From: owner-krnet-l-digest@lists.teleport.com[SMTP:owner-krnet-l-digest@lists.teleport.com] Sent: Saturday, October 17, 1998 7:20 PM To: krnet-l-digest@lists.teleport.com Subject: krnet-l-digest V2 #162 krnet-l-digest Saturday, October 17 1998 Volume 02 : Number 162 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 01:50:34 EDT From: Sheetsg@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: KR-2 For Sale Bruce, are you selling a KR, or trying to buy? ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 23:07:16 -0700 From: "John F. Esch" Subject: Re: KR: Another website update Opps, http://www.cyberis.net/~sesch Sorry John F. Esch wrote: > Hey all, > > Not much to look at but I updated my KR pictures for all. I also > updated my brother's pictures oh his....ah....ah....ultralight. > > John F. Esch > Salem, OR > KR-2SSW ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 22:51:16 -0700 From: "John F. Esch" Subject: KR: Another website update Hey all, Not much to look at but I updated my KR pictures for all. I also updated my brother's pictures oh his....ah....ah....ultralight. John F. Esch Salem, OR KR-2SSW ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 21:22:30 EDT From: miketnyc@juno.com (Michael C. Taglieri) Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky >> >When Ken Rand first brought home the spruce to build the KR-1, he >>told >> Jeannette it was for a patio cover. >> >> Great minds think alike. ( or at least were just all afraid of our >> wives.) >> >> After my sides were laid out on the table my wife figured out that I > >> wasnt building a pedal powered airplane for my 1 year old son. >> I also had 20 hours logged before she knew I was working on my >pilots >> license. (repeat offender) >> >> Rich Parker >> Its easier to beg for forgiveness than to plead for permission. According to Kitplanes magazine, one advantage of the KR is that you can spend a year or so pretending you're building a canoe.... Mike Taglieri - ------------------------------------------------------- "May your life be full of lawyers" -- Mexican curse - ------------------------------------------------------- ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 02:53:39 -0700 (MST) From: Robert Covington Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky (joke) >>> Its easier to beg for forgiveness than to plead for permission. > >According to Kitplanes magazine, one advantage of the KR is that you can >spend a year or so pretending you're building a canoe.... > >Mike Taglieri At the '97 KR Gathering, Jeannette was saying that there have been about 14 to 15,000 sets of plans sold. Somebody in the audience joked, "Then that must mean there are 13,000 boats out there, because I haven't seen that many planes." :) Got a good laugh, hope Jeannette didn't hear it. >"May your life be full of lawyers" -- Mexican curse An American curse too. :) Robert Covington Side Two, and about ready to move ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 09:34:05 -0700 From: Tom Crawford Subject: KR: T4 motor FS Found another T4 2L motor for sale. This one's in El Cajon, CA. Asking $100.00, This one comes with a bus! 1976. Contact Jim Weller. jimw@cpmfg.com Better hurry! Tom Crawford tomc@afn.org Gainesville, FL N262TC ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 14:10:17 -0400 From: smithr Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky I didn't realize that all of us are so sneaky! Here I thought I was the only guy who had to "sneak" an airplane into the basement. Lucky for me she wasn't home the day the big truck arrived with all the goodies. But I didn't ask permission, because I knew I wouldn't get it. I just went ahead with the project. When I bought the expensive dragonfly canopy, I told her it only cost $50. I figured that she had no idea what canopies cost. But a few days later her boss told her that those things cost $1000. I had to do some serious talking to talk my way out of that one. And then there were those pricy flying lessons that I had to justify to the family budget. By now she has just accepted that the KR project isn't going away and that I am certifiably crazy for wanting to build it and fly it. She even offered to buy me a C152 just to get me out of the basement! Bob Smith in Albany, NY "What doesn't kill us makes us stronger" Richard Parker wrote: > >When Ken Rand first brought home the spruce to build the KR-1, he >told > Jeannette it was for a patio cover. > > Great minds think alike. ( or at least were just all afraid of our > wives.) > > After my sides were laid out on the table my wife figured out that I > wasnt building a pedal powered airplane for my 1 year old son. > I also had 20 hours logged before she knew I was working on my