTP id TAA14391 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 19:31:36 -0800 (PST) From: TomKR2S@aol.com Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin79.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id WAA24134 for rossy@teleport.com; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 22:31:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 22:31:34 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971111222752_-2143427402@mrin79> To: rossy@teleport.com Subject: Re: KRNET-L Hi Ross! Loved your website. I've received several e-mails from KRNET now so I think I'm subsribed. Thanks for your help. How do I send a post to the group? Could you post this for me in the meantime? Hello fellow KR enthusiasts! I saw an ingenious new way to attach the outer wing panels for KR-2 type aircraft. Check out http://www.busprod.com/bbland/mikes.htm. Photo six shows the outer spar nearly touching the center spar section, with the wing attach bolts going through both wing attach fittings, plus the spar itself. In contrast the usual wing attach leaves about and inch or two of space between the spar ends, and short bolts connect each of the blade-type wing attach fittings to the other. This new arrangement has several advantages over the standard design. The first is that the wing attach fittings are far less likely to buckle on the top of the spar since the spar will support any side loads such as drag would cause. The bolts themselves are also held in alignment as they go through the thick spar. The second is that only four bolts are required to secure the wing panel to the center section, thus making assembly easier. The third is that the cutouts in the wing attach area need only be half the size normally needed, and the spar covers part of the usual hole. The downside would be that using stock spars material length, the wingspan would be 2-3" shorter. If building the KR-2S version, this difference could easily be made up at the wingtip where the 12" all foam/glass wingtips are built up. One interesting comment made on the KRNet is that there are many modifications made to KR-2's that probably would have been made by Ken Rand over the past 14 years had he not died after creating the KR-2 design. - -Tom in Orlando - --------------98891AF7D8CDC1285E90DF7A-- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:37:30 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Elevator Trailing Edge Question Say... this is a good idea! But FLOX may be tougher. I think at the pointy end of the trailing edge, you might have trouble with delamination, and you can't get the glass to go around a sharp edge. (There was some discussion that you don't really want knife edges on trailing edges... but I digress). You might have great luck glassing one side with the balsa, removing it and floxing later, or dremeling out the end etc... -- Ross JEHayward@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 97-11-11 15:27:16 EST, you write: > > << I had LOTS of problems with the trailing edge. I ended up > building up a large blob with FLOX, then sanding it to shape. > There was one tip here to use a mylar strip over a streight piece > of metal/wood to get a true trailing edge, that sounded like a > good idea. >> > > I was wondering if anyone had tried using a triangular piece of balsa wood > and covering that with fiberglass and fairing it into the wing. > > Jim Hayward ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:42:02 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Newsletter, woodworking tips Mike, I'm not the official keeper of KRONLINE (it's unofficially Randys title -- you reading this bud?). At any rate I suggest that folks make submissions to BOTH sources, it's one email and one snailmail. That way EVERYONE in the KR world gets the information, and that's the whole point. I was going to send him KRONLINES at one point along with my subscription check and an article, but never got around to it, I'm too busy emailing! I will try to do somthing for Monte before the end of the year. Where would I have been without Monte's KR_KART! (BTW I have a KR_KART.htm webpage from the old KR Quarterly Thanks to Steve of Great Plains who OK'd us reprinting material from his stewardship of the newsletter.) -- Regards Ross MikeTnyc@aol.com wrote: > > Courtesy of my office, which has finally hooked up to Netscape, I was finally > able to download and print the old KROnline newsletters last night (except > December, which apparently doesn't exist anymore?) and I must say I was > tremendously impressed. It's too bad they're so time-consuming to produce > and somewhat difficult to obtain with low-end equipment. Even if no more are > done, I'm glad I have these -- has anyone considered sending a copy to Monte > Miller for inclusion in the KR Newsletter? He recently said he was having > trouble getting enough good submissions. > > Although I'm not building a plane right now, I've recently been doing > woodworking around my house (a fixer-upper) and hit on two woodworking tips > that some people may not have thought of. Both are for handsaws and use > hot-melt glue: > > 1. Quick & Dirty Scarfing: Take the two pieces you want to scarf and glue > them together in a lap joint with hot-melt glue. Then clamp the stock in a > vise and saw through the lap joint at a suitable angle with a thin saw. Now > you can get the hot-melt glue off with a hair-dryer and glue the > newly-scarfed diagonal (which never got any hot-melt on it, so it's all set > for the real glue). Since the two pieces are cut together, lack of > perfection in cutting will cancel