From: KR-net users group digest[SMTP:kr-net@telelists.com] Sent: Sunday, February 28, 1999 12:17 AM To: kr-net digest recipients Subject: kr-net digest: February 27, 1999 KR-net users group Digest for Saturday, February 27, 1999. 1. Re: joint bond failure on firewall 2. Are we too tall ? 3. Re: Prop Picture 4. Re: Are we too tall ? 5. cowling question 6. Re: Prop Picture 7. Re: cowling question 8. Re: Are we too tall ? 9. Happi 1834 10. Re: Prop Picture 11. Re: Are we too tall ? 12. Re: cowling question 13. Re: Happi 1834 14. Re: joint bond failure on firewall 15. Centering Springs 16. AirBags 17. Re: Centering Springs 18. Re: AirBags 19. Re: AirBags 20. RE: 2-S wing tanks ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: joint bond failure on firewall From: "DAVID STUART" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 22:10:15 +1300 X-Message-Number: 1 I had a similar problem in a Fisher aircraft that had been damaged and couldn't figure out a 100% repair solution that would allow me to sleep at night. So I removed the timber and was pleased with that decision because only about one third of the of the width of verticle had adhesion to the firewall plywood. If you can close the joint by compressing it could mean a bad glue joint.At any rate if you remove the verticles and replace them even though its a fiddly job you too will sleep soundly I'm sure.Cheers.......Dave david.stuart@xtra.co.nz ---------- > From: CruzJ12@aol.com > To: KR-net users group > Subject: [kr-net] joint bond failure on firewall > Date: Saturday, 27 February 1999 21:02 > > There are 2 locations on the firewall where i have cracks in the 5/8" square > verticle members. I bought 2 projects a month ago.The kr2 was project was > started in 1979/80The builder put it on the back burner to build a > kr1......other project . > After putting a wide pipe clamp on the top and bottom of the > firewall, the cracks closed up. I want to replace the two verticles but fear > the surrounding glue joints will weaken as i remove the verticle pieces. > If I inject some t88 resin into the cracks with compressed > air and clamp , what next? Any sugestions appreciated. > I could double up on the verticles along sides, then glue another > piece of 5/8 spruce wide enought to bond to the 4" box at the top.? Maybe > glass in the firewall and wrap it around the sides? > HELP > ..............joe > > --- > You are currently subscribed to kr-net as: DAVID.STUART@xtra.co.nz > To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-kr-net-17800J@telelists.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Are we too tall ? From: "Bruno CONSEIL" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 02:34:57 PST X-Message-Number: 2 Hello, I am new in this list, so my question is simple : what do you think about 2 pilots, 1.86 m (6"2'), 85 kg each (190 lbs), inside a KR2 (or S) ? what do you think about 1 of these pilots inside the KR1 ? Thank you. Bruno, France > > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Prop Picture From: Donald Reid Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 08:29:29 -0500 X-Message-Number: 3 Mike Mims wrote: > > Well if you happen to be bored and want to see what a over-grown Sterba > prop looks like you can go to the bottom of: > > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/engine2.html > > and check out mine(Its a 65 X 72). > Well, let's see... if it is 65" tall, then you must be about 68-70" tall. What was that song some years ago about short people? -- Don Reid Bumpass, Va. mailto:donreid@erols.com KR2XL at http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm Ultralights at http://www.erols.com/donreid/usua250.html ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Are we too tall ? From: KR2616TJ@aol.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 08:53:17 EST X-Message-Number: 4 In a message dated 2/27/99 5:35:20 AM Eastern Standard Time, bconseil@hotmail.com writes: << what do you think about 2 pilots, 1.86 m (6"2'), 85 kg each (190 lbs), inside a KR2 (or S) ? >> I'm an even 6'0" and I am using the standard KR2 with the Rand Robinson canopy frame and canopy. I have about and inch and half above my head and to the side of my shoulder in this arrangement. Keep in mind that my sling seat is lowered as far as it will go. If you build your own forward deck you can easily raise the canopy frame up to accommodate your height or go with a dragonfly canopy. Your other question concerning the width can be easily overcome by simply widening the fuselage at your shoulders instead of at your knees, which is where the plans have you doing it. Enough people on this net have done this who can help you. Dana Overall Richmond, KY mailto:kr2616tj@aol.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/7085/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: cowling question From: Kr2dream@aol.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:37:22 EST X-Message-Number: 5 I have just finished the major part of modifying the standard 2S cowl from RR to fit my turbo Soob and am ready to fix it to the firewall. The drawing in the manual says to flox brackets to the firewall but I am hesitant to flox to the stainless and count on a good bond to the stainless. The fasteners provided in the RR hardware package require the female plate to be 5/8 inch inside the cowl as if the bracket was 5/8 thick???? I am confused. Any suggestions from what really works? Bob Lasecki The snow finally turned to rain in Chicago! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Prop Picture From: "Wayne DeLisle Sr." Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:49:31 -0500 X-Message-Number: 6 Hey, hey, hey! 70" is just fine, that's what I am. Both of us are tall enough for whatever is needed. We only look short when standing next to people like you. ((-; My next door neighbor would make you look short. He is 6'10", about 320lbs, and looks like a classic rendition of Paul Bunyan, beard and all. Anyway, its all relative. (My relatives are vertically challenged). WD At 08:29 AM 2/27/99 -0500, you wrote: >Mike Mims wrote: >> >> Well if you happen to be bored and want to see what a over-grown Sterba >> prop looks like you can go to the bottom of: >> >> http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/engine2.html >> >> and check out mine(Its a 65 X 72). >> > >Well, let's see... if it is 65" tall, then you must be about 68-70" >tall. What was that song some years ago about short people? > >-- >Don Reid >Bumpass, Va. mailto:donreid@erols.com > KR2XL at http://www.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm > Ultralights at http://www.erols.com/donreid/usua250.html > >--- >You are currently subscribed to kr-net as: dodger@coincidental.net >To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-kr-net-17800J@telelists.com > -------------------------------------------- Wayne DeLisle Sr. Charlotte, NC mailto:dodger@coincidental.net http://angst.webserve.net/~dodger -------------------------------------------- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: cowling question From: jscott.pilot@juno.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 08:23:28 -0800 X-Message-Number: 7 Bob, A simple thing to do is to built several "L" brackets and bolt them through the firewall. I built three aluminum plates to bolt to the firewall (one for each side and another cut in an arc to match the top) then riveted the "L" brackets to the plates. The "L" brackets and cowl were then drilled to match and fitted with Cam-lock fasteners. Others prefer to use screws and nutplates. Either works. The screws and nutplates are a little simpler and cheaper to install. Jeff On Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:37:22 EST Kr2dream@aol.com writes: >The drawing in >the manual says to flox brackets to the firewall but I am hesitant to flox to >the stainless and count on a good bond to the stainless. The fasteners >provided in the RR hardware package require the female plate to be 5/8 inch >inside the cowl as if the bracket was 5/8 thick???? I am confused. Any >suggestions from what really works? > >Bob Lasecki >The snow finally turned to rain in Chicago! Jeff Scott - Los Alamos, NM mailto:jscott.pilot@juno.com See N1213w construction and first flight at http://www.thuntek.net/~jeb/krjeff.htm ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Are we too tall ? From: Tlongcrier@aol.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:30:22 EST X-Message-Number: 8 Bruno I'm 6'1", 215 lbs. I bought a KR 1 with Turtle Deck type fuselage and canopy from a friend. It had plywood seat base (removable) and back (tilts forward) with about 2 to 3 inch cushions to match the upholstery. Very nice. He was a 170 lb, 5'8" FAA size pilot. Seat base was a low as possible and back attached and hinged to rear spar - tilted rearwards. With cushions, NO WAY. Remove seat and back cushions and I was in. Close, but o.k. leg room. 1/2" or so clearance headroom with ball cap and headset. "I like it like that!". Feels great. However .....Having played with British Sportcars (MGs mostly) for 15 plus years, I am accustomed to a small enviroment. Go drive an MG Midget. You'll have a ball! I forgot. Shoulder room is tight, but just fine. An 1835 cc VW engine handles my weight - if that was a concern of yours - as though I were a sack of feathers. I thought the feed back as to you fellas heights was good, but I'd like to hear some more about two that heavy in a KR 2? It's all a matter of CG, I know, but without any further comments on that, what about the "sheer" cockpit weight? I've got some 200 to 250 lb buddies I like to haul around too - In the KR 2. On the KR 1, I have a "horse saddle" I chinch to the Turtle Deck behind the cockpit for passengers. Thurman Longcrier (TLongcrier@aol.com) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Happi 1834 From: "Dan Cottle" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 9:54:54 X-Message-Number: 9 I saw a posting asking about the HAPPI engine this week but didn't see any responses. Does anyone know anything about these engines? I'm looking at buying a (just) finished project that has one of these engines in it. Two things I'd like to do to this project are "more fuel" , it only carries 9 gallons in the header. And the second would be more speed. The owner says max is 155 mph and cruises about 125 at 3100rpm. From what I'm seeing on the net here,, that seems pretty sluggish? Any how, the airframe looks pretty clean so I'd consider upgrading this engine and prop. I'm looking for information on the happi so I can decide how to proceed. I'd like to stay with the VW theme. Any and all suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks Dan. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Prop Picture From: Mike Mims Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:23:22 -0800 X-Message-Number: 10 Donald Reid wrote: > Well, let's see... if it is 65" tall, then you must be about 68-70" > tall. What was that song some years ago about short people? > Without hat and hair about 71" thank you very much! :o) -- zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290 (Sky Pig 290) ,..Still Building the Cowling... mailto:mikemims@home.