From: owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@teleport.com] Sent: Sunday, May 31, 1998 10:40 PM To: krnet-l-digest@teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V2 #88 krnet-l-digest Sunday, May 31 1998 Volume 02 : Number 088 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 15:08:37 -0800 From: Bruce Toscano Subject: Re: KR: wing tip lights/strobes I don't think pma'd strobes is required for an experimental aircraft. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 20:14:29 EDT From: Willard561@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: wing tip lights/strobes If you want a homebuilt strobe project look at Jim Weir's design @ RST- ENGR.com Bill Higdon Willard561@aol.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 01 Mar 1998 19:36:39 -0800 From: george bell Subject: KR: [Fwd: could you post this to the krnet?] This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------E670AF83C8FAF84AB87B2776 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit - --------------E670AF83C8FAF84AB87B2776 Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Mike.Mims@frco.com Received: from mail-gw6.pacbell.net (mail-gw6.pacbell.net [206.13.28.41]) by mail-la1.pacbell.net (8.8.8/8.7.1) with ESMTP id HAA08846 for ; Fri, 29 May 1998 07:25:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Mike.Mims@frco.com Received: from fisherrose-bh.frco.com (fisherrose-bh.frco.com [206.242.150.66]) by mail-gw6.pacbell.net (8.8.8/8.7.1+antispam) with SMTP id HAA18070 for ; Fri, 29 May 1998 07:25:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from uucp@localhost) by fisherrose-bh.frco.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) id JAA27280 for ; Fri, 29 May 1998 09:24:53 -0500 Received: from smtpmail.frco.com by fisherrose-bh.frco.com via smap (3.2) id xmaea6877; Fri, 29 May 98 09:24:30 -0500 Received: from MTNEMX ([155.177.58.64]) by smtpmail.frco.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 0-0U10L2S100) with SMTP id AAA200 for ; Fri, 29 May 1998 09:19:11 -0500 Received: by MTNEMX (Soft-Switch LMS 2.1.0.0) with snapi via CCMAIL id 0056060001569730; Fri, 29 May 1998 09:17:08 -0500 To: " - (052)gpbell(a)pacbell.net" Subject: could you post this to the krnet? Message-ID: <0056060001569730000002L602*@MHS> Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 09:17:08 -0500 George I came across this at work and was wondering if you would post it to the KRnet? I might for get. http://www.ellison-fluid-systems.com/ - --------------E670AF83C8FAF84AB87B2776 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for George P. Bell Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: George P. Bell n: Bell;George P. email;internet: gpbell@pacbell.net x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: FALSE version: 2.1 end: vcard - --------------E670AF83C8FAF84AB87B2776-- ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 19:57:42 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: KR: pitot location Anyone got any comments on pitot location? I was thinking about 12 inches inboard of the wing tip. I plan on using 1/4 inch aluminum tubing that will mount to the main spar and hang down about 4 inches below the wing before facing forward. I wanted to stay away from the fuselage and landing gear so there would be less interference in airflow but I didn't want to get to close to the tip. Would the wing tip cause any weird pressure variations? zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 21:58:43 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: pitot location Personally, I like to hide pitot tubes in imitation machine guns. But you still have the problem of making sure that you get undisturbed air....which is the essence of your question. Ron Lee At 07:57 PM 5/29/98 -0700, you wrote: >Anyone got any comments on pitot location? I was thinking about 12 inches >inboard of the wing tip. I plan on using 1/4 inch aluminum tubing that will >mount to the main spar and hang down about 4 inches below the wing before >facing forward. I wanted to stay away from the fuselage and landing gear so >there would be less interference in airflow but I didn't want to get to >close to the tip. Would the wing tip cause any weird pressure variations? >zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz >Micheal Mims >SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! >mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ >Irvine Ca >Fax 714.856.9417 >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 22:26:33 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: KR: Bahamas trip was fun! Hey guys remember that Bahamas trip I took a little while back? Did you visit the web page? http://home.pacbell.net/mikemims/bahamas.html Did it look like we were having fun? Just how much fun you ask? Well uh,......my wife just failed (or passed,.. however you want to look at it) a pregnancy test! Looks like we may be having a baby. Sorry to waste KRNet band width but I wanted to share this bit of news with the friends I have made here on the net. If you have