From: owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 20, 1998 6:16 PM To: krnet-l-digest@teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V2 #83 krnet-l-digest Wednesday, May 20 1998 Volume 02 : Number 083 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 14:34:44 -0400 From: smithr Subject: KR: flutter With no reports whatsoever (to my limited knowledge) of a KR going into elevator flutter, why is it that everyone seems so concerned with the problem that they add balance weight? I assume the answer is that everyone wants to push the speed envelope and just might get to the point where it might flutter. Isn't there enough evidence that the extra balance weight isn't needed? Where's the line between cautious and paranoid? Comments anyone? Bob Smith ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 14:38:57 -0400 From: smithr Subject: Re: KR: Columbia, TN Gathering KR2 616TJ wrote: > OK, guys like Mark said, our East Coast Gathering will be held this year at > Maury Co. Airport (MRC) in Columbia, TN, Saturday July 25th. Since when is Western Tennessee considered to be on the East Coast?? Come on guys, if you're going to have this meeting at least call it the "mid continent meeting" or something like that. I stopped coming to the KR meeting because its just too far away (translate that into too expensive and I need to buy KR parts) Bob Smith ..... On the real east coast in New York ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 11:46:07 -0800 From: Robert Covington Subject: KR: Re:flutter >With no reports whatsoever (to my limited knowledge) of a KR going into >elevator flutter, why is it that everyone seems so concerned with the >problem that they add balance weight? I assume the answer is that >everyone wants to push the speed envelope and just might get to the >point where it might flutter. Isn't there enough evidence that the >extra balance weight isn't needed? Where's the line between cautious >and paranoid? Comments anyone? > >Bob Smith Hi Bob. There was a report of a guy in a newsletter who got into an inadvertant snaproll or something else he didn't intend while doing aerobatics, and in the resulting dive, he may have experienced some flutter. He claimed that having 4 hinges instead of the normal 3 probably kept the elevator on. Jeannette Rand told me to balance the ailerons for sure as the plans indicate, and the elevator if you plan on getting anywhere near 200 mph. Hope this helps some. From what I have gathered, for normal flight a KR's elevator does not need balancing, but all planes turn out different, so each case is different. Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:01:46 EDT From: KR2 616TJ Subject: Re: KR: Wings are at the wind tunnel, it is in Ashok's hands now In a message dated 98-05-19 12:29:10 EDT, you write: << I have also talked to Dana Overall about setting up a formal set of books for research projects like this. He is researching possible incorporation as a LLC or LL Partnership. I just think that there souuld be some accountability for the contributions. Also incorporation as a non-profit group may lead to being able to deduct contributions. >> Before anyone starts deducting the NLF contributions on their tax returns.........Don't, it will not be a charitable organization but if it comes about, there simply will not be any tax liability on any left over proceeds of the research and developement. Nice try Steve :-)) Dana Overall Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 16:07:14 -0700 From: Darrin West Subject: Re: KR: Columbia, TN Gathering KR2 616TJ wrote: > > OK, guys like Mark said, our East Coast Gathering will be held this year at > Maury Co. Airport (MRC) in Columbia, TN, Saturday July 25th. If you are > planning on attending please let Mark Landford, or myself know so that we can > have somewhat of a head count. Thanks for all the responses, I heard from > numerous people off the KRNet. We were obviously unable to accommodate > everyones wishes for the location but I hope you will understand the thought > process. We want to make this a fun flying Saturday and not just a bunch of > builders (like me) and be able to provide hotel space for those who want to > make a weekend of it (I plan on this). We have three people, Troy, Mark and > myself in three different states trying to put this thing together on somewhat > of a short notice so we needed an airport we were familiar with, close to a > major airport for commercial travel, one that was within easy flying distance > of 12 or 15, or more, states and one that had a KR on the field belonging to > someone who would be willing to lend a hand. We know what we have at > Columbia. The FBO was disappointed when we moved the gathering before. Also > we needed a weekend somewhere that nothing else was going on, the airshow was > a nice idea but be want to see KRs flying. If your KR is flying and you can > make it there, come on down (or up). I doubt mine will be finished by then, > but I'll keep at it. Quick reference, Columbia, TN is about 30 nm, by air, > south of Nashville