pilots > license. (repeat offender) > > Rich Parker > Its easier to beg for forgiveness than to plead for permission. > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 14:34:52 EDT From: DClarke351@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: EAA SW Regional Fly-in I would like to be there but the FAA will not let me out of my little envelope here in "hot" west texas until I fly off my 40 hours of which I have at least 35 left. I had a little mishap on landing last week and have to wait for parts such as a propeller. I am also installing a belly board so I can slow the passing tumble weeds down a bit as I land. I had to replace my nose gear tubing also. Don Clarke ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 11:41:20 -0700 From: Gordon Brimhall Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky Well we had friends stop by yesterday from down below where we used to live. They have property here to start building on next year, I asked the deminations of their 10 acres and found out he had about enough room for a landing strip of 1000 ft. He said why, My wife says Oh he is planning on building a plane now. Lee's wife asks if I have life insurance, I say yes over 100K worth, She looks at my wife and says, "Heck you should buy him the plans" Gordon smithr wrote: > I didn't realize that all of us are so sneaky! > > Here I thought I was the only guy who had to "sneak" an airplane into the > basement. Lucky for me she wasn't home the day the big truck arrived with > all the goodies. But I didn't ask permission, because I knew I wouldn't get > it. I just went ahead with the project. When I bought the expensive > dragonfly canopy, I told her it only cost $50. I figured that she had no > idea what canopies cost. But a few days later her boss told her that those > things cost $1000. I had to do some serious talking to talk my way out of > that one. And then there were those pricy flying lessons that I had to > justify to the family budget. > > By now she has just accepted that the KR project isn't going away and that I > am certifiably crazy for wanting to build it and fly it. She even offered to > buy me a C152 just to get me out of the basement! > > Bob Smith in Albany, NY "What doesn't kill us makes us stronger" > > Richard Parker wrote: > > > >When Ken Rand first brought home the spruce to build the KR-1, he >told > > Jeannette it was for a patio cover. > > > > Great minds think alike. ( or at least were just all afraid of our > > wives.) > > > > After my sides were laid out on the table my wife figured out that I > > wasnt building a pedal powered airplane for my 1 year old son. > > I also had 20 hours logged before she knew I was working on my pilots > > license. (repeat offender) > > > > Rich Parker > > Its easier to beg for forgiveness than to plead for permission. > > > > ______________________________________________________ > > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 09:45:49 -0700 From: Gordon Brimhall Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky Michael C. Taglieri wrote: > >> >When Ken Rand first brought home the spruce to build the KR-1, he > >>told > >> Jeannette it was for a patio cover. > >> > >> Great minds think alike. ( or at least were just all afraid of our > >> wives.) > >> > >> After my sides were laid out on the table my wife figured out that I > > > >> wasnt building a pedal powered airplane for my 1 year old son. > >> I also had 20 hours logged before she knew I was working on my > >pilots > >> license. (repeat offender) > >> > >> Rich Parker > >> Its easier to beg for forgiveness than to plead for permission. > > According to Kitplanes magazine, one advantage of the KR is that you can > spend a year or so pretending you're building a canoe.... > > Mike Taglieri > So if I were building two I could tell my wife it is a Catamaran which I am suppose to be building for the Lake Havasu where our camping trailer is. Gordon > ------------------------------------------------------- > "May your life be full of lawyers" -- Mexican curse > ------------------------------------------------------- > > ___________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 15:07:36 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky smithr wrote: > > I didn't realize that all of us are so sneaky! > > Here I thought I was the only guy who had to "sneak" an airplane into the basement. Lucky for me she wasn't home the day the big truck arrived with all the goodies. But I didn't ask permission, because I knew I wouldn't get it. I just went ahead with the project. When I bought the expensive dragonfly canopy, I told her it only cost $50.