From: To: Subject: krnet Digest 26 Feb 2001 01:27:20 -0000 Issue 179 Date: Sunday, February 25, 2001 5:27 PM krnet Digest 26 Feb 2001 01:27:20 -0000 Issue 179 Topics (messages 4253 through 4282): Subaru EJ-22 Where Are You???? 4253 by: MiloKetchum.aol.com Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H 4254 by: Rick Hubka 4262 by: Donald Reid 4280 by: GARYKR2.cs.com Re: Chutes? 4255 by: Ross Youngblood 4256 by: Ross Youngblood 4259 by: Jan Laan Aileron Bell Crank Assy ... 4257 by: Albert Pecoraro 4263 by: Robert Stone Re: KRNet contributions 4258 by: Wayland T Stokes Fowler Flap 4260 by: Carter Pond 4266 by: Greg S Martin Props 4261 by: Carter Pond Re: Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H - possible solution? 4264 by: Rick Hubka 4273 by: Donald Reid 4274 by: Donald Reid Re: Seat belt attachments on a KR2 4265 by: Wayland T Stokes Used Plans, QDKR, weird question, etc 4267 by: CS Move of the KRNET.org website 4268 by: Ross Youngblood mailinglists.org question 4269 by: CS 4270 by: Mark Langford Re: Chutes? - kinda long, just another opinion 4271 by: EagleGator.aol.com Re: Chutes? (hypothetical) 4272 by: CS 4275 by: Donald Reid 4276 by: EagleGator.aol.com 4277 by: CS Re: ELT antenna 4278 by: GARYKR2.cs.com 4281 by: FIDNET Re: turning engines backwards 4279 by: GARYKR2.cs.com Rotary weight, hp, etc... 4282 by: CS Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: To post to the list, e-mail: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 20:59:12 EST To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: MiloKetchum@aol.com Subject: Subaru EJ-22 Where Are You???? Message-ID: --part1_bb.c05e029.27c9c0f0_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Fellow Fliers; Any Kr-2's flying with a Subaru EJ-22? Milo Ketchum Checotah, Oklahoma --part1_bb.c05e029.27c9c0f0_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 20:49:06 -0700 To: "KRNet - New" From: "Rick Hubka" Subject: Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H Message-ID: <037601c09edd$f2e615a0$d15dfea9@cg.shawcable.net> Hi Netters I am putting together my hinges on the horz. stab using the parts and schematic on Dr Deans site. http://www.execpc.com/~drdean/hinges.htm I know there has been talk of this B4 ... but when I looked through 40 or so old emails on this subject...well here goes... 1) Can I use a lock washer & locktite on bolt H or....? ( there is no locking method for bolt H in the diagram ) 2) I have test fit my new wing airfoil templates to the horizontal spars and the hinge gap is precisely 1.50" as it should be. (Excellent!!!) However... My rod end bearing/eye bolt together measure 1.48" leaving me .02 inches in which I still need to fit 2 of .06" AN970 washers. My first though was to counter sink the washers about 3/4 of the way into the wood using a forstner bit, but what would the inspector say? Matby nothing... I've never had an inspection until I call for the first in a few weeks. Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated... Rick Hubka Calgary Alberta Canada rick@hubka.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 09:57:30 -0500 To: "KRNet - New" From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR> Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225095245.009fa810@pop.erols.com> --=====================_2260543==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >I am putting together my hinges on the horz. stab using the parts and >schematic on Dr Deans site. >1) Can I use a lock washer & locktite on bolt H or....? ( there is no >locking method for bolt H in the diagram ) The bolt tightens down on the rod bearing end. The rotation of the hinge is in the rod bearing end, not the bolt. Since there is no rotation of the bolt, you can use a lock nut. I may be wrong, but I think that lock washers are NOT airworthy, with or without locktite >2) I have test fit my new wing airfoil templates to the horizontal spars and >the hinge gap is precisely 1.50" as it should be. (Excellent!!!) > However... My rod end bearing/eye bolt together measure 1.48" leaving >me .02 inches in which I still need to fit 2 of .06" AN970 washers. My >first though was to counter sink the washers about 3/4 of the way into the >wood using a forstner bit, Do NOT counter sink into the spar. Really bad idea. You need to find some other way to shorten the rod bearing/eye bolt combination. Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com Bumpass, Va Visit my web sites at: KR2XL construction: http://users.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm EAA Chapter 231: http://eaa231.org Ultralights: http://usua250.org --=====================_2260543==_.ALT-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 20:06:12 EST To: donreid@erols.com, krnet@mailinglists.org From: GARYKR2@cs.com Subject: Re: KR> Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H Message-ID: In a message dated 2/25/01 9:53:49 AM Eastern Standard Time, donreid@erols.com writes: << I think that lock washers are NOT airworthy, with or without locktite >> LOCK NUT !!!!!!! LOCK NUT !!!!!!!!!!! LOCK NUT !!!!!!!!!!! Gary Hinkle (A/P) MIddletown, Pa. garykr2@cs.