any congrats or regrets to send,.. :o) Please click here mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net to send them directly to me so we can keep the flow of non KR related traffic to a minimum. Looks like I better get this thing done within 9 months eh? :o) zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 23:02:55 -0600 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: Re: KR: pitot location Mine is located much like you describe only a bit more inboard. I put it about as far out into the wing as I could comfortably reach with the wing off. I used two tubes and mounted the static with the pitot. I think it was the $15 pitot/static tube assy in the A/C Spruce catalogue. The results were satisfactory and the pitot is just far enough under the edge of the wing that I don't catch my leg on it. If I was to do it over again, I would probably mount it a bit farther outboard as I do seem to bang into it sometimes when working on the wheel pants. - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm On Fri, 29 May 1998 19:57:42 -0700 Micheal Mims writes: >Anyone got any comments on pitot location? I was thinking about 12 >inches >inboard of the wing tip. I plan on using 1/4 inch aluminum tubing that >will >mount to the main spar and hang down about 4 inches below the wing >before >facing forward. I wanted to stay away from the fuselage and landing >gear so >there would be less interference in airflow but I didn't want to get >to >close to the tip. Would the wing tip cause any weird pressure >variations? >zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz >Micheal Mims >SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! >mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ >Irvine Ca >Fax 714.856.9417 >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 May 1998 21:31:38 -0700 From: Douglas Dorfmeier Subject: Re: KR: Trim Tab Jeffrey E Scott wrote: > > Sorry Dana, but I'll have to argue this point with you. You can > compensate for a horizontal stab with an incorrect incidence with a > larger trim tab, but the problem is still the incidence of the tail. I > have lots of trim added to the bottom side of my elevator to compensate > for the horizontal stab being mounted at an incorrect angle...as per > plans. With the additional trim wedges permanently affixed to the bottom > of the elevator, my stock trim tab does a fine job of handling every load > and CG condition I can get this plane into. As a matter of fact, that > was a requirement I made during the test phase. The plane should flyable > from cruise to landing with trim only in all legal load configurations. > The stock trim tab passed that test with plenty of trim to spare once I > added the additional wedges to the bottom of the elevator. > > I know from talking to others that this has been a fairly common problem, > especially if you are flying in the forward part of the CG range. The > incidence of the horizontal stab when set per plans does not work well if > you are flying in the forward part of the CG range. > > If it's too late to change the incidence on your tail, then an extra big > trim tab is one of your options. Just realize that you are doing it to > compensate for an incorrect tail incidence and that it will be creating > extra drag. > > As for pitch sensativity, that is a completely separate subject and in my > opinion is unrelated to the lack or trim or incorrect tail incidence. > > BTW, I turned 100 hours on my KR this morning since the first flight > nearly a year ago. :o) > > Regards, > > Jeff > ------- > Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM > jscott.pilot@juno.com > See N1213W construction and first flight at > http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: > //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm > > > > >Sure, Ron the adjustable elevator is a great idea, I've seen it and it's > >neat.......but, for those of us who are past that point, I believe the > trim > >tab size can solve a world of problems in load variance in regards to > the > >pitch sensitivity of the plane. When I returned from Sun & Fun the > first > >thing I did was remove my tab and make a larger one while I still could. > I > >really don't think it's an incidence problem as much as the plane just > being > >so $%#%@#$ pitch sensitive and the change in CG amplified due to fuel > in a > >header tank and the addition of a passenger. > > > >Austin, I'm trying to keep this going in hopes that a true engineer will > tell > >you what size to make it although it's probably going to be an arbitrary > >thing. Anyway, I ended up making mine 5"X 12" as I didn't want to make > it too > >big as the thing is only foam and glass. > > > >Dana Overall > >Richmond, KY > >mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com > >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ > > > > _____________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] Jeff, For those of us who have not yet completed our tail section, what changes would you suggest for the horizontal stabilizer. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 May 1998 09:35:10 -0400 From: Tom Andersen Subject: Re: KR: wing incidence This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------CC072FB300819E2785BCEDE5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That is only one of the problems caused by too much incidence. Another problem is that when landing, a three-point landing is 2.5 degrees more difficult to attain. The tail will fly 6 inches lower with one degree incidence. Another problem is that the engine points 2.5 degrees downward, which has to be overcome with lift from the wing. Another problem is that the tail has to lift up to fly the plane at this incidence, but the fuselage is pushing down. (Given that your CG is not too far forward.) I think all the incidences are correct though, for high-altitude flying. Then the fuselage streamlines to 0 degrees incidence. It depends what kind of flying you want to do. - -Tom smithr wrote: > I wonder if anyone has considered that one possible outcome of a smaller > wing incidence would be that the pilot would now see the nose higher and > perceive that he is closer to a stall (and therefore be less likely to > stall). Conversely, with the old incidence (3.5) the nose appears to be > down while the AOA might be large and a pilot might be more likely to > stall the plane. > > Whattayathink?? > > Bob Smith - --------------CC072FB300819E2785BCEDE5 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Tom Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: Tom n: ;Tom email;internet: tomkr2s@worldnet.att.net x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: FALSE version: 2.1 end: vcard - --------------CC072FB300819E2785BCEDE5-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 May 1998 09:09:18 -0500 (CDT) From: Steven A Eberhart Subject: Re: KR: Bahamas trip was fun! On Fri, 29 May 1998, Micheal Mims wrote: [snip, obviously something else wasn't ;-)] > Well uh,......my wife just failed (or passed,.. however you want to look > at it) a pregnancy test! CONGRATULATIONS > Looks like I better get this thing done within 9 months eh? :o) Does this mean there is a new 2+2 design in your future? Lets see now, an additional 14" stretch in the cockpit aft of the CG should give enough room for a couple of small airport bums. A few more inches of stretch on the motor mount. Better make up an extra sets of spacers, kids grow fast. Any way, CONGRATULATIONS again, Steve Eberhart PS. bandwith be damned, this is worth a little bandwidth - ------------------------------------- http://www.newtech.com/nlf One test is worth a thousand expert opinions but a thousand opinions are easier to get. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 May 1998 12:02:32 PDT From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR: Trim Tab/stabilator Rob Matthews wrote: >I wonder if we shouldn't start thinking of having a complete moving elevator as >the Cherokee 160's etc have. Maybe this will sort out the the problem of angles >mounting of the fixed portion of the elevator. HA HA HA. It's been done. See the story on the Wanderer in Contact! magazine. Looks a lot like a KR, but has a stabilator and retract gear. Oscar Zuniga Medford, Oregon ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 May 1998 22:30:30 -0500 From: Bobby Muse Subject: Re: KR: pitot location At 07:57 PM 5/29/98 -0700, you wrote: >Anyone got any comments on pitot location? I was thinking about 12 inches >inboard of the wing tip. >Micheal Mims Micheal, Actually that would a good(there are no great) location, but if your wings are removable, it will be difficult to protect the pitot when removing your wings. I mounted my pitot as far out board as possible under the right stub wing....work o.k.. I would be more concerned with the static port. Think about it. Bobby Muse(N122B) mailto:bmuse@mindspring.com Wimberly, TX ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 May 1998 20:36:46 -0600 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: Re: KR: Trim Tab A little more nose down trim built into the stab would have done wonders for my bird. Any guess I would make would only be that... a guess. I don't know the engineering numbers behind it. I posted the amount of trim I added to the net thinking one of the engineer types on here would do the calculations and tell us how much nose down trim should be build into the horizontal stab, but didn't get any replies with that type of info. Jeff - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm On Fri, 29 May 1998 21:31:38 -0700 Douglas Dorfmeier writes: > >Jeff, >For those of us who have not yet completed our tail section, what >changes would you suggest for the horizontal stabilizer. > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 00:13:43 From: Flesner Subject: Re: KR: Trim Tab Jeff, As I recall, you put triangle tabs on the bottom side of your elevators. Doesn't that force the elevator up,- tail down-and give you nose up trim?????? As I recall, your bird is balanced in the forward area of the C.G. envelope but in your post