>>>>> I don't know guys, all this lying and sneaking around sounds a hell of a lot harder than telling the truth. ( I hope you guys are all joking or I am losing faith in MAN) Why do you have to sneak around, is this your wife were talking about or your mom? I would hate to see the implications of my wife telling me "No you cant do that"! If that were ever the case I think I would be better off, happily single (been there, done that, and liked it)! Only time will tell but I remember telling my wife I plan to build a plane and it would cost $10k to $15k and the cost would be spread out over a 3 or 4 year period. It was no big deal to her and trust me we don't make that much money! FWIW The first wife had no idea how much I spent on my Dragonfly or my flying lessons because of sneaking and lying. (key words "first wife") - -- zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Putting the engine back together again! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 949.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 15:01:13 -0400 From: "WARRON GRAY" Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky I,m telling you i must be lucky as all heck. my second , presant wife wanted me to build the "s" in our apartment on the third floor. she got me back into flying and my desire for a plane . (the first tried to have me murdered,really, but that is another story) i hope you guys are joking if noot , i hope you have good lawyers.Warron - -----Original Message----- From: Micheal Mims To: krnet-l@teleport.com Date: Friday, October 16, 1998 6:11 PM Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky >smithr wrote: >> >> I didn't realize that all of us are so sneaky! >> >> Here I thought I was the only guy who had to "sneak" an airplane into the basement. Lucky for me she wasn't home the day the big truck arrived with all the goodies. But I didn't ask permission, because I knew I wouldn't get it. I just went ahead with the project. When I bought the expensive dragonfly canopy, I told her it only cost $50.>>>>> > > >I don't know guys, all this lying and sneaking around sounds a hell of a >lot harder than telling the truth. ( I hope you guys are all joking or I >am losing faith in MAN) Why do you have to sneak around, is this your >wife were talking about or your mom? I would hate to see the >implications of my wife telling me "No you cant do that"! If that were >ever the case I think I would be better off, happily single (been there, >done that, and liked it)! Only time will tell but I remember telling my >wife I plan to build a plane and it would cost $10k to $15k and the cost >would be spread out over a 3 or 4 year period. It was no big deal to >her and trust me we don't make that much money! > >FWIW The first wife had no idea how much I spent on my Dragonfly or my >flying lessons because of sneaking and lying. (key words "first wife") > > >-- >zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz >Micheal Mims >SP290,.. Putting the engine back together again! >mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ >Irvine Ca >Fax 949.856.9417 >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 16:23:08 -0700 From: David Moore Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky I really hate to drag this on much longer but I can't resist telling you about my friend (true story). Divorces his first wife because she would not stop nagging at him about flying and homebuilding (how it was unsafe and he was going to kill himself). He is separate for several years and meets several very attractive women, but they all hate flying. So tells me he is not getting married again until he meets a girl who likes the wilderness, owns a bar, and has an airplane and rides a Harley. Well he moves to Anchorage, Alaska meets a single attractive helicopter pilot who's father owns a liquor store and she loves the outdoors and rides a Sporster. He called the other day and says "I think I'm in love". Dave Moore At 03:07 PM 10/16/98 -0700, you wrote: >smithr wrote: >> >> I didn't realize that all of us are so sneaky! >> >> Here I thought I was the only guy who had to "sneak" an airplane into the basement. Lucky for me she wasn't home the day the big truck arrived with all the goodies. But I didn't ask permission, because I knew I wouldn't get it. I just went ahead with the project. When I bought the expensive dragonfly canopy, I told her it only cost $50.