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Aliso Viejo Ca ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Are we too tall ? From: Mike Mims Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:28:19 -0800 X-Message-Number: 11 KR2616TJ@aol.com wrote: > > << what do you think about 2 pilots, 1.86 m (6"2'), 85 kg each (190 lbs), inside a KR2 (or S) ? >> > Something to keep in mind, looks like our friend Bruno is from France and most of the European agencies do not allow any mods what so ever from the plans. So if you have to build the aircraft to plans without any mods I would say the KR2S would ba a great single seat aircraft for you. I don't think you would be happy with two six foot plus and 190 pound men (or women) in a standard width KR2 or KR2S. -- zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290 (Sky Pig 290) ,..Still Building the Cowling... mailto:mikemims@home.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Aliso Viejo Ca ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: cowling question From: "Doug Peyton" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:35:41 PST X-Message-Number: 12 I put two AN-3 bolts through each bracket and on through the firewall when I attached my engine cowling. I also had queasy feelings about floxing to stainless steel.... >From: Kr2dream@aol.com >Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 09:37:22 EST >To: "KR-net users group" >Subject: [kr-net] cowling question >Reply-To: "KR-net users group" > >I have just finished the major part of modifying the standard 2S cowl from RR >to fit my turbo Soob and am ready to fix it to the firewall. The drawing in >the manual says to flox brackets to the firewall but I am hesitant to flox to >the stainless and count on a good bond to the stainless. The fasteners >provided in the RR hardware package require the female plate to be 5/8 inch >inside the cowl as if the bracket was 5/8 thick???? I am confused. Any >suggestions from what really works? > >Bob Lasecki >The snow finally turned to rain in Chicago! > >--- >You are currently subscribed to kr-net as: doug_peyton@hotmail.com >To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-kr-net-17800J@telelists.com > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Happi 1834 From: Mike Mims Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:35:42 -0800 X-Message-Number: 13 Dan Cottle wrote: > Two things I'd like to do to this project are "more fuel" , it only > carries 9 gallons in the header. And the second would be more speed. > The owner says max is 155 mph and cruises about 125 at 3100rpm. From > what I'm seeing on the net here,, that seems pretty sluggish? I think that's about right for an 1835. You may want to compare notes with Adrian Carter (he's on the list) but 125 to 130 mph with the 60 hp HAPI sounds pretty good. I think you would need to bump that up to a 2180cc to see 155 cruise with higher flat out speeds. The 60 hp HAPI engine was and is a good powerplant. GPASC can help you is you ever need parts. One thing that HAPI had problems with was their aluminum flywheel. Find out if it has one and if it does check it for cracks or just replace it. -- zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Micheal Mims SP290 (Sky Pig 290) ,..Still Building the Cowling... mailto:mikemims@home.com http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/4136/ Aliso Viejo Ca ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: joint bond failure on firewall From: CruzJ12@aol.com Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 19:29:46 EST X-Message-Number: 14 David, I bought this kr2 project a month ago. Records show that it was started in 1979 and stopped sometime in 81. He went to a kr1 project that I also purchased. Very nice woodwork. The kr2 must have been tweeked to crack them parts. The firewall plywood was never glued on, so that probably didn't help any. Can you explain how you removed the verticle 5/8 square spruce from the 3/32 mahogany skin ? Or should i remove the skin along with the verticles? Appreciate your help David, thanks alot......Joe ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Centering Springs From: "Robert Sauer" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 21:09:21 -0600 X-Message-Number: 15 Has anyone used centering springs on the control stick? Would someone that has finished building or is building a KR2S let me know how far the center control stick move left of center and right of center. What epoxy is being used for wing fuel tanks? Also, what is used to round the corners of the main Diehl landing gear legs? Thanks to all who respond. Bob ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: AirBags From: "James Jasper" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 21:14:34 -0700 X-Message-Number: 16 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BE6296.2C5D96E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Does anyone have any suggestions concerning where to find detailed = information about airbag design and construction? =20 I think for a/c use, any crash needing an airbag will not likely need an = automatically deploying device as in an automobile, and I could = adequately blow up the bag by having a fire extinguisher nozzle sewn = into the bag and simply pulling the trigger during the last 5 seconds = before impact. =20 I think I could also properly design the bag so that I'd be able to = continue trying to fly the plane as long as it is in the air. Jim Jasper jjasper@inconnect.com SLC, Utah ------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BE6296.2C5D96E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Does anyone have any suggestions = concerning=20 where to find detailed information about airbag design and = construction? =20
 
I think for a/c use, any crash = needing an airbag=20 will not likely need an automatically deploying device as in an = automobile, and=20 I could adequately blow up the bag by having a fire extinguisher nozzle = sewn=20 into the bag and simply pulling the trigger during the last 5 seconds = before=20 impact. 