you ask about nose down trim. please unconfuse me. Your bird is also stretched 24 inches. Did you by chance ever place a level on your horizontal stabilizer spars with the firewall plumb? It sure would be interesting to check some K.R.'s for rigging with a smart level (registered trademark) and see what we find. This fall at Perry , maybe ???????????????????????? Larry Flesner At 08:36 PM 5~30~98 -0600, you wrote: >A little more nose down trim built into the stab would have done wonders >for my bird. Any guess I would make would only be that... a guess. I >don't know the engineering numbers behind it. I posted the amount of >trim I added to the net thinking one of the engineer types on here would >do the calculations and tell us how much nose down trim should be build >into the horizontal stab, but didn't get any replies with that type of >info. > >Jeff >------- >Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 07:16:29 EDT From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Bahamas trip was fun! In a message dated 98-05-30 01:26:50 EDT, you write: << Looks like I better get this thing done within 9 months eh? :o) >> Hey Mike, I'm with Steve here the heck with bandwidth we can have some fun with this one. First Congratulations. Then a few hints: 1) Your vocabulary will change from hotwiring to diaper rash. 2) Babies will fall asleep in a car seat in an airplane just like in a car and it's a whole lot more fun for the dad. 3) Those "extra" hours in the hangar may have to be converted to "extra" hours of sleep-------------you'll need it. 4) A wing makes a great "shade tree" to put the child under for those afternoon naps........they sleep just as well there as in bed, still Mom sometimes needs convincing. 5) A 3 year old can id the VASIs and repeat white over white you're out of sight, red over white you're alright and red over red you're dead. 6) Don't teach you child how to read the GPS too soon, you talking about back seat drivers, "Dad you're supposed to be flying a bearing of 258 but you're tracking 256". Boy could I go on, but really there are no better passengers, my two boys and I live at the local flyin breakfasts and cruise in (bearing 258) to all the airshows we can fly to, plus that old airplane, tent camping................IT'S GREAT, GOOD LUCK. Dana Overall Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 07:33:16 -0500 From: jaugilas Subject: Re: KR: wing tip lights/strobes Patrick Flowers wrote: > > CruzJ12@aol.com wrote: > > > > I built my strobe lights from a kit,......schematics. All electronics > > can be purchased at Radio shack. IT's been so long that i have to > > hunt for the drawings. These strobes work well dual pulse flashing > > lights . I will email you that info as soon as i find it. > > IIRC, you can build your own stobes, but they're only good for daylight > use. To get your installation approved for night flight, you must use > PMA'd strobes :( > > Patrick > -- > Patrick Flowers > Mailto:patri63@ibm.net Since when do you need strobes at night? Bill Jaugilas ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 12:36:36 EDT From: JEHayward@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Trim Tab/stabilator In a message dated 5/30/98 1:03:10 PM Mountain Daylight Time, taildrags@hotmail.com writes: << It's been done. See the story on the Wanderer in Contact! magazine. Looks a lot like a KR, but has a stabilator and retract gear. Oscar Zuniga >> Would it be possible to gt permission to scan any pictures or that article for those of us on the KRNet that aren't aware of that magazine? Jim Hayward Rapid City, SD ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 14:46:23 -0400 From: Tom Andersen Subject: KR: FS: 1835cc VW w/Slick Mag This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - --------------B9495E4CA06B12B1E6FE4977 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a Great Plains 1835cc VW w/Slick Mag for ignition. It's 65hp is too small for my needs but it runs great and has only 5.5 hours on it. Complete engine $2300 w/KR-2 mount and upper cowl, plus all baffling done. This is a steal for $2300! Bolt it on as a firewall-forward package and go! Spins a 53 x 33 Hegy prop at 3600rpm static. Will demonstrate engine in Orlando, FL. - -Tom - --------------B9495E4CA06B12B1E6FE4977 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Tom Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: Tom n: ;Tom email;internet: tomkr2s@worldnet.att.net x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: FALSE version: 2.1 end: vcard - --------------B9495E4CA06B12B1E6FE4977-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 14:14:26 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: wheel fairings? KRNetters, Does anybody have a wheel fairing that you've used (or know of) that fits our teeny tires without being excessively large? I'm debating whether I should build them myself or order some from already made. It's not so much the money, but I don't want any huge boats under the wings. Thanks in advance. Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kr2s.