>>>>> > > >I don't know guys, all this lying and sneaking around sounds a hell of a >lot harder than telling the truth. ( I hope you guys are all joking or I >am losing faith in MAN) Why do you have to sneak around, is this your >wife were talking about or your mom? I would hate to see the >implications of my wife telling me "No you cant do that"! If that were >ever the case I think I would be better off, happily single (been there, >done that, and liked it)! Only time will tell but I remember telling my >wife I plan to build a plane and it would cost $10k to $15k and the cost >would be spread out over a 3 or 4 year period. It was no big deal to >her and trust me we don't make that much money! > >FWIW The first wife had no idea how much I spent on my Dragonfly or my >flying lessons because of sneaking and lying. (key words "first wife") > > >-- >zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz >Micheal Mims >SP290,.. Putting the engine back together again! >mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net >http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ >Irvine Ca >Fax 949.856.9417 >^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > David Moore mailto:dgmoore1@gte.net Henderson, Nv. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:51:39 -0400 (EDT) From: jeroffey@tir.com (jeroffey) Subject: KR: Sneaky I don't think we need to strech this thread to far but I'd like to meet the girl helo driver in Alaska. My wife suggested flying lessons to me after our honeymoon because I told her I was going to build another street rod. She wasn't into cars and thought that flying would give me some "class". That was in 1975. She bought me the plans for Christmas 1996 and the spruce kit for Christmas 1997. What a Gal. I love her. John Roffey jeroffey@tir.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 19:08:14 -0700 From: Gordon Brimhall Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky My wife of 31 yrs has watched me sale her house to buy a rather large sailboat with the promise as long as it is fun we will do it, then sell it and buy another house. She only wants me to include her in my hobbies and never put the house up for sale again. She rides with me on the Harley but would never ride on my Honda. We have done 5000 mile trips twice on the bike. In my experiance any hobbie where we get to meet other people is a winner in her mind. She hates my Ham radio and computer hobby as she is not involved. Gordon jeroffey wrote: > I don't think we need to strech this thread to far but I'd like to meet the > girl helo driver in Alaska. My wife suggested flying lessons to me after our > honeymoon because I told her I was going to build another street rod. She > wasn't into cars and thought that flying would give me some "class". That > was in 1975. She bought me the plans for Christmas 1996 and the spruce kit > for Christmas 1997. What a Gal. I love her. > John Roffey > jeroffey@tir.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 19:51:02 -0400 From: "Wayne DeLisle Sr." Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky I'll be darned. The ideal woman does exist..... (-; WD Wayne DeLisle Sr. Email:support@sestar.net ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 17:18:11 -0400 From: "WARRON GRAY" Subject: KR: Re: Sneaky Yeah John! I'm not alone . Warron - -----Original Message----- From: jeroffey To: krnet-l@teleport.com Date: Friday, October 16, 1998 8:52 PM Subject: KR: Sneaky >I don't think we need to strech this thread to far but I'd like to meet the >girl helo driver in Alaska. My wife suggested flying lessons to me after our >honeymoon because I told her I was going to build another street rod. She >wasn't into cars and thought that flying would give me some "class". That >was in 1975. She bought me the plans for Christmas 1996 and the spruce kit >for Christmas 1997. What a Gal. I love her. >John Roffey >jeroffey@tir.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 21:28:01 -0700 From: Robert Maniss Subject: KR: SW Regional EAA Fly-in I understand weather was one factor in decision to move fly-in to Abilene. Weather here for first full day was winds 23-25 mph with gusts up to 35+. Rain this afternoon. 70% chance for rain tomorrow. Several were able to get here but not what we were hoping (expecting) for. Hope some of you guys can make it for next year - no KR's here yet. Bob Maniss ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 22:03:29 -0500 From: "Brian J. Bland" Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky I am sure glad that I don't have to hide anything from my wife! She actually makes me go fly and makes me go work on the plane! She knows exactly how much I have spent on my project and how much more I need to spend. As long as we have money to pay the bills she doesn't care how much I spend on my hobbies (and I have a lot of hobbies! :-) ) I feel sorry for the guys that have to hide things from their wives. Brian J Bland Claremore, OK Mail to: bbland@gateway.net http://www.flight2000.com/hangar/KR-2S/ ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 19:45:42 -0500 From: N4DD Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky Micheal Mims wrote: > > smithr wrote: > > > > I didn't realize that all of us are so sneaky! > > > > Here I thought I was the only guy who had to "sneak" an airplane into the basement. Lucky for me she wasn't home the day the big truck arrived with all the goodies. But I didn't ask permission, because I knew I wouldn't get it. I just went ahead with the project. When I bought the expensive dragonfly canopy, I told her it only cost $50.