out to some extent. (You can also choose > to use the hair-dryer after the joint is done, keeping the extra wood to aid > in clamping. Be warned that you'll have to clean the hot-melt off the saw > afterwards. > > 2. Cutting round stock evenly: It is difficult to know where to start cuts > on each side so they'll meet in the middle. Glue the stock to the workbench > or a smooth table with hot-melt glue. Now run a right triangle, scraper > blade, etc., down both sides, keeping it perpendicular to the table. This > will give you marks on both sides 180 degrees apart for starting the cuts, > and the glue (unlike clamps) will not get in the way. > > Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:44:30 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Layups and AS&S flub up! Mike, Make your wings... and hate everything about glass planes. I'm thinking that clecos and rivits will be in store for me when I build my all metal Defiant or Boomerang. But I have to finish this one first... :) -- Ross Micheal Mims wrote: > > Sports fans, well after what seems like weeks of adding foam to the bottom > of the wing stubs (have I ever mentioned how much I hate urethane foam?) I > was finally glad to glass the bottom of the right stub! Looks pretty darn > good too! I finished up with the very last batch of a Aeropoxy gallon kit > and decided I would apply a little glass to another area of the plane. > After preparation I started to mix up a small batch of Aeropoxy from a new > kit. Well,...it seems that some dilrod at AS&S decided to tape quart size > cans of resin to gallon size cans of resin to make up a kit. Something > wrong with that picture though,.....NO HARDNER!! ARGH! Well things could > have been much worse I guess, like I could have been in the middle of the > stub wing layup and discovered the most heinous error! Well this will delay > the trip to the airport by a week because I cant get to AS&S till Friday to > exchange it. Oh well the wife is going out of town Friday for several days > so that will give me plenty of uninterrupted garage time this weekend and > next week after work. Anyway if you recently were shipped Aeropoxy from > AS&S you may want to check it and make sure you have hardner AND resin. > > Mike "I hate urethane foam with a passion" Mims > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Micheal Mims > Just Plane Nutts in Irvine Ca. > mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net > http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:49:47 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Prop question Oscar Zuniga wrote: > > Hi, Netters > > There was a post a while back from somebody who is building a database > on props used on KRs, but I can't find it. There is a very good article in this months Kitplanes or Sport Aviation (I don't know which sorry) about Propeller equations using a disk model. I think it is pretty cool. Also don't let your tips go supersonic, it makes noisey... and also, I saw a prop where the tips were delaminating, and the thought was that supersonic vibration might have been the cause... Oh and BTW, here is that cool propellor post again > > I jotted a few sizes down - mostly krs. > > 2100 Revmaster 68HP 52x52 Sterba Bobby Muse says 50x52 better > 2400 type 4 54x56 Sterba > 56x39 Warnke for slow planes: kitfox-WW1 Replica > 1835 52x46 Props Inc Kr cruise > 1.8 TBI Soob 52x59 Prince p-tip 1.85:1 redrive > 80HP Limbach 53x52 Warnke 3300 rpm Kr2 > 2180 54x48 Sterba Sonerai > 1800 52x45 Gt American Prop Kr1 > 2100 Revmaster 52x50 Sterba > 2600 type 4 54x60 Sterba Boughman's Kr2 > Revmaster 56x45 Cowley J Marstall > Turbo (41inHg) 52x48 Aymar-Demuth 4000 rpm Parley Byington > > Not enough to make a scatter plot useful to you...yet! > > Regards > > brian whatcott > Altus OK > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:52:01 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges Micheal Mims wrote: > I speak from experience, trailing edges are NOT hard if done right! Ouch... I must have done mine really WRONG as they were HARD for me. (This however was 2 years before KRNET) :) - -- Ross ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:54:52 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Trailing edge glassing. Ohhh, I like the gutter idea. I even met a local Gutter guy at breakfast one morning, he said that I could come over and use his metal shop anytime... turns out he saw me studying for my PP check ride, and we started talking about flying. From this I gather that all gutter folks are good people. But we have a lot of gutter people here in Oregon, if you live in Arizona you have to explain what a gutter is first, then find one. -- Ross KR2616TJ@aol.com wrote: > > This is somewhat different than the reinforceing of the edge itself. To > allieviate the problem of having the glass itself not wrapping itself around > a sharp edge I ended up using gutter material. Get with your local > continuous gutter man, he will have lots of four to five foot pieces of junk > he will give you or sell you for next to nothing. Wax the white side and > bend it on a break. You can then add any amount of additional angle you > need. Place this material over the sharp edge (ie. trailing edge of rudder, > elevator or wing) with peel ply between. It works great and you don't have > to make wood buildups using duct tape. The resin will not stick to the > material and it can be reused. > > Dana Overall, Richmond KY > http://members.iclub.org/kr2616tj/ still under construction ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:59:49 