with a 6000 ft. runway, away from everything, great airport > and hopefully will have several flying KRs for all you guys who "need a ride". > Hope you understand our reasoning here guys, and hope to see everyone there. > Again let us know if you are interested...........and pass the word. > > Dana Overall > Richmond, KY > mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ Hey Tom C., Whats the chance of me paying for some fuel for a ride to Tenn.? Darrin West KR-1 dwest@rose.net ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:23:33 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: DIY skins Bob Smith wrote: > Whats this inner skin routine? Have I missed something? > Mark, do you have this > routine written down somewhere? > Bob, I was referring (as was Patrick) to the method of creating both an inner and outer skin by making an offset template, glueing in foam, and sanding down the inside of the surface FIRST. Then fastening the part in place where it will eventually live, and sand and glass the OUTSIDE. You can get any thickness you like this way, assure a continuous foam inner layer with no cracks, and because the inner skin is there, the top outside doesn't deflect when you sand it and create high spots. The resulting surface is similar to a wing skin (but not vacuum bagged or oven cured) but you can do this at home. And the parts that you create fit perfectly every time. It's detailed on my web page at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kmarkl.html under "New tankless forward deck". And it is a great way to ensure that your airfoils are accurate. I figure the weight increase of the inner layer of glass is almost offset by the loss of excess foam, but your surface is many times stronger than the RR method. And you end up with more room inside for wingtanks, aileron bellcranks, etc. It looks like a pain, but it goes amazingly fast. I've tried just about every other method (including hot-wiring) and this is where I've settled. Of course, I DO have 1500 hours in it so far and am only half way through, so that may tell you something... Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kr2s.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 15:38:25 -0500 From: "Dean R. Collette, MD" Subject: KR: Gluing Foam Netters, Does anyone have a favorite glue to use when attaching urethane to wood or foam to foam? Do certain adhesives work better than others? Micro or not to add micro, (that is the question?) I would appreciate any info on the subject. Thanks, Dean mailto:drdean@execpc.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 16:24:32 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: RE: Gluing Foam Dr. Dean wrote: > Does anyone have a favorite glue to use when attaching > urethane to wood or > foam to foam? Do certain adhesives work better than others? Dean, I talked to Troy Petteway last night and he is swearing by something he bought called "Gorilla Glue". He also said that he'd seen it yesterday at Ace Hardware called Polyurethane Glue, but it's the same stuff. I'm headed to Home Depot to see if they have it. He says it sand exactly like 2 lb urethane foam. I'll let you know... Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 18:09:52 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: FW: subscribing to krnet This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BD8351.51AB1C80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Richard Parker [mailto:theparkers@monad.net] Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 5:33 PM To: Mark Langford; Austin Clark Subject: subscribing to krnet well I've done it now. In my effort to shift all my krnet e-mail to a hotmail account I've lost access all together. I un*ubscribed from my regular account, su*scribed through the hotmail account, sent back the "auth" code etc. and got confirmation, and have received nothing. went back to my regular account did it all again and nothing. I've done these mailing lists before with no problems. Could you please forward this to the net for me. I cant remember who administrates the list. maybe its this new MS Explorer software? Rich Parker Jaffrey, NH theparkers@monad.net http://top.monad.net/~theparkers/kr.htm __I__ ______( X )_______ o/ \o - ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BD8351.51AB1C80 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
 

From: Richard Parker [mailto:theparkers@monad.net]=20
Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 5:33 PM
To: Mark = Langford;=20 Austin Clark
Subject: subscribing to = krnet

well I've done it now.
 
In my effort to shift all my krnet = e-mail to a=20 hotmail account I've lost access all together. I un*ubscribed from my = regular=20 account, su*scribed through the hotmail account, sent back the = "auth"=20 code etc. and got confirmation, and have received nothing.  went = back to my=20 regular account did it all again and nothing.  I've done these = mailing=20 lists before with no problems. Could you please forward this to the net = for me.=20 I cant remember who administrates the list.