>>>>> > > I don't know guys, all this lying and sneaking around sounds a hell of a > lot harder than telling the truth. ( I hope you guys are all joking or I > am losing faith in MAN) Why do you have to sneak around, is this your > wife were talking about or your mom? I would hate to see the > implications of my wife telling me "No you cant do that"! If that were > ever the case I think I would be better off, happily single (been there, > done that, and liked it)! Only time will tell but I remember telling my > wife I plan to build a plane and it would cost $10k to $15k and the cost > would be spread out over a 3 or 4 year period. It was no big deal to > her and trust me we don't make that much money! > > FWIW The first wife had no idea how much I spent on my Dragonfly or my > flying lessons because of sneaking and lying. (key words "first wife") > > > -- > zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz > Micheal Mims > SP290,.. Putting the engine back together again! > mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ > Irvine Ca > Fax 949.856.9417 > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Amen Mike . We should all be as honest as our president with our wives ;-) Jean N4DD ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 20:22:33 -0700 (MST) From: Robert Covington Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky >she loves the outdoors and rides >a Sporster. He called the other day and says "I think I'm in love". > >Dave Moore With you? Or the woman? :) Just kidding, couldn't resist, that last line was too much of a setup. A very encouraging story. That is neat. There is a guy in my EAA chapter, his plane was completed early last year, an RV-6. He has 250 hours on it already, and it is called "My Sanity" because it got him through (caused?) two divorces. His plane cost him $40,000 plus, and I remember him saying when he was about three months till done if he was doing it all over again, he would just buy one. But that was before he finished it. I think the 250 hours speaks for what he thinks of it now, and if it was worth it in both time and $$. He has taken it all over the country. Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 21:01:09 -0700 From: "John F. Esch" Subject: Re: KR: Sneaky I try not to hide anything from my wife even about how long this thread is going on. John F. Esch Gordon Brimhall wrote: > My wife of 31 yrs has watched me sale her house to buy a rather large > sailboat > with the promise as long as it is fun we will do it, then sell it and > buy > another house. She only wants me to include her in my hobbies and > never put the > house up for sale again. She rides with me on the Harley but would > never ride on > my Honda. We have done 5000 mile trips twice on the bike. In my > experiance any > hobbie where we get to meet other people is a winner in her mind. She > hates my > Ham radio and computer hobby as she is not involved. > > Gordon > > jeroffey wrote: > > > I don't think we need to strech this thread to far but I'd like to > meet the > > girl helo driver in Alaska. My wife suggested flying lessons to me > after our > > honeymoon because I told her I was going to build another street > rod. She > > wasn't into cars and thought that flying would give me some "class". > That > > was in 1975. She bought me the plans for Christmas 1996 and the > spruce kit > > for Christmas 1997. What a Gal. I love her. > > John Roffey > > jeroffey@tir.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 21:18:32 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: SW Regional EAA Fly-in At 09:28 PM 10/16/98 -0700, you wrote: >I understand weather was one factor in decision to move fly-in to >Abilene. Weather here for first full day was winds 23-25 mph with gusts >up to 35+. >>> Yeah I never could figure out why people would schedule fly-ins (air shows, gatherings, etc.) in the mid west in the fall. Seems to me there should be a very loud Homer Simpson "DOH" involved here somewhere. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,..Putting the engine back together now! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 949.