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Homemade propellers I thought about it... but decided to check out the Props Inc guy 40 miles from my house at the Oregon Coast. He does a nice job, and for $295, I didn't have do do any cutting. But looking at his shop it looked pretty easy. I think I would have to toss a few blanks before I figured out what I was doing. I don't think you would be wasting your money but I would stop at about $30.00 (which should cover the investigation fee.) - -- Ross EagleGator@aol.com wrote: > > Does anyone know anything about the ads in Sport Aviation and Kitplanes for > plans to make your own props? The prices are low, but I don't want to waste > my money, either. > > Cheers! > Rick Junkin > EagleGator@aol.com > St. Charles MO ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 23:54:08 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges At 11:52 PM 11/12/97 -0800, you wrote: >Micheal Mims wrote: > >> I speak from experience, trailing edges are NOT hard if done right! > >Ouch... I must have done mine really WRONG as they were HARD for me. >(This however was 2 years before KRNET) >:) > How did you get this far without us? :o) Well the first three Dragonfly rudders taught me a lot (but not how to spell)! I got some formal instruction from a veteran LongEZ builder after my first three gross attempts! :o) He got me squared away! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine Ca. mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 00:04:30 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: Resin post curing process Robert Maniss wrote: > > In Ron Alexander's article (Composite Construction - Part II in the > November "Sport Aviation") he has a couple of paragraphs about the > importance of post curing the resin. How are the rest of you handling > that and what are your suggestions? I think if I really wanted a RED KR-2, I would worry about post curing. I originally lived in Arizona, and thought one day in the hangar would do the trick. I did place some black garbage bags over the wings one sunny day, but that was more for UV protection than post cure. I haven't seen too much emphasis placed on the topic for moldless construction previously, so I am not worrying too much about it. > Have ordered the book "The Basics of Fiberglass" from AS & S but haven't > received it yet. Any suggestions for other reading? I really > appreciated the demo at Perry by you, Mike, and (Rick?). There is a great book "Composite Aircraft Construction Techniques" that was originally a tutorial for Long-Eze builders. ACS sells it, I don't have more details as I loaned mine out to a fellow EAA member, who promises to return it at every chapter meeting. > (If a stealth bomber crashes in a forest, will it make a sound?) Yes, but you won't be able to see the tree it hit. -- Ross ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 00:06:17 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: KR2 for sale RAH -> rec.aviation.homebuilt I don't spend much time there as KRNET is enough email for me. - -- Ross hjfine@wave.net wrote: > > At 02:03 PM 10/25/97 -0500, you wrote: > >WHAT IS R A H ? I'm interested!!! > > > >Rich McCall > >1518 Holly Lane > >Junction City, KS 66441 > > > >Patrick Flowers wrote: > > > >> This popped up on r.a.h this morning: > >> > >> > For Sale KR2 N76KB 175 Hours TT. Hapi 1835 Slick Mag. Elt, some instru. > >> > Deihl gear conversion. Needs work, wing and canopy damage. Built in 1978. > >> > $3000 OBO contact: Harold Shoemaker via E-Mail or 319-396-3651. > >> > >> -- > >> Patrick Flowers > >> Mailto:patri63@ibm.net > > > >If this is still for sale, please let me know. Thanks. Hank > > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 00:08:25 -0800 From: Ross Subject: Re: KR: trailing edges A Long-Eze builder assistant! Ahh... I moved away from mine before I started the heavy glassing work. Micheal Mims wrote: > > At 11:52 PM 11/12/97 -0800, you wrote: > >Micheal Mims wrote: > > > >> I speak from experience, trailing edges are NOT hard if done right! > > > >Ouch... I must have done mine really WRONG as they were HARD for me. > >(This however was 2 years before KRNET) > >:) > > > > How did you get this far without us? :o) Well the first three Dragonfly > rudders taught me a lot (but not how to spell)! I got some formal > instruction from a veteran LongEZ builder after my first three gross > attempts! :o) He got me squared away! > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Micheal Mims > Just Plane Nutts in Irvine Ca. > mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net > http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:51:30 -0700 From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: Elevator Trailing Edge Question Will add a bit..hopefully on the right subject. With the EZ planes, the initial layup at the trailing edge is done OVER a 1' strip of peel ply (which runs parallel and adjacent to the trailing edge). When the second layup (opposite side) is done, you first remove the peel ply, then layup the glass onto it. A key missing point is that the second side has to DIP towards the first side glass so that they meet for that full 1". The countour is returned to normal with micro. The actual REQUIRED bonding distance is perhaps only 0.5" but I can't state that with certainty. 