 
I think I could also properly design = the bag so=20 that I'd be able to continue trying to fly the plane as long as it is in = the=20 air.
 
Jim Jasper
jjasper@inconnect.com
SLC, Utah
------=_NextPart_000_00CB_01BE6296.2C5D96E0-- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: Centering Springs From: Laheze@aol.com Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 00:57:05 EST X-Message-Number: 17 Bob, I recently installed some new gear legs from Dan and simply used some 60 grit sand paper on a sanding block. The process was pretty fast. I had previously tried using a router with the expectation of high heat and melted resin, but it did not cut very well at all. Good Luck Larry Howell ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: AirBags From: "andy picklesimer" Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 22:42:18 -0800 X-Message-Number: 18 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE62A2.6E2FC140 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable -----Original Message----- From: James Jasper To: KR-net users group Date: Saturday, February 27, 1999 8:02 PM Subject: [kr-net] AirBags =20 =20 Does anyone have any suggestions concerning where to find detailed = information about airbag design and construction? =20 =20 I think for a/c use, any crash needing an airbag will not likely = need an automatically deploying device as in an automobile, and I could = adequately blow up the bag by having a fire extinguisher nozzle sewn = into the bag and simply pulling the trigger during the last 5 seconds = before impact. =20 =20 =20 Hey Jim . . . Airbags work, not just because they inflate, but = because they also deflate in a controled manner, asbsorbing the energy = of the body encountering them. As a firefighter on our county's auto = extrication team (jaws of life) I have taken classes on these things, = and I have seen them save lives on the street. Having one stay inflated = would be counter productive. We need someone smarter than me to = engineer a way to use automotive ones. Remember if you do play with one = out of a car that these are very dangerous explosive devices! ------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE62A2.6E2FC140 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
-----Original = Message-----
From:=20 James Jasper <jjasper@inconnect.com>
To:=20 KR-net users group <kr-net@telelists.com>
D= ate:=20 Saturday, February 27, 1999 8:02 PM
Subject: [kr-net]=20 AirBags

Does anyone have any suggestions = concerning=20 where to find detailed information about airbag design and=20 construction? 
 
I think for a/c use, any crash = needing an=20 airbag will not likely need an automatically deploying device as in = an=20 automobile, and I could adequately blow up the bag by having a fire=20 extinguisher nozzle sewn into the bag and simply pulling the trigger = during=20 the last 5 seconds before impact. 
 
 
Hey Jim . . . Airbags work, not just because = they inflate,=20 but because they also deflate in a controled manner, asbsorbing the = energy=20 of the body encountering them.  As a firefighter on our = county's auto=20 extrication team (jaws of life) I have taken classes on these = things, and I=20 have seen them save lives on the street.  Having one stay = inflated=20 would be counter productive.  We need someone smarter than me = to=20 engineer a way to use automotive ones.  Remember if you do play = with=20 one out of a car that these are very dangerous explosive=20 devices!
------=_NextPart_000_0054_01BE62A2.6E2FC140-- ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: Re: AirBags From: Laheze@aol.com Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 01:55:16 EST X-Message-Number: 19 Hey Guys I think a ballistic parachute would be safer for plane and passengers. Good Luck Larry Howell ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Subject: RE: 2-S wing tanks From: KR2LARRY@aol.com Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 03:09:56 EST X-Message-Number: 20 Hi Mike Your absolutely right.If my wing tanks are not maintained with equal amounts of fuel in each tank it becomes very unstable ,especially on takeoff. I would definately advise not extending wingtanks anymore than twenty four inches out from the stub wings.Better yet build tanks in stub wings only. Larry --- END OF DIGEST --- You are currently subscribed to kr-net as: johnbou@timberline.com To unsubscribe send a blank email to leave-kr-net-17800J@telelists.com