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 02:05:51 -0400 From: "Tom Andersen" Subject: KR: Had my first KR flight today Hi Netters, I had my first KR flight ever in Tom Crawford's award-winning KR-2 in Gainesville, FL today. I'm glad to report the KR-2 is everything I thought it would be like and I'm really fired up about my KR-2S project now. I didn't have any problems with pitch control, in fact I did 360 degree steep turns within 100 feet of my original altitude on my first try. It was sooo much easier to handle than the c152 spam cans I'm used to pulling and pushing on, and I love the roll response. It reminded very much of the radio control planes because the stick forces are so light you hardly feel them, you simply watch the reaction to your inputs and "learn" how much does what. The breakout forces center the stick automatically, and we even flew hands off 10 seconds with only a slight roll correction of 5 degrees at the end. I'm 170lbs and 6' tall so I'm the biggest passenger Tom's taken up. We were about 1000 lbs with seven gallons fuel, which puts the CG about 30% back. Tom just adjusted his technique on the more neutral pitch control. Thanks Tom C., for putting up with my size in the cockpit, I had a great KR experience which answered so many nagging questions in my mind. I can't believe how smooth the ride is at 160mph, even with a little turbulence at one point. I could definitely feel the light weight of the KR but the speed zipped us through the bumps. In fact, the KR feels just like a really fast ultralight. Tom has the tri-gear and I think that with a tailwheel certification and some time in a taildragger KR-2S I'll have no problems with my taildragger when it's done. I'm also sure that all the mods I plan to make to my 2S will work fine. It was a real thrill to finally fly a KR after 2 years of working on mine. I'm rejuvenated and vindicated in my choice of airplane. Rich Parker and I had rode up to Tom's house together. I was nearly floored when he sent me an e-mail that said "I'll be flying into Orlando from New Hampshire Friday morning and renting a car to go to Gainesville to see Tom C's KR-2. I'll pick you up and drive you to Gainesville so you can get some KR stick time." I really was speechless for a minute. Thanks Rich. I understand why so many people love the KR so much. It's in a class by itself in terms of simplicity and performance. I can't wait to get mine done and flying. - -Tom Andersen Orlando, FL ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 07:34:08 -0700 (MST) From: Robert Covington Subject: KR: Fiberglass question When using something like West Systems, and doing a multiple layup of something, what is the best way to do this? Overlay the layers all at the same time, making sure they are real wet? Or laying up a layer, then letting that dry, and putting on the new one? I think peelply would be in order somewhere using that method, would it not? Micro needed only when laying up over foam? Thanks, Robert Covington ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 09:52:13 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR: RE: Fiberglass question Robert, Lay them all up at once. It'll be lighter and stronger that way. No peelply required unless you're gonna stick something else on top later. Mark Langford mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-krnet-l@smtp.teleport.com > [mailto:owner-krnet-l@smtp.teleport.com]On Behalf Of Robert Covington > Sent: Saturday, October 17, 1998 9:34 AM > To: krnet-l@teleport.com > Subject: KR: Fiberglass question > > > When using something like West Systems, and doing a multiple layup of > something, what is the best way to do this? Overlay the layers all at the > same time, making sure they are real wet? Or laying up a layer, then > letting that dry, and putting on the new one? I think peelply would be in > order somewhere using that method, would it not? > > Micro needed only when laying up over foam? > > Thanks, > > Robert Covington > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 10:15:30 -0500 From: rmccall Subject: Re: KR: Panel Planner Oscar, I just got back from a two week vacation in Hawaii with my wife. Beautiful place to visit. Actually, the trip was her idea and since she hadn't been complaining about my building on the KR2S, I figured I better go along for the ride. At any rate, I saw Hawaii from a sub, flew around the island, and took a cruise, when we weren't on the beach or driving around the island. The only place I've ever been where the birds fly in and eat with you in the dining room. More ot the point, I'd like the panel planner since I am working on the panel at this time. My KR2SXL is really large (44" cabin width). I can't use standard premade parts and have to build everything from scratch. Rich McCall 1518 Holly Lane Junction City, KS 66441 Oscar Zuniga wrote: > Hello, Netters > > I have the Panel Planner software of Dana's, but I'm not building at the > moment so please tell me if you were wanting it so I can send it on to > you. Otherwise, it will be safe here for the winter ;o) > > And for any who didn't know, Paul Martin's rebuilt KR-2 got signed off > by the FAA last week. Paul and Linda are in Hawaii at the moment (Mike- > what did you start with all the island vacationing?), so it looks like > first flight may not be until November. I think he's trailering it down > to Groom Lake for first flight ;o) > > Oscar Zuniga > Medford, Oregon > > ______________________________________________________ > Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 10:50:49 EDT From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Fiberglass question In a message dated 98-10-17 10:34:37 EDT, you write: << When using something like West Systems, and doing a multiple layup of something, what is the best way to do this? Overlay the layers all at the same time, making sure they are real wet? Or laying up a layer, then letting that dry, and putting on the new one? I think peelply would be in order somewhere using that method, would it not? Micro needed only when laying up over foam? Thanks, Robert Covington >> Robert, the best way to lay up two layers of glass is to to lay both layers at one time. Your micro slurry would be applied to the foam with just enough material to cover the foam adequately. You don't need a lot, just enough to fill the voids in the foam. Be sure and lay your glass while the micro is still wet. If you are going to lay up single layers of glass the peel ply between layups is the the way to go. Just be sure and don't make the mistake that has occurred, and that is to leave to peel ply on. To get a good finish even on the two layer layups, try using peel ply or "snake skin" on top of the second layup, it does wonders in getting rid of excess resin and doing away with pin holes. Dana Overall Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 12:40:00 -0700 (MST) From: Robert Covington Subject: KR: Re:Fiberglass question/Thanks,more questions Thanks Mark, thanks Dana. That is a big help. Wondered if doing multiple layups at once was cool or not. I thought so, but wasn't sure. That being said, if I have to add layers later to a dried piece, what is the best procedure, beforehand and after? This is for a special project I am doing (custom chair for Lylah). With the KR I will probably be using Aeropoxy. One thing I have wondered about for those using West Systems on the wings, or other kinds...It gets hot when it is curing, at least in the cup. This isn't hot enough to generate cyanide vapors from Urethane foam in an ordinary layup is it? Forgot how hot the stuff got the other night, and melted a plastic cup! Luckily that was on a piece of cardboard, so didn't go anywhere. But it made me realize that I had the stuff in the pump tester too. That is a nice distorted shape now. I should post a picture of that sculpture. Robert >Robert, > >Lay them all up at once. It'll be lighter and stronger that way. No >peelply required unless you're gonna stick something else on top later. > >Mark Langford >If you are going to lay up single layers of glass the peel ply between layups >is the the way to go. Just be sure and don't make the mistake that has >occurred, and that is to leave to peel ply on. >To get a good finish even on the two layer layups, try using peel ply or >"snake skin" on top of the second layup, it does wonders in getting rid of >excess resin and doing away with pin holes. > >Dana Overall ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 12:54:56 -0700 From: Micheal Mims Subject: Re: KR: Re:Fiberglass question/Thanks,more questions Robert Covington wrote: > That being said, if I have to add layers later to a dried piece, what is the best procedure, beforehand and after?> You have two choices, either use peel ply or sand like crazy before applying the second layup. > One thing I have wondered about for those using West Systems on the wings, or other kinds...It gets hot when it is curing, at least in the cup. This isn't hot enough to generate cyanide vapors from Urethane foam in an ordinary layup is it? > Don't think so dude, normally you don't have thermal run-a-way on a layup using epoxy. That only happens when the epoxy is in a confined area such as a cup. I don't know that West Systems could be use on a large layup such as the wing anyway considering its short pot life. I know I would want at least a 2 hour pot life when wetting out the outer wings. I stayed away from West Systems mostly because to this day it is not allowed to be used in the construction of composite planes such as the LongEZ, Dragonfly, Quickie, etc. (got