1" is probably slight overkill. If you have at least two layers of BID on each layup, the trailing edge is four thick. That can be sanded to a nice square edge or whatever is approved for the KR. Ron Lee ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:11:49 -0500 (EST) From: EagleGator@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Boeing Buzz Job (was N415RJ) In a message dated 97-11-12 22:50:56 EST, you write: << Rick, Did you hear about the Boeing test flight of a 737 in AvWeb? Seems they buzzed haystack rock off the coast of Oregon at about 250AGL. Haystack rock is a big rock on most of the Oregon postcards. Boeing says they are aware of the problem, and that there were "other" problems with this flight. Wish I could have been there to see it. -- Ross >> Yeah, I laughed when I read that. If any of y'all have an interest in flight test of heavy aircraft, I hear they have several vacancies in the test department in Seattle...... Just kidding! Actually I haven't heard what the deal was with that incident, believe it or not there may have been a very good reason for the low altitude flight (aircraft emergency, engine probelm, etc.) that we aren't privy to.... and yes, I'm giving those guys a HUGE benifit of the doubt on this one. I'll ask around at work, and as Paul Harvey says, give you the REST of the story. Cheers! Rick ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:06:15 -0500 From: Robert Moreland Subject: Re: KR: Homemade propellers I sent Garth Hess a few dollars for his report on carving propellers. He supplied a nice little type written report giving step by step instructions for carving propellers for the KR and similar planes. His method is adapted for using hand tools and is a little crude for my taste but it will get the job done with the necessary precission. He givs complete tables for various pitch and lengths. His method produces the "almost constant speed' type of propeller; under load it flexes to reduce the angle of attack. He writes a nice little report and I can assure you that he ain't getten rich off it. Robert Moreland ranlan@worldnet.aat.net EagleGator@aol.com wrote: > > Does anyone know anything about the ads in Sport Aviation and Kitplanes for > plans to make your own props? The prices are low, but I don't want to waste > my money, either. > > Cheers! > Rick Junkin > EagleGator@aol.com > St. Charles MO ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:37:04 -0800 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: Prop question Jeffrey E Scott wrote: > >Jeff, did you mention that you were turning 60"? I think I saw some 60"> > >props listed, but nothing bigger. > > > >Thanks > > > >Oscar Zuniga > > Yep, 60x66, but don't assume that most KR's can turn that diameter. > little too much tail up, then give yourself about another 6 inches for > gear flex and you should be in good shape. > ------- > Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM > jscott.pilot@juno.com > See N1213W construction and first flight at > http://fly.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: > //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm For what little it is worth, I have a vague memory that certificated planes require a 9 inch ground clearance from the prop. - -- Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:38:36 -0800 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: Resin post curing process Robert Maniss wrote: > > In Ron Alexander's article (Composite Construction - Part II in the > November "Sport Aviation") he has a couple of paragraphs about the > importance of post curing the resin. How are the rest of you handling > that and what are your suggestions? > Bob > Maniss Wrap everthing in black plastic and leave it in the sun. - -- Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:49:21 -0600 (CST) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: Re: KR: Boeing Buzz Job (was N415RJ) At least it wasn't a "Gold Cup Roll" ;-) Steve newtech@newtech.com On Thu, 13 Nov 1997 EagleGator@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 97-11-12 22:50:56 EST, you write: > > << Rick, > Did you hear about the Boeing test flight of a 737 in AvWeb? > > Seems they buzzed haystack rock off the coast of Oregon at about > 250AGL. Haystack rock is a big rock on most of the Oregon postcards. > Boeing says they are aware of the problem, and that there were "other" > problems with this flight. Wish I could have been there to see it. > > -- Ross >> > > > Yeah, I laughed when I read that. If any of y'all have an interest in flight > test of heavy aircraft, I hear they have several vacancies in the test > department in Seattle...... Just kidding! > > Actually I haven't heard what the deal was with that incident, believe it or > not there may have been a very good reason for the low altitude flight > (aircraft emergency, engine probelm, etc.) that we aren't privy to.... and > yes, I'm giving those guys a HUGE benifit of the doubt on this one. I'll ask > around at work, and as Paul Harvey says, give you the REST of the story. > > Cheers! > Rick > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 09:59:45 -0600 From: pierce@pat.lgb.cal.boeing.com (Cole Pierce) Subject: Re: KR: Homemade propellers : I found two small books on the subject that give enough : information to build a prop. One is "Propeller Making" by : : Eric Clutton : 913 Cedar Lane : Tullshome, TN. 37388 Would that be 'Tullahoma' Tennessee?? - -gun one ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:28:48 -0800 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Prop question At 08:37 AM 11/13/97 -0800, you wrote: For what little it is worth, I have a vague memory that certificated planes >require a 9 inch ground clearance from the prop. Don't forget to allow a little for a flat tire, especially the one on the nose for the nose draggers. ____________________________ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Micheal