 
maybe its this new MS Explorer software? =
 
 
Rich Parker
Jaffrey, NH
theparkers@monad.net
http://top.monad.net/~th= eparkers/kr.htm
        &n= bsp;=20 __I__
______( X = )_______
        =20 o/     \o
 

 
- ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01BD8351.51AB1C80-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:37:49 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: Columbia, TN Gathering At 08:59 AM 5/19/98 EDT, you wrote: >OK, guys like Mark said, our East Coast Gathering will be held this year at >Maury Co. Airport (MRC) in Columbia, TN, Saturday July 25th. YEA!!!!! Someone made a decision. This does not preclude other folks from setting up regional fly-ins to get more people involved. There could easily be six or more regional fly-ins each year but poeple have to make the commitment to do the work. Ron Lee ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:48:37 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: Progress update Tom, Everything I have seen about Urethane and hot-wiring STRONGLY suggest that you NOT do it. Poisonous gases are not good. PLease reconsider. Either SAND urethane or HOTWIRE the hotwireable kind (polystyrene?). Ron Lee >I made a hot wire bow from a piece of nichrome wire and some wood blocks. I've >cut the wing cores for the 1/4 scale model, and I am definitely going to cut the >stabilizer cores and the stub wings using this technique. I used polystyrene >foam, but am thinking of hotwiring the urethane foam by doing it outdoors. >See you all in Tennessee! >-Tom in Orlando > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 20:30:45 EDT From: KR2 616TJ Subject: KR: Fwd: Columbia This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --part0_895624246_boundary Content-ID: <0_895624246@inet_out.mail.aol.com.1> Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII In a message dated 98-05-19 18:26:03 EDT, jfaughn@mo.net writes: << At this time, I am open on July 25th and will plan to fly down. It's a great flight for me and I enjoyed the airport and company. -- Jim Faughn N8931JF St. Louis, MO >> Guys, I thought I would forward this. If you don't know Jim, his is the beautiful light blue KR in Video Bob's Gathering Video last year. If you haven't seen this man land a KR, it's worth the trip to Columbia to witness. How's that for pressure :-)). Tom, don't hot wire u-foam. We want to see you in Columbia, not just remember you from Sun & Fun. Dana Overall Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ - --part0_895624246_boundary Content-ID: <0_895624246@inet_out.mail.aol.com.2> Content-type: message/rfc822 Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Content-disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from rly-za02.mx.aol.com (rly-za02.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.98]) by air-za02.mail.aol.com (v43.15) with SMTP; Tue, 19 May 1998 18:26:03 -0400 Received: from mvp.net (Walden.mo.Net [209.96.2.52]) by rly-za02.mx.aol.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id SAA04584 for ; Tue, 19 May 1998 18:26:02 -0400 (EDT) Received: from mo.net (DialIP2-162.mvp.net [209.96.12.162]) by mvp.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA24371 for ; Tue, 19 May 1998 17:37:40 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <356207F1.AF3AC042@mo.net> Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 17:30:09 -0500 From: Jim Faughn X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) To: kr2616tj@aol.com Subject: Columbia Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit For some reason my responses don't always get posted to the net. Probably because I'm doing something wrong and subscribed to the digest. At this time, I am open on July 25th and will plan to fly down. It's a great flight for me and I enjoyed the airport and company. - -- Jim Faughn N8931JF St. Louis, MO (314) 652-7659 or (573) 465-8039 - --part0_895624246_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:03:14 -0500 From: "Dean R. Collette, MD" Subject: KR: Ground School Netters, A friend of mine asked me a question that I can't find the answer to. I hope someone here can. He wants to learn to fly, but the cost is a major factor. He said he read somewhere that a "home study course" such as the King tapes or any of the other "packaged" flight training courses are sufficient for the FAA, as long as you pass the exam. I'm not so sure about this. It seems to me that I needed a signature before I could take the Test. I understand why he's asking - The ground school at the local airport is in the $1000.00 range for books and the instructor's time and that doesn't buy an hour in the air. The King tapes are something like $169.00. If anyone knows more about this I love to hear it. Thanks Dean mailto:drdean@execpc.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 19:09:54 -0800 From: Robert Covington Subject: Re: KR: Ground School The ground school at the local airport is in >the $1000.00 range for books and the instructor's time and that doesn't buy >an hour in the air. The King tapes are something like $169.00. > >If anyone knows more about this I love to hear it. > >Thanks >Dean They do need a sign-off from either a ground instructor or CFI as far as I know, but I don't know who charges that much for ground school! That's nuts. The course here at my local airport, Cable, is around $100 (hundred) even or might be $125 now not including books, about an additional $80. Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:17:32 EDT From: HAshraf Subject: Re: KR: flutter That's because we are all planning a 200 mph cruise. Atleast I am. At these speeds, flutter can be a problem. Haris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:14:13 EDT From: HAshraf Subject: Re: KR: Progress update Its cynide. make sure you wear a gas mask. Haris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:28:55 -0500 From: "Dean R. Collette, MD" Subject: KR: Hot Wire and Urethane Tom, I am sure that all of the responses that you have gotten so far on the topic of hot wiring urethane foam have probably convinced you not to do it. Here is why; When urethane is heated to the point of burning (cutting) it gives off hydrogen cyanide. This has a characteristic odor of "bitter almonds," however, about 2 out of 5 people cannot smell it. Toxic amounts are readily absorbed through the tissues of your airways and lungs. In concentrations of 0.2mg / liter of air it is fatal. I did a few rough calculations and found that if you cut a 6" path, 1/16" wide and the wire is 7' about 50mg of cyanide is released (assuming I remember my chemistry.) In other words one gust of wind blowing the wrong way and you have yourself a major problem. According to the books symptoms start with heart palpitations, then you get nauseated and puke a few times. Confusion sets in and your heart rhythm goes out of whack. Then coma and death. This whole process is dose dependent but can happen in as little as 5 minutes. That's why they used to use it in the gas chamber. I hate to be so graphic but it illustrates the point. Dean mailto:drdean@execpc.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:20:43 EDT From: HAshraf Subject: Re: KR: RE: Gluing Foam How about using opne part expanable foam. Its Urethane and sticjs to everything Haris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:25:09 EDT From: HAshraf Subject: KR: Nomex Sandwich Today I was at RR during and among other thing I saw a nomex honeycomb sandwich. It was about 0.25 thick. Does any one know a source for it? Haris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:27:47 EDT From: HAshraf Subject: KR: Travelling Newsletter I got the newsletter (west coast). Will copy it tonight and will be able to mail it in the next few days. Haris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 19:32:30 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Ground School At 07:09 PM 5/19/98 -0800, you wrote: >They do need a sign-off from either a ground instructor or CFI as far as I >know, but I don't know who charges that much for ground school! That's nuts. > >The course here at my local airport, Cable, is around $100 (hundred) even >or might be $125 now not including books, about an additional $80. > King can sign you off to take the test if you cant find anyone else to do it. $1000 for ground school is insane, I wish I could line up a student or two a week, hell I would start teaching again! Don't let your friend pay that much. Just about any instructor will sign you off for the written. You may have to pass a practice test but its usually free. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 19:35:41 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: flutter At 10:17 PM 5/19/98 EDT, you wrote: >That's because we are all planning a 200 mph cruise. Atleast I am. At these >speeds, flutter can be a problem. > >Haris Well 200 would be nice but I am planning on at least that flat out. So yes I am adding the balance weight to. There are many KRs without the weight and have been flying for years but with the bigger more powerful engines (including the bigger VWs) and better airfoils I think we are gona see bigger numbers on the top end. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 22:47:27 -0400 (EDT) From: jeroffey@tir.com (jeroffey) Subject: KR: Ground school King tape courses come complete with a sign off form. I got the instrument course from them and it put me to sleep. Went to a weekend ground school for the instument written and got a 92. The cost was $225 plus two nights in the hotel. I find it the only way to go for the tests but home study with access to a pilot whos been there is necessary for the private. I am mentoring a student pilot at work right now and his questions are forcing me back to the books. How soon we forget the details. John Roffey jeroff@tir.