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 14:16:53 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: wheel fairings? I have the ones that were covering the lamb tires available. They are not perfect but you can have them for shipping cost. Ron At 02:14 PM 5/31/98 -0500, you wrote: >KRNetters, > >Does anybody have a wheel fairing that you've used (or know of) that fits >our teeny tires without being excessively large? I'm debating whether I >should build them myself or order some from already made. It's not so much >the money, but I don't want any huge boats under the wings. > >Thanks in advance. > >Mark Langford >mailto:langford@hiwaay.net >see KR2S N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kr2s.html > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 15:30:28 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: wheel fairings? At 02:14 PM 5/31/98 -0500, you wrote: >KRNetters, > >Does anybody have a wheel fairing that you've used (or know of) that fits >our teeny tires without being excessively large? I'm debating whether I >should build them myself or order some from already made. It's not so much the money, but I don't want any huge boats under the wings. > >Thanks in advance. There is a set of LongEZ wheel pants in my hanger and they are perfect! All you need to do now is find out who makes LongEZ wheel pants. :o) Seriously they are nice and I will find out where they came from if you want. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 16:00:01 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: KR: New project photos Sports Fans, there are a few new pictures to see at: http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/updatemay.html Enjoy! zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 20:24:21 EDT From: LngDistRep@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: FS: 1835cc VW w/Slick Mag Tom, Would like to find out more about your engine. Paul 407-857-5390 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 18:39:44 -0600 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: Re: KR: Trim Tab Did I say nose down trim? Guess I can't tell up from down anymore. :) I meant to say that I needed more nose up trim. Yes, I have three 12 inch long 3/4" wedges underneath the trailing edge of my elevator to give it the proper range with the trim tab. - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm On Sun, 31 May 1998 00:13:43 Flesner writes: >Jeff, > >As I recall, you put triangle tabs on the bottom side of your >elevators. >Doesn't that force the elevator up,- tail down-and give you nose >up trim?????? As I recall, your bird is balanced in the forward >area of the C.G. envelope but in your post you ask about nose >down trim. please unconfuse me. Your bird is also stretched >24 inches. Did you by chance ever place a level on your horizontal >stabilizer spars with the firewall plumb? It sure would be >interesting >to check some K.R.'s for rigging with a smart level (registered >trademark) >and see what we find. This fall at Perry , maybe >???????????????????????? > >Larry Flesner > >At 08:36 PM 5~30~98 -0600, you wrote: >>A little more nose down trim built into the stab would have done >wonders >>for my bird. Any guess I would make would only be that... a guess. >I >>don't know the engineering numbers behind it. I posted the amount of >>trim I added to the net thinking one of the engineer types on here >would >>do the calculations and tell us how much nose down trim should be >build >>into the horizontal stab, but didn't get any replies with that type >of >>info. >> >>Jeff >>------- >>Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM >> > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 19:35:50 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR: New project photos And darn fine wings you have there matey. Gotta love that cool blue foam. I bet the wings are strong and will NOT vibrate (skin) in flight. Ron At 04:00 PM 5/31/98 -0700, you wrote: >Sports Fans, there are a few new pictures to see at: > >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/updatemay.html > >Enjoy! >Micheal Mims ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 21:03:30 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: RE: KR: Trim Tab TrimHeads, I believe the usual case is that with full fuel and only the pilot aboard, you don't have enough nose up trim or close to it. Get a little lower on fuel, or take on a passenger, and the stock trim tab is sufficient. It all depends on the plane. What I describe here is the stock KR2. It would seem here that dispensing with the shim under the front horizontal stab spar (so that it points down and adds "weight" to the tail) would be the first step in the right direction. Again, this all may depend on what you used for a horizontal reference plane (firewall or longeron), etc. Even such seemingly unrelated details as how far your aileron bellcrank and your stick are spaced off of the rear face of the main spar can have the effect of giving you trim that you don't necessarily want (since the aileron cables could be pulling the stick between them and affecting elevator cable tension. With my wing tanks and no header tank, and other differences, I won't have the problem with running out of trim, since passengers and fuel will sit very close to the CG of the plane, so I don't figure I'll need a very big trim tab. In fact, with the ground adjustable horizontal stabilizer, I'm very tempted not to bother with it, except for the spring tension setup that we discussed a while back. Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kr2s.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 20:03:35 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: RE: KR: Trim Tab >With my wing tanks and no header tank, and other differences, I won't have >the problem with running out of trim, since passengers and fuel will sit >very close to the CG of the plane, so I don't figure I'll need a very big >trim tab. In fact, with the ground adjustable horizontal stabilizer, I'm >very tempted not to bother with it, except for the spring tension setup that >we discussed a while back. > >Mark Langford Mark, dispensing with trim MAY not be the way to go. I suspect you will have trim changes regardless of your ground adjustable stabilizer AND I think a good pitch trim is a backup to the normal pitch system . IE, you should be able to land with the trim system. I have never done it of course. Ron ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 21:21:03 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: Project updates: Jim Hill & Troy Petteway I stopped by Jim Hill's today to see how he's coming on getting his KR2 back in the air. For those who missed it, he had fuel problems (he thinks) on takeoff about a year and half ago and did an engine out emergency landing doing about 120 mph through the cotton field at the end of Hazel Green's runway. He's since added about 16" to his tail, a nose wheel, and adjustable horizontal stabilizer, and a different carb from GPASC, among other things. Today he was painting all the parts, and it looks like it won't be too long. His adjustable horizontal stabilizer (boy that's a great idea, isn't it?) will probably tell us a lot about horizontal stab incidence, because he's left everything else the way it was, except his tail is a now S length, and his horizontal stab is a little longer (another good one!). He calibrated his h/s so that when he locks it down to the right place, he'll be able to directly read the new incidence with respect to the longeron. That should give us S folks a few clues... Monday evening Jim and I are driving up to see Troy Petteway in Columbia TN. Troy's finished glassing his stub wings with carbon fiber, and is moving on to the outer wings this week. He's using the AS5046 airfoil and almost everything else will remain the same as before, so there's another good comparison coming up. After rebuilding his 2180 engine, he'll be ready to go again too. His goal is to be flying by the time we have our July 25th get-together. I'll take my digital camera and post a few pictures Tuesday. I'm also looking for tailwheel tips (skateboard variety) on this expedition. Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kr2s.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 19:56:14 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Project updates: Jim Hill & Troy Petteway At 09:21 PM 5/31/98 -0500, you wrote: >I'm also looking for tailwheel tips (skateboard variety) on this expedition. > >Mark Langford>> Dude the key to a good driving tail dragger is a good tail wheel, don't build one of those cheesy little wheels! :o) Go see the one on my update page, I think it should be standard equipment on KRs from now on out. I had two KR flyers over today and they both wrote down the phone number off the side and plan to order one tomorrow. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 21:02:16 -0600 From: Ron Lee Subject: KR: Tailwheel >Dude the key to a good driving tail dragger is a good tail wheel, don't >build one of those cheesy little wheels! :o) > >Go see the one on my update page, I think it should be standard equipment on >KRs from now on out. I had two KR flyers over today and they both wrote >down the phone number off the side and plan to order one tomorrow. >Micheal Mims So what is the part number? is it the six inch solid rubber or a pneumatic tire? Ron ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 20:52:17 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Tailwheel At 09:02 PM 5/31/98 -0600, you wrote: >So what is the part number? is it the six inch solid rubber or a pneumatic tire? > >Ron > The tire is a solid rubber 3.5 to 4 inch tire that is used on a lot of homemade tailwheel assemblies,..but its the rest of it that's cool! It is full swiveling after full deflection. I bought mine from AS&S, part number L-692 on page 190 of the 1997-1998 catalog. I think it weighs about 2.5 to 3 pounds. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 714.