to be something there) Secondly because I had used safe-t-poxy in the past and really liked and I have a pump that is calibrated for it. Oh well enough on West Systems! :o) - -- zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290,.. Putting the engine back together again! mailto:mikemims@pacbell.net http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Irvine Ca Fax 949.856.9417 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 15:00:59 -0700 From: "Joa" Subject: KR: Re: Re:Fiberglass question/Thanks,more questions He-he, we've all got those 'sculptures' around now don't we! The best way to control an exothermic reaction like epoxy is to vary its thickness. To make a large batch of epoxy last longer before it kicks off just spread it in a paint pan (for rollers) etc. When you laminate with epoxy it spreads over a large area and doesn't get near as hot as when in a cup so don't worry about melting the foam. Hope this answers your questions. Joa - -----Original Message----- From: Robert Covington To: krnet-l@teleport.com Date: Saturday, October 17, 1998 12:40 PM Subject: KR: Re:Fiberglass question/Thanks,more questions >Thanks Mark, thanks Dana. That is a big help. Wondered if doing multiple >layups at once was cool or not. I thought so, but wasn't sure. > >That being said, if I have to add layers later to a dried piece, what is >the best procedure, beforehand and after? > >This is for a special project I am doing (custom chair for Lylah). With the >KR I will probably be using Aeropoxy. > >One thing I have wondered about for those using West Systems on the wings, >or other kinds...It gets hot when it is curing, at least in the cup. This >isn't hot enough to generate cyanide vapors from Urethane foam in an >ordinary layup is it? > >Forgot how hot the stuff got the other night, and melted a plastic cup! >Luckily that was on a piece of cardboard, so didn't go anywhere. But it >made me realize that I had the stuff in the pump tester too. That is a nice >distorted shape now. I should post a picture of that sculpture. > >Robert ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 17:39:04 -0500 From: "Dean R. Collette, MD" Subject: Re: KR: Re:Fiberglass question/Thanks,more questions >> One thing I have wondered about for those using West Systems on the wings, or other kinds... >I stayed away from West Systems mostly because to this day it is not >allowed to be used in the construction of composite planes such as the >LongEZ, Dragonfly, Quickie, etc. (got to be something there) Secondly >because I had used safe-t-poxy in the past and really liked and I have a >pump that is calibrated for it. Oh well enough on West Systems! :o) Here's a "for what it's worth." I never understood the anti - West Systems thing until recently when I had the unique opportunity to disassemble a KR. This project was constructed with T-88 and West Systems for wood joints and there were some lay-ups done with the West System and some done with Safe-T-poxy (Schizoid builder ??) Bottom line - The West Systems lay-ups were no where as strong as the others. The wood joints basically fell apart and in several places I could pull the fiberglass layers apart. The fiberglass that was done with the safe-t-poxy was fine. Where the builder used flox to join wood pieces - now those were stout. Keep in mind that the plane got to meet my Sawzall because of poor workmanship throughout - So I really can't tell you that it was the epoxy and not the builder. But, there was a couple of gallons of West epoxy that was included in the deal - I tossed 'em. Dean ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 19:43:16 EDT From: JEHayward@aol.com Subject: Re: KR: Re:Fiberglass question/Thanks,more questions In a message dated 10/17/98 4:26:48 PM Mountain Daylight Time, drdean@execpc.com writes: << This project was constructed with T-88 and West Systems for wood joints and there were some lay-ups done with the West System and some done with Safe-T-poxy (Schizoid builder ??) Bottom line - The West Systems lay-ups were no where as strong as the others. The wood joints basically fell apart and in several places I could pull the fiberglass layers apart. >> How were the T-88 joints? Jim Hayward Rapid City, SD ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 20:21:38 -0600 From: "Jeb" Subject: KR: webpage update I posted some new photos on my webpage. these are from my trip down to Copperstate. I have some of the Global Explorer and some of the GeeBee racer. on the right hand pane click on Copperstate link John Bryhan jeb@thuntek.net // www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krpage.htm Los Alamos, NM ------------------------------ End of krnet-l-digest V2 #162 *****************************