Mims Just Plane Nutts in Irvine CA http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 12:40:54 -0500 From: smithr Subject: Re: KR: Resin post curing process Donald Reid wrote: > > Robert Maniss wrote: > > > > In Ron Alexander's article (Composite Construction - Part II in the > > November "Sport Aviation") he has a couple of paragraphs about the > > importance of post curing the resin. How are the rest of you handling > > that and what are your suggestions? > > Bob > > Maniss > > Wrap everthing in black plastic and leave it in the sun. > -- > Don Reid > mailto:donreid@erols.com > http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm Can this be done a year or 2 later? Isn't there a chance for joint damage doing this? Bob Smith ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 12:45:39 -0800 From: Ross Youngblood Subject: KR: Archives Attached is a list of all the KRNET-L digests currently available from teleport. (I have more but they are not online) (Instructions on how to get these are below) .: total 8528 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20425 May 21 18:44 v01.n020.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 21330 May 24 09:05 v01.n021.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 21124 May 25 19:01 v01.n022.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20095 May 29 15:52 v01.n024.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19785 May 30 23:41 v01.n025.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19920 May 31 20:17 v01.n026.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20214 Jun 1 16:18 v01.n027.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20571 Jun 2 06:51 v01.n028.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19906 Jun 2 21:11 v01.n029.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20882 Jun 3 17:51 v01.n030.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20415 Jun 4 03:24 v01.n031.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19780 Jun 5 04:40 v01.n032.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19725 Jun 5 22:33 v01.n033.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19732 Jun 6 16:09 v01.n034.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20266 Jun 7 23:03 v01.n035.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 21734 Jun 9 07:48 v01.n036.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20137 Jun 10 12:55 v01.n037.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20107 Jun 11 02:42 v01.n038.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19596 Jun 12 08:19 v01.n039.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20263 Jun 13 18:56 v01.n040.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19591 Jun 14 20:14 v01.n041.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19430 Jun 16 09:51 v01.n042.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 30602 Jun 18 09:01 v01.n043.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20026 Jun 20 12:31 v01.n044.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 21113 Jun 21 10:20 v01.n045.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19949 Jun 22 15:12 v01.n046.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19995 Jun 23 14:20 v01.n047.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20809 Jun 24 11:56 v01.n048.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 20705 Jun 25 06:49 v01.n049.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19423 Jun 25 21:20 v01.n050.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 19984 Jun 27 22:58 v01.n051.Z - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40673 Aug 15 17:58 v01.n075 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40358 Aug 17 21:52 v01.n076 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40169 Aug 18 22:10 v01.n077 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40023 Aug 20 18:02 v01.n078 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 39991 Aug 22 03:59 v01.n079 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40859 Aug 24 07:32 v01.n080 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 1253 Aug 24 07:32 v01.n081 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41301 Aug 27 15:57 v01.n082 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40699 Aug 29 07:16 v01.n083 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41906 Aug 30 06:39 v01.n084 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 3251 Aug 30 06:39 v01.n085 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40191 Sep 1 21:18 v01.n086 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40323 Sep 3 08:57 v01.n087 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40275 Sep 4 05:45 v01.n088 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40758 Sep 5 10:23 v01.n089 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41040 Sep 6 18:47 v01.n090 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41478 Sep 7 18:20 v01.n091 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41011 Sep 8 22:36 v01.n092 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41427 Sep 9 18:25 v01.n093 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41015 Sep 10 20:55 v01.n094 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40138 Sep 12 12:37 v01.n095 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40602 Sep 14 02:39 v01.n096 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41157 Sep 15 23:22 v01.n097 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 39948 Sep 16 21:16 v01.n098 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40880 Sep 18 08:42 v01.n099 