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 23:42:34 -0500 From: "Dean R. Collette, MD" Subject: KR: Progress halted Netters, Today, or more accurately at 3:30 this morning progress on my KR came to a screeching halt for awhile. We had a thunderstorm with winds in excess of 110 mph. These winds liberated the roof of my neighbors garage and deposited it on the center of my house. Imagine waking up to the sound of 2000 lbs. falling out of the sky and landing on your roof! I now have 3 skylights, each of which is about 6 feet in diameter. Great view of the stars, but a little breezy. Thank God the airplane wasn't damaged (the kids are o.k. too.) My wife wouldn't let me yell at my neighbor to get all of his crap out of my yard. The insurance adjuster is supposed to be here tomorrow. Funny thing - I was storing all of those new instruments, radios, GPS, etc for the plane (and the receipts) in the attic and they must have all blown away. Imagine that! ;-) Seriously though, it makes me glad we paid all of those premiums. Toto, I don't think we're in Kansas anymore! Dean mailto:drdean@execpc.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 31 May 1998 22:42:23 -0600 From: jscott.pilot@juno.com (Jeffrey E Scott) Subject: Re: KR: Tailwheel FWIW, this is the same tailwheel I am using with the exception that I opted for the larger (6") tire. I have been very pleased with the way it handles on the ground and it has been absolutely trouble free through the first 103 hours. - ------- Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213W construction and first flight at http://home.hiwaay.net~langford/kjefs.html & http: //www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm On Sun, 31 May 1998 20:52:17 -0700 Micheal Mims writes: >At 09:02 PM 5/31/98 -0600, you wrote: >>So what is the part number? is it the six inch solid rubber or a >pneumatic >tire? >> >>Ron >> > >The tire is a solid rubber 3.5 to 4 inch tire that is used on a lot of >homemade tailwheel assemblies,..but its the rest of it that's cool! >It is >full swiveling after full deflection. I bought mine from AS&S, part >number >L-692 on page 190 of the 1997-1998 catalog. I think it weighs about >2.5 to 3 >pounds. >zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz >Micheal Mims >SP290,.. Filling and sanding now! >mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ >Irvine Ca >Fax 714.856.9417 >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 01:39:58 EDT From: MikeTnyc@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: wheel fairings? >>Does anybody have a wheel fairing that you've used (or know of) that fits >>our teeny tires without being excessively large? I'm debating whether I >>should build them myself or order some from already made. It's not so much >the money, but I don't want any huge boats under the wings. >> >>Thanks in advance. > >There is a set of LongEZ wheel pants in my hanger and they are perfect! All >you need to do now is find out who makes LongEZ wheel pants. :o) Has anybody ever seen the "wheel pants" found on some old Ercoupes? I put it in quotes because they don't cover the wheel at all -- they're just little triangles behind the wheel, with front edge shaped to fit close to the tire, that turn it into an aerodynamic teardrop shape. Don't know how well this would work on a KR, but it's very cool and minimalist-looking. Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Jun 1998 01:39:54 EDT From: MikeTnyc@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Trim Tab >TrimHeads, > >I believe the usual case is that with full fuel and only the pilot aboard, >you don't have enough nose up trim or close to it. Get a little lower on >fuel, or take on a passenger, and the stock trim tab is sufficient. It all >depends on the plane. What I plan to do (when and if I ever find a place to build the damn plane) is to have a ballast weight in the tailcone when flying solo that's just enough to put the CG nicely in the middle and can be removed for flying dual or with heavy luggage. That will give me roughly the same CG under most conditions, except for fuel burn. I would have an access door for inserting and removing the weight (if possible, the same one as for checking on the bellcrank), and will use a small barbell plate, which come in many sizes and already have holes in them so they could be fastened down securely on a tube and held by a spring-type clevis pin. When flying dual, it will hang on the panel, covering up a placard that says, "SOLO ONLY." Probably I would do separate weight and balance with the weight in each position so all I'd have to remember would be to use the right one, and to have checking the weight's position as part of my preflight If you need lots of up-trim when flying solo, I don't see why you couldn't do this modification to a completed plane. Of course, I don't know how big such a weight needs to be yet, but if it's back far enough it won't be too much, and eliminating the fixed trimtab drag would be worth it. Mike Taglieri ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V2 #88 ****************************