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:09:57 -0400 From: "Thomas Gatliff" Subject: KR: Re: Ground School Your friend went to a FAR 141 School. This is pretty typical for a school of this type. A ground school of this type offers a structured syllabus in a classroom setting, and generally guarantees your passing of the written test. To make things cheap, which is what most people do, you work under the FAR 161, meaning that you pretty much learn at your own pace without a syllabusand classroom to work under(This is how I my Private/Instrument work). An Instructor, typically the instructor you are going to use for gaining your required hours with, will sign you off when you are ready. If an instructor refuses to do this, which is unheard of, then do not use him.... Good Luck and Have Fun Flying.... Thomas Gatliff gatliff@mindspring.com - -----Original Message----- From: Dean R. Collette, MD To: KRNET Date: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 9:55 PM Subject: KR: Ground School >Netters, > >A friend of mine asked me a question that I can't find the answer to. I hope >someone here can. >He wants to learn to fly, but the cost is a major factor. He said he read >somewhere that a "home study course" such as the King tapes or any of the >other "packaged" flight training courses are sufficient for the FAA, as long >as you pass the exam. I'm not so sure about this. It seems to me that I >needed a signature before I could take the Test. > >I understand why he's asking - The ground school at the local airport is in >the $1000.00 range for books and the instructor's time and that doesn't buy >an hour in the air. The King tapes are something like $169.00. > >If anyone knows more about this I love to hear it. > >Thanks >Dean >mailto:drdean@execpc.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:06:33 -0600 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: Re: KR: Progress update > >Last night I received my wing skins from Dan Diehl. His workmanship is >impeccable, and these skins are going to be real easy to assemble. The >one-hou rinstallation video ended with a few minutes of KR flying, including >five KR's in tight formation.I AM STOKED. I have come so much closer to >completion because of these wings. You don't even >have to turn the fuselage/wing upside down for the assembly. They are >glass-smooth on the surface. In fact, I have to knock off the shine just to paint >them. >See you all in Tennessee! >-Tom in Orlando >Building outer spars. Of course you might want to work over those wing skins with scotch brite or something along those lines to scrub the mold release off from them. Otherwise they don't glue together so well. :o) Enjoy using the Diehl skins. They are nice to work with. - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 23:33:03 EDT From: HAshraf Subject: Re: KR: flutter That is exactly what I meant. If a design has to evolve, higher speeds will happen. Haris Ashraf ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 23:39:46 EDT From: DAN469 Subject: Re: KR: Ground School I was required to have a CFI sign stating that I new the knowledge before being allowed to take the written test. I believe that after taking the king course that the Kings will give you the necessary signoff to take the test. Dan Shervheim, ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:49:14 -0600 From: Bob Bryenton Subject: KR: PLEASE This is the 3rd time I have asked and I am still getting email from the group. Please remove my name from the list. I have tried unsubscribe in the subject and krnet unsubscribe. If this is not how please send me a direct email telling me how! "Follow your dream! Unless it's the one where you're at work in your underwear during a fire drill." Bob Bryenton Project Leader Synapse Publishing 8308 - 114 Street P.O. Box 52146 Edmonton, AB Canada T6G 2T5 Phone: (403) 492 - 7937, (403) 453 - 1799 Fax: (403) 492 - 7253 E-Mail: bob.bryenton@medlib.com > -----Original Message----- > From: DAN469 [mailto:DAN469@aol.com] > Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 9:40 PM > To: krnet-l@teleport.com > Subject: Re: KR: Ground School > > > I was required to have a CFI sign stating that I new the > knowledge before > being allowed to take the written test. I believe that after > taking the king > course that the Kings will give you the necessary signoff to > take the test. > > Dan Shervheim, > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:02:49 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR:Final hinge design There was concern in this discussion about the angle having sharp corners and I know aviation grade aluminum angle is usually rounded but have you guys taken a look at your aluminum kit from RR? The corners are not ROUND! What does this mean? :o) zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 21:47:32 -0700 From: "John F. Esch" Subject: Re: KR: Travelling Newsletter Cool, glad to see you recieved it. John F. Esch HAshraf wrote: > I got the newsletter (west coast). Will copy it tonight and will be > able to > mail it in the next few days. > > Haris ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 23:41:00 -0500 From: "ronald.freiberger" Subject: RE: KR: RE: Gluing Foam I can tell you that's a disaster... the foam pushes layers apart, and it doesn't sand well ( very tough). - -----Original Message----- From: owner-krnet-l@teleport.com [mailto:owner-krnet-l@teleport.com] On Behalf Of HAshraf Sent: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 9:21 PM To: krnet-l@teleport.com Subject: Re: KR: RE: Gluing Foam How about using opne part expanable foam. Its Urethane and sticjs to everything Haris ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 06:11:12 -0700 From: Tom Crawford Subject: Re: KR: Columbia, TN Gathering Darrin West wrote: > > Hey Tom C., > Whats the chance of me paying for some fuel for a ride to Tenn.? > Darrin West > KR-1 > dwest@rose.net I guess that's between you and my wife. She's planning on riding shotgun on that trip. Tom Crawford tomc@afn.org Gainesville, FL N262TC ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 06:42:46 EDT From: Steen8751A Subject: Re: KR: Ground School I did not spend a cent on ground school or videotapes. I bought AIM/FAR and an ASA book with all the test questions and answers. I got my log book endorsed by my CFI that I was prepared to take my written. All worked out great, passed on the first try and had more money for flying. I watched some dated King tapes, a little and found the pace to be very slow and boring. I found the book method to be much more efficient as I could go at my own pace and comcentrate in my areas of weakness. I used this method for private and instrument written exams, passed in 1987 and 1992. Doug Steen Morgantown, PA ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:00:10 -0400 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR: Ground School Dean R. Collette, MD wrote: > He said he read > somewhere that a "home study course" such as the King tapes or any of the > other "packaged" flight training courses are sufficient for the FAA, as long > as you pass the exam. I'm not so sure about this. It seems to me that I > needed a signature before I could take the Test. Before I got my license, I looked at a King video and was not impressed. I got a set of audio tapes. Flight-Tech, 1-800-221-0348. The cost was about the same as the King video material, but there was a lot more. I listened to them on the daily commute to work. They had a practice exam that you could take. You mailed that back to them and then you would receive the written endorcement to take the FAA test. - -- Don Reid Bumpass, Va. mailto:donreid@erols.com KR2XL at http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm Ultralights at http://www.erols.com/donreid/usua250.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:35:43 -0400 From: Patrick Flowers Subject: Re: KR: Travelling Newsletter Where is the east coast version currently? I would like to copy and would be glad to help other Atlanta KRnetters make a copy. Patrick - -- Patrick Flowers Mailto:patri63@ibm.net ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 06:17:34 -0700 From: MARVIN MCCOY Subject: Re: KR: Nomex Sandwich HAshraf wrote: > > Today I was at RR during and among other thing I saw a nomex honeycomb > sandwich. It was about 0.25 thick. Does any one know a source for it? > > Haris - --------------------- Haris: Many glass and epoxy supply houses have nomex. It was expensive the last time I looked. I got a some from the Boeing surplus store here in Seattle some time back. Trouble with Boeing is it is a hit or miss. Sometimes they have great stuff and other times they don't. With out a vacuum bag set up nomex is very difficult to get a good bond with the glass. You need to get good contact with all of the edges of the nomex honeycomb. Without a vacuum bag you get more glue then necessary in some spots and not enough in others. But the stuff sure makes a light weight stiff composite. Marvin McCoy Seattle, WA. North end of Boeing field mr.marvin@worldnet.att.net - ------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:39:18 -0500 (CDT) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: Re: KR: Re:Wings are at the wind tunnel, it is in Ashok's hands now On Tue, 19 May 1998, Robert Covington wrote: > > >Thanks to Randy for the additional funds, it will really help. We > >collected enough through contributions to cover the $1,000 for the wind > >tunnel time and for the three sets of CNC machined airfoil templates. I > >have something around $1,000 of my money invested in the project at this > >point. I can't believe how fast the expenses mounted but there should be > >many positives come from all of this. THe KR and Sport Aviation in > >general should benefit. > > > >I will be posting a complete accounting of the contributions received and > >my major expenses in the project. > > >Steve Eberhart > > > Steve, > > You haven't answered the last two emails I sent you about the funds, and if > it was finally time that you would actually be needing/cashing the checks > (long letter ago that you wrote). I will be getting a check off to you on > Wednesday! > Robert, Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. Any help is greatly appreciated. I will be back in Champaign, IL to help in the setup of the wings in the wind tunnel. Plan on going back to Champaign after Memorial day to witness the tests. Will get pictures and info posted to the wind tunnel web page throughout the project. My mailing address is: Steve Eberhart P.O. Box 9227 Evansville, IN 47724 Steve Eberhart - ------------------------------------- http://www.newtech.com/nlf One test is worth a thousand expert opinions but a thousand opinions are easier to get. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 08:44:48 -0500 (CDT) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: Re: KR: Wings are at the wind tunnel, it is in Ashok's hands now On Tue, 19 May 1998, KR2 616TJ wrote: > In a message dated 98-05-19 12:29:10 EDT, you write: > > << I have also talked to Dana Overall > about setting up a formal set of books for research projects like this. > He is researching possible incorporation as a LLC or LL Partnership. I > just think that there souuld be some accountability for the > contributions. Also incorporation as a non-profit group may lead to > being able to deduct contributions. >> > > Before anyone starts deducting the NLF contributions on their tax > returns.........Don't, it will not be a charitable organization but if it > comes about, there simply will not be any tax liability on any left over > proceeds of the research and developement. > > Nice try Steve :-)) > You are right. I blew it. That is why we need experts looking after all aspects of this project. Thanks for the clarification Dana. Steve Eberhart - ------------------------------------- http://www.newtech.com/nlf One test is worth a thousand expert opinions but a thousand opinions are easier to get. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:44:38 -0400 From: smithr Subject: Re: KR: RE: Gluing Foam I have used a polyurethane glue and find that it leaves a hard ridge when you sand across it and foam. The glue is great and strong, but I find the ridge to be a problem. > Dr. Dean wrote: > > > Does anyone have a favorite glue to use when attaching > > urethane to wood or > > foam to foam? Do certain adhesives work better than others? > > Dean, > > I talked to Troy Petteway last night and he is swearing by something he > bought called "Gorilla Glue". He also said that he'd seen it yesterday at > Ace Hardware called Polyurethane Glue, but it's the same stuff. I'm headed > to Home Depot to see if they have it. He says it sand exactly like 2 lb > urethane foam. I'll let you know... > > Mark Langford > mailto:langford@hiwaay.net > KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 11:02:47 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: Polyurethane glue Bob Smith wrote: > I have used a polyurethane glue and find that it leaves a > hard ridge when you > sand across it and foam. Bob, I went to Home Depot last night and found about 8 completely different products by that name. Only one said that it was "water activated" which makes it puff up like foam, but not as radically as the two part variety (according to Troy). I'll try it tonight and report back... Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 19 May 1998 18:35:29 From: Austin Clark Subject: KR: Control Cables Rick, Ready to crimp some cables? I have the rudder and elevator control cable routing finished. At your convienience, could you come by and help me install them? There is no rush and there is plenty I can do meantime. This time though, I will have some cold ones (beer or soda?) and will grill some burgers for lunch. Thanks, Austin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 17:25:04 -0500 From: "Rick Hanson" Subject: KR: Re: Control Cables Austin: Have been putting in a lot of overtime at work. I will call you tomorrow night and set up a day and time with you. How did the aileron cable work out? Did you install a extra pulley? Rick - ---------- > From: Austin Clark > To: krnet-l@teleport.com > Subject: KR: Control Cables > Date: Tuesday, May 19, 1998 1:35 PM > > Rick, > > Ready to crimp some cables? I have the rudder and elevator control cable > routing finished. At your convienience, could you come by and help me > install them? There is no rush and there is plenty I can do meantime. > This time though, I will have some cold ones (beer or soda?) and will grill > some burgers for lunch. > > Thanks, > > Austin ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 20 May 1998 20:24:44 -0500 From: "Dean R. Collette, MD" Subject: KR: Polyurethane glue Mark, After reading your message last evening regarding the urethane glue I had to run out to Home Depot and try it myself. They didn't have anything called "Gorilla glue." In fact, I got a very strange look from the lady trying to help me when I asked for it. The stuff I wound up with is called Probond. It is a polyurethane glue that refers to itself as "The Ultimate Universal Adhesive." The directions state that you need to wipe everything down with a damp cloth 1 minute before applying the glue. I tried several experimental joints: foam to foam, wood to foam, wood to wood, and filling a "V" shaped slot between foam pieces. Here's what I found: 1. The stuff is not "sticky." It won't hold parts together until it cures. 2. The stuff is much stronger than the 2 lb urethane foam. 3. It does not appear to affect the foam that it contacts. 4. It forms a very strong wood-wood joint (surprisingly.) 5. It fills small gaps. As the glue foams up, it flows where there is space for it to go. 6. It is sandable. Not as easily sanded as the 2 lb. foam. Therefore, it does form a "ridge" when parts are being sanded together across a glue joint, however, this "ridge" is not terribly difficult to work with. The glue can also be easily sanded off of wood. Bottom line: I don't know about "The Ultimate Universal Adhesive" but, I think I am going to give this stuff a try with some foam work on the plane. I'll let you know what I think after I've worked with it a little more. Dean mailto:drdean@execpc.com ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V2 #83 ****************************