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40508 Sep 21 21:19 v01.n100 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41244 Sep 23 04:43 v01.n101 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40511 Sep 23 18:33 v01.n102 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40286 Sep 24 21:54 v01.n103 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40435 Sep 26 16:15 v01.n104 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40073 Sep 27 10:13 v01.n105 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40713 Sep 28 23:24 v01.n106 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40057 Sep 29 17:35 v01.n107 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40575 Sep 30 18:11 v01.n108 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 39993 Oct 1 09:07 v01.n109 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40810 Oct 2 08:17 v01.n110 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40437 Oct 3 18:12 v01.n111 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 42157 Oct 4 13:54 v01.n112 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40450 Oct 4 20:03 v01.n113 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 44850 Oct 5 12:51 v01.n114 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40973 Oct 6 13:41 v01.n115 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40812 Oct 7 00:17 v01.n116 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40511 Oct 7 20:13 v01.n117 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40007 Oct 8 05:54 v01.n118 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40212 Oct 8 18:24 v01.n119 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41772 Oct 8 22:18 v01.n120 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40940 Oct 9 08:49 v01.n121 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40647 Oct 10 09:08 v01.n122 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 39989 Oct 12 13:41 v01.n123 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40120 Oct 12 17:14 v01.n124 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40284 Oct 13 06:01 v01.n125 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 43029 Oct 13 17:15 v01.n126 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40450 Oct 15 04:06 v01.n127 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40245 Oct 15 11:28 v01.n128 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40266 Oct 15 22:11 v01.n129 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40860 Oct 16 11:19 v01.n130 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40027 Oct 17 06:50 v01.n131 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41618 Oct 17 20:51 v01.n132 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41184 Oct 18 20:12 v01.n133 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40850 Oct 19 14:42 v01.n134 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 43223 Oct 20 09:06 v01.n135 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40489 Oct 20 23:50 v01.n136 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41132 Oct 21 09:05 v01.n137 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40491 Oct 21 17:39 v01.n138 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40527 Oct 22 09:38 v01.n139 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40338 Oct 22 20:38 v01.n140 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40098 Oct 22 23:27 v01.n141 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40086 Oct 23 13:23 v01.n142 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41291 Oct 24 07:27 v01.n143 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40530 Oct 24 20:47 v01.n144 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41583 Oct 25 09:47 v01.n145 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40781 Oct 25 19:05 v01.n146 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40068 Oct 26 12:08 v01.n147 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40162 Oct 27 08:26 v01.n148 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 39977 Oct 28 13:44 v01.n149 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41439 Oct 29 07:52 v01.n150 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40832 Oct 29 23:07 v01.n151 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41003 Oct 30 01:10 v01.n152 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40466 Oct 30 14:14 v01.n153 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 41093 Oct 30 20:58 v01.n154 - -rw-rw---- 1 krnet majordom 40323 Oct 31 23:42 v01.n155 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 40028 Nov 2 06:58 v01.n156 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 41487 Nov 3 11:42 v01.n157 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 41230 Nov 4 05:59 v01.n158 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 40589 Nov 5 06:00 v01.n159 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 7404 Nov 6 08:08 v01.n160 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 40568 Nov 7 05:56 v01.n161 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 41438 Nov 8 17:15 v01.n162 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 40149 Nov 10 05:20 v01.n163 - -rw-rw---- 1 daemon majordom 40381 Nov 10 20:48 v01.n164 You can get this list mailed to YOU by sending an email to (our friend) mailto:majordomo@teleport.com Subject: Major Domo Don't Care Body Text: index krnet-l end This will send you the list below.... to get one of the items mailed to you... send: get krnet-l vxx.nyy as the body text. - -- Regards Ross Youngblood KRNET-Admin krnet@krnet.org ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V1 #167 *****************************