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 21:00:33 -0700 To: BillStarrs From: Ross Youngblood CC: Clay1Pilot@aol.com, rick@hubka.com, krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? Message-ID: <3A988361.32F115A7@home.com> Bill, Explain what you will do if you have an in-flight cockpit fire? It's too late for me to re-do the airframe for the BRS, and yes I plan to practice egress with my parachute on. -- Ross BillStarrs wrote: > What do you think your chances are of getting out of your plane with your > parachute? I suggest praciting a few fast exsist on the ground, perfectly > still, and then emagine what it would like in an emergency situation in > Flight. If you can afford the extra $$$ for the Balistic chute, that is the > best bet. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ross Youngblood" > To: > Cc: ; > Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2001 10:21 AM > Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? > > > I bought mine from "Strong Parachutes" > > > > They go to all the airshows. > > > > Although most KR-netters don't plan on buying chutes, I decided that > > my interests made a purchase worthwhile. Out here in Arizona we have > > great sailplane weather, and aerobatic training weather. I figure once I > > get some $$$, I will buy a used sailplane and fly cross country. The > > FAA requires cross country sailplane flying be done with a parachute. > > If doing somthing as safe as flying a sailplane in a flat desert requires > a > > parachute, I figured it may be a nice back cushon on the KR during > > test flying. > > > > I have sat in the KR with the parachute... things are a bit cramped > > with it on. I was told by Strong that I can get a differnt pack > > for the canopy if I didn't like the fit. I got the seatback (backpack) > > type, but I was looking to get the paracushon chair type. My only > > drawback is that I got my N number embroidered on my chute pack, > > so I don't know if it can be exchanged. I'm going to do a couple of > > more sitting trials before I make my decision. It pushes me forward > > a couple of inches, somthing to think about. > > > > Crawl into your KR with a couple of pillows strapped to your back, and > > you get the general idea. Pillows compress more than the packed chute > > does, so I think it will work out about the same. Plus I think it is fun > to > > visualize 50 or more KR-netters in the garage with two pillows strapped > > to their backs, crawling into the KR-boat and making airplane noises. > > > > -- Ross > > > > > > > > Clay1Pilot@aol.com wrote: > > > > > Where can I find information on parachutes for experimental I have seen > them > > > before > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 21:03:38 -0700 To: BillStarrs From: Ross Youngblood CC: Clay1Pilot@aol.com, rick@hubka.com, krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? Message-ID: <3A98841A.F3483A41@home.com> I forgot to to a Reply All. I hate to re-open old wounds RE: parachutes vs BRS.... but just to put a plus on the personal parachute column... what do you do if you have an in-flight cockpit fire? After you pull the BRS, you will have time to devote to putting out the fire I suppose. An in-flight fire is probably the only reason I can think of for jumping out of a perfectly good airplane. -- Ross BillStarrs wrote: > What do you think your chances are of getting out of your plane with your > parachute? I suggest praciting a few fast exsist on the ground, perfectly > still, and then emagine what it would like in an emergency situation in > Flight. If you can afford the extra $$$ for the Balistic chute, that is the > best bet. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ross Youngblood" > To: > Cc: ; > Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2001 10:21 AM > Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? > > > I bought mine from "Strong Parachutes" > > > > They go to all the airshows. > > > > Although most KR-netters don't plan on buying chutes, I decided that > > my interests made a purchase worthwhile. Out here in Arizona we have > > great sailplane weather, and aerobatic training weather. I figure once I > > get some $$$, I will buy a used sailplane and fly cross country. The > > FAA requires cross country sailplane flying be done with a parachute. > > If doing somthing as safe as flying a sailplane in a flat desert requires > a > > parachute, I figured it may be a nice back cushon on the KR during > > test flying. > > > > I have sat in the KR with the parachute... things are a bit cramped > > with it on. I was told by Strong that I can get a differnt pack > > for the canopy if I didn't like the fit. I got the seatback (backpack) > > type, but I was looking to get the paracushon chair type. My only > > drawback is that I got my N number embroidered on my chute pack, > > so I don't know if it can be exchanged. I'm going to do a couple of > > more sitting trials before I make my decision. It pushes me forward > > a couple of inches, somthing to think about. > > > > Crawl into your KR with a couple of pillows strapped to your back, and > > you get the general idea. Pillows compress more than the packed chute > > does, so I think it will work out about the same. Plus I think it is fun > to > > visualize 50 or more KR-netters in the garage with two pillows strapped > > to their backs, crawling into the KR-boat and making airplane noises. > > > > -- Ross > > > > > > > > Clay1Pilot@aol.com wrote: > > > > > Where can I find information on parachutes for experimental I have seen > them > > > before > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 21:20:42 -0800 To: Ross Youngblood ,BillStarrs From: Jan Laan Cc: Clay1Pilot@aol.com,rick@hubka.com,krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? Message-ID: <98307836801@popper-3.vancouver.ipapp.com> At 09:03 PM 2/24/01 -0700, Ross Youngblood wrote: >I forgot to to a Reply All. > I hate to re-open old wounds RE: parachutes vs BRS.... but >just to put a plus on the personal parachute column... >what do you do if you have an in-flight cockpit fire? After >you pull the BRS, you will have time to devote to putting out the fire >I suppose. > > An in-flight fire is probably the only reason I can think of for jumping >out of a perfectly good airplane. > > -- Ross > Most pictures of KR's that I have seen so far have forward hinging canopies, which I presume is what the plans call for. With this set-up I fail to see how you could get out of the plane at any speed above 20-25 mph or so unless you have a system to jettison the whole thing or figure out to fly backwards before you jump. Alternatively you could bring a crosscut saw up with you so you could cut up the plane around you and be freed that way, provided you built in enough elbow room to move the saw. Jan ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 23:31:51 -0500 To: "kr2s group" From: "Albert Pecoraro" Subject: Aileron Bell Crank Assy ... Message-ID: <001d01c09ee3$e102dd40$82d1b23f@steelcase.com> ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C09EB9.F6F58DC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Netters, I was doing some work on the aileron bell cranks this evening to check = for fit and clearance and I noticed that the bolt that fastens the = eye-end to the aileron bell crank was interfering with the lower support = bracket when I moved the assembly in (i.e toward the fuselage.=20 This had me puzzled for a while. I tried adjusting the upper and lower = support brackets, I moved the assembly higher to see if it would clear, = but it wouldn't. I went to the builder's manual to see if there was something I was doing = wrong. Well, I discovered something peculiar in the manual - p.62, photo = #24 - left aileron bell crank assembly. Take a look at the bolt that = fastens the eye-end to the cross-over cable ... the head is pointing = down! When I assembled the bell crank I (naturally) installed the bolt = with the head up (Heads up! Heads forward! according to Bingelis, unless = you have no other choice). Isn't this where you want to have the bolt = with the head up, in case the nut loosens? ... If that nut comes loose = in flight and the bolt slips out, the cable that goes to the opposite = bell crank will be ineffective. I don't know what consequences this = could have in flight, but I have a feeling that it wouldn't be good.=20 I am going to redesign the lower support bracket so the bolt (installed = head up) will not interfere with it. Good night.=20 Albert ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C09EB9.F6F58DC0-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 09:45:55 -0600 To: "Albert Pecoraro" , "kr2s group" From: "Robert Stone" Subject: Re: KR> Aileron Bell Crank Assy ... Message-ID: <001301c09f42$0b6c9fe0$0101a8c0@pavilion> Netters: In regard to a situation where you must install a bolt with the head down the way to do this is, use a bolt that is drilled out for a cotter pin and use a castle nut. Bob Stone ----- Original Message ----- From: "Albert Pecoraro" To: "kr2s group" Sent: Saturday, February 24, 2001 10:31 PM Subject: KR> Aileron Bell Crank Assy ... Netters, I was doing some work on the aileron bell cranks this evening to check for fit and clearance and I noticed that the bolt that fastens the eye-end to the aileron bell crank was interfering with the lower support bracket when I moved the assembly in (i.e toward the fuselage. This had me puzzled for a while. I tried adjusting the upper and lower support brackets, I moved the assembly higher to see if it would clear, but it wouldn't. I went to the builder's manual to see if there was something I was doing wrong. Well, I discovered something peculiar in the manual - p.62, photo #24 - left aileron bell crank assembly. Take a look at the bolt that fastens the eye-end to the cross-over cable ... the head is pointing down! When I assembled the bell crank I (naturally) installed the bolt with the head up (Heads up! Heads forward! according to Bingelis, unless you have no other choice). Isn't this where you want to have the bolt with the head up, in case the nut loosens? ... If that nut comes loose in flight and the bolt slips out, the cable that goes to the opposite bell crank will be ineffective. I don't know what consequences this could have in flight, but I have a feeling that it wouldn't be good. I am going to redesign the lower support bracket so the bolt (installed head up) will not interfere with it. Good night. Albert ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 24 Feb 2001 22:37:50 -0800 To: langford@hiwaay.net From: Wayland T Stokes Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> KRNet contributions Message-ID: <20010224.223751.-504721.0.tomstokes1@juno.com> Mark If you will let me know what you want for KRNET at the next gathering I will do it. I live in Pine Bluff. I havent seen Tommy since the last gathering but I guess it is about time to hunt him down and see if there is anything we need to start for this year. Tom Stokes Pine Bluff, AR ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 00:32:22 -0800 To: kr From: Carter Pond Subject: Fowler Flap Message-ID: <3A98C316.E34A92F1@home.com> Hi Builders I have an idea on a fouler flap but would like to talk to any one that has worked with them or has text book info. The info I have suggest CL increase of 1.9. This is a worth while life bonus if I can get the weight down. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 09:09:56 -0800 To: carterkr2s1@home.com From: Greg S Martin Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Fowler Flap Message-ID: <20010225.090957.-171799.2.idrawtobuild@juno.com> On Sun, 25 Feb 2001 00:32:22 -0800 Carter Pond writes: > Hi Builders > I have an idea on a fouler flap but would like to talk to any one > that > has worked with them or has text book info. The info I have suggest > CL > increase of 1.9. This is a worth while life bonus if I can get the > weight down. I hopes someone responds. I would like to put flaps on my '1' as only the outside 1/2 has ailerons. Greg Martin, idrawtobuild@juno.com 20909 South Street, Suite #3 Tehachapi, California 93561 work 661-823-9401, fax 823-9381 home 661-872-8781, fax 871-1822 ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 00:35:29 -0800 To: kr From: Carter Pond Subject: Props Message-ID: <3A98C3D1.3F5AEDED@home.com> Who has the best Price on props I have a quote from Ed Sterba of $500 and Bernard Warnke info is in the mail so they said. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 09:36:41 -0700 To: "KRNet - New" , "Donald Reid" From: "Rick Hubka" Subject: Re: KR> Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H - possible solution? Message-ID: <001d01c09f49$225fb320$d15dfea9@cg.shawcable.net> From originator... Thanks for the response Donald. 1) On the H Bolt locking problem... How about I make a tear drop washer out of 7075 T6 and use a lockwire bolt wired to a lockwire screw tapped into the tip of the washer tear end? 2) On reducing the size of my bearing/eye bolt length... The rod end bearing has 17 internal threads... How about I cut off 1/10" of the rod end bearing end, leaving 14 internal threads? This would give me the clearance to insert the washers and get the desired total 1.5" spacing between the spars. Thanks Rick Hubka Calgary, Alberta Canada rick@hubka.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Donald Reid" To: "KRNet - New" Sent: Sunday, February 25, 2001 7:57 AM Subject: Re: KR> Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H > > >I am putting together my hinges on the horz. stab using the parts and > >schematic on Dr Deans site. > >1) Can I use a lock washer & locktite on bolt H or....? ( there is no > >locking method for bolt H in the diagram ) > > The bolt tightens down on the rod bearing end. The rotation of the hinge > is in the rod bearing end, not the bolt. Since there is no rotation of the > bolt, you can use a lock nut. I may be wrong, but I think that lock > washers are NOT airworthy, with or without locktite > > >2) I have test fit my new wing airfoil templates to the horizontal spars and > >the hinge gap is precisely 1.50" as it should be. (Excellent!!!) > > However... My rod end bearing/eye bolt together measure 1.48" leaving > >me .02 inches in which I still need to fit 2 of .06" AN970 washers. My > >first though was to counter sink the washers about 3/4 of the way into the > >wood using a forstner bit, > > > Do NOT counter sink into the spar. Really bad idea. You need to find some > other way to shorten the rod bearing/eye bolt combination. > > > > > > Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com > Bumpass, Va > > Visit my web sites at: > KR2XL construction: http://users.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm > EAA Chapter 231: http://eaa231.org > Ultralights: http://usua250.org ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 17:56:46 -0500 To: "KRNet - New" From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR> Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H - possible solution? Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225174635.009f97a0@pop.erols.com> --=====================_7698102==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >2) On reducing the size of my bearing/eye bolt length... The rod end >bearing has 17 internal threads... How about I cut off 1/10" of the rod end >bearing end, leaving 14 internal threads? This would give me the clearance >to insert the washers and get the desired total 1.5" spacing between the >spars. That sounds fine. I think that you are supposed to have a minimum thread engagement of approximately one half of the available threads. If there is a small hole drilled through the threaded portion of the rod bearing end, this is the minimum depth indicator. If you can't stick a piece of wire through that hole, then there is sufficient thread engagement. That is how much length you have to have. Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com Bumpass, Va Visit my web sites at: KR2XL construction: http://users.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm EAA Chapter 231: http://eaa231.org Ultralights: http://usua250.org --=====================_7698102==_.ALT-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 17:59:15 -0500 To: "Rick Hubka" ,"KRNet - New" From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR> Dr Dean Hinge Bolt H - possible solution? Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225175845.009f2030@pop.erols.com> --=====================_7698143==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >2) On reducing the size of my bearing/eye bolt length... The rod end >bearing has 17 internal threads... How about I cut off 1/10" of the rod end >bearing end, leaving 14 internal threads? This would give me the clearance >to insert the washers and get the desired total 1.5" spacing between the >spars. That sounds fine. I think that you are supposed to have a minimum thread engagement of approximately one half of the available threads. If there is a small hole drilled through the threaded portion of the rod bearing end, this is the minimum depth indicator. If you can't stick a piece of wire through that hole, then there is sufficient thread engagement. That is how much length you have to have. Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com Bumpass, Va Visit my web sites at: KR2XL construction: http://users.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm EAA Chapter 231: http://eaa231.org Ultralights: http://usua250.org --=====================_7698143==_.ALT-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 10:56:19 -0800 To: Laheze@aol.com From: Wayland T Stokes Cc: gleone@tritel.net, krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Seat belt attachments on a KR2 Message-ID: <20010225.105620.-639613.1.tomstokes1@juno.com> Larry I asked Jennette about 4 years ago and she said Ken was trying to fly from Texas to Huntington Beach Calif without fueling. After encountering a bad head wind he decided he couldn't make it and turned back trying for Big Bear, California. This was the worst snow storm in years and he ran out of gas and talked to ground control all the way down going into the side of a mountain. Tom Stokes White Hall, AR tomstokes1@juno.com or tomstokes1@aol.com ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 10:28:43 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: CS Subject: Used Plans, QDKR, weird question, etc Message-ID: <20010225182843.11328.qmail@web2306.mail.yahoo.com> Hi all, Thanks for all the help on the previous questions. I'm going to be posting to various internet sites for "want to buy" used KR 2S plans. Could someone tell me what a complete package of plans should consist of, ie, how many pages and drawings? Also, from reading through archives, it seems I can reregister plans once I get them...can fact that plans are actually unused be verified through RR prior to purchase? Also, it's probably going to take me 3-5 yrs. and $15,000-$20,000 to build "my" plane. That's too long. So I'm going to look for a QD (quick and dirty) KR 2 or 2S project that someone is giving up on, to complete and fly while I build mine (with all the mods). In looking at unfinished projects, any particular areas or items I ought to watch out for? I don't mean things like leading edge facing aft :-), I think even I could figure that one out. Weird question of the day...If I get a project that is beyond 51% qualification, can I "unbuild" part of it in order to qualify, ie, strip empennage and redo tail section, undo/redo turtledeck, undo inboard wing section to install wing tanks, etc? Anyone ever heard of this situation? I don't know who my DAR is yet; I'm moving in a few weeks down toward Chattanooga...guess I could call EAA 150 down there and find out. I really would like to have the repairman's certificate. BTW, don't email me about plans/projects unless you want to let them go cheap. I don't want a "fair" deal, I want to steal them from someone who needs the money. If I'm gonna be close to retail I'd just as soon go to RR or Wicks. Finally, a somewhat normal question: There are a lot of books on "The Basics of Composite Construction" out there. Anyone know of one that they consider a "must-read?" Thanks in advance. Chuck __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:43:28 -0700 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Move of the KRNET.org website Message-ID: <3A995250.C7D9FCAE@home.com> Teleport has been shutting off stuff and will be disabling UNIX shell access to the krnet account by 2/28. This will make it a bit more difficult to administer the website, and will probably kill our ftp area. I'm not sure. I have been looking for a new home for the krnet.org website, and think I may have found a possible candidate. http://www.eskimo.com They also appear to support email lists, so we could move the website and email list server back to the same place. (If anyone is interested). Mailinglists.org works pretty good so I'm not too sure we want to change that, but if anyone notices krnet.org going away, it will probably be due to the hosting change which may occur in the next couple of weeks. (Depending on my $$). The domain krnet.org has been paid up for two more years, so all I'm doing now is finding a nice place to host it. -- Regards Ross ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 11:11:48 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: CS Subject: mailinglists.org question Message-ID: <20010225191148.9482.qmail@web2301.mail.yahoo.com> Hi again, Does anyone know if mailinglists.org has a page where I can view the various lists? I've been to their site and can't find a link to it if they do. I'd like to join that VW list that Mark was talking about. Thanks. Chuck __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 13:32:17 -0600 To: From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> mailinglists.org question Message-ID: <004001c09f61$a9ef24c0$561cf618@600athlon> > Does anyone know if mailinglists.org has a page where > I can view the various lists? I've been to their site > and can't find a link to it if they do. I'd like to > join that VW list that Mark was talking about. http://www.lists.kz/vw/ is the VW list homepage (or what it eventually BECAME). I got this from our archive location at www.escribe.com under "aviation", "Auto and Motorcycle to Aviation Engine Conversions" which we share with them. It looks like they have some interesting discussions here... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 15:59:54 EST To: jalan@axion.net From: EagleGator@aol.com CC: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? - kinda long, just another opinion Message-ID: <71.b07ef5e.27cacc4a@aol.com> --part1_71.b07ef5e.27cacc4a_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/24/01 11:19:55 PM Central Standard Time, jalan@axion.net writes: > > I hate to re-open old wounds RE: parachutes vs BRS.... but > >just to put a plus on the personal parachute column... > >what do you do if you have an in-flight cockpit fire? After > >you pull the BRS, you will have time to devote to putting out the fire > >I suppose. > > > > An in-flight fire is probably the only reason I can think of for jumping > >out of a perfectly good airplane. > > > > -- Ross > > > Most pictures of KR's that I have seen so far have forward hinging > canopies, which I presume is what the plans call for. > > With this set-up I fail to see how you could get out of the plane at any > speed above 20-25 mph or so unless you have a system to jettison the whole > thing I posted a rather lengthy treatise on this subject a couple of years ago, but I'll be darned if I can find it. Here are some of the salient items. There are three general conditions that would prompt you to bail out or deploy a BRS: 1. The aircraft is in an unrecoverable departure from controlled flight 2. Catastrophic structural failure that makes the aircraft uncontrollable 3. Catastrophic inflight fire that can't be extinguished and is threatening to kill you There are a number of considerations that help you determine how you will arrive at the best answer, personal parachute or BRS, for your situation. Among them are aircraft canopy configuration, physical condition of the test pilot, and familiarity with skydiving (if you haven't done it, bailing out is a tough way to learn). If you decide to use a personal chute, there are a number of factors you need to consider to determine your minimum bailout decision altitude, starting with the minimum parachute deployment altitude, recommended by the manufacturer, to give you at least one swing under the opened chute before you hit the ground. Add to that the time it will take you to open/jettison the aircraft canopy, release your lap belt and shoulder harness, and get clear of the aircraft. Multiply that time by the maximum decent rate you would expect to encounter in an emergency (1500 FPM is probably a good WAG) to determine the altitude lost during this procedure. Add the altitude lost while getting out of the aircraft to the minimum parachute deployment altitude, add about another 1000' to account for decision delay time, and you will have a good minimum emergency bailout altitude that gives you a chance of living through it. In a controlled condition, like a cockpit fire, your bailout decision altitude would be lower, assuming you can maintain level or near level flight. If you install a BRS, the manufacturer provides you with the flight parameters that the system has been tested or demonstrated to, so that info is a given. The consideration with a BRS is mainly a weight/CG decision, IMHO. They are also expensive, and permanent fixtures in the aircraft. I know there are several builders who have incorporated them into their projects, I'm sure everyone would like to hear from them and how the installations worked out. In terms of survivability, I think most people would be better served with a BRS, but a personal chute is a good option for those who have the training and have done the proper planning and practice to make a successful bail out. Now, having said all that, the chances of having to bail out of your airplane are very remote, provided you have built it soundly and execute your ground and flight testing in a thorough, disciplined manner. The first action in any emergency is to maintain aircraft control, then analyze the situation and take the appropriate action. If the aircraft is controllable and you are not personally on fire, you will, in most cases, be better off executing an emergency landing and egressing on the ground. Honestly, I haven't made my decision. I've been toying with ways to jettison a forward-hinged canopy and haven't come up with anything simple enough yet. When I get to the point of mounting the canopy, my decision will be made. Humbly submitted, for your consideration. Cheers, Rick Junkin, St. Charles MO EagleGator@aol.com --part1_71.b07ef5e.27cacc4a_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 13:44:43 -0800 (PST) To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: CS Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? (hypothetical) Message-ID: <20010225214443.10857.qmail@web2304.mail.yahoo.com> Hey Rick, I'm also considering going with a BRS on my plane, haven't posted here because it's been pretty well covered, also found most of what I needed to know on BRS' site, so basically it comes down to a decision. Anyway, here's another of those WANs (wild-ass notions) that I seem to specialize in. This wouldn't help in case of structural disintegration or uncontrollable fire, but in unrecoverable departure wouldn't it be possible to have a small chute that would serve only to get the plane stabilized and headed somewhat nose-down? From there it would seem a pilot would at least have a chance of a dead-stick as opposed to a dead-pilot landing. I realize there are engineering issues, but doesn't the concept seem feasible? On one hand it's a drag to have no protection; on the other hand a BRS is like wearing full-body armor whenever you ride your motorcycle. Sometimes ya just takes yer chances... Per fire...I wonder what is weight/cost for onboard foam system? Just some more of the crap I think about when I go off my meds... Chuck __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 18:03:10 -0500 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? (hypothetical) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010225175936.009f36c0@pop.erols.com> --=====================_7933423==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >Anyway, here's another ...but in unrecoverable departure >wouldn't it be possible to have a small chute that >would serve only to get the plane stabilized and >headed somewhat nose-down? From there it would seem a >pilot would at least have a chance of a dead-stick as >opposed to a dead-pilot landing. This is an old idea that has been used many times during spin testing. I have seen photos of installations on small planes and a television documentary where one was installed on a modern fighter aircraft (F18 I think). It does not need to be very large or very strong. Don Reid mailto:donreid@erols.com Bumpass, Va Visit my web sites at: KR2XL construction: http://users.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm EAA Chapter 231: http://eaa231.org Ultralights: http://usua250.org --=====================_7933423==_.ALT-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 18:14:03 EST To: dc9898@yahoo.com, krnet@mailinglists.org From: EagleGator@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? (hypothetical) Message-ID: <93.75dd3d5.27caebbb@aol.com> --part1_93.75dd3d5.27caebbb_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/25/01 3:44:55 PM Central Standard Time, dc9898@yahoo.com writes: > ...in unrecoverable departure > wouldn't it be possible to have a small chute that > would serve only to get the plane stabilized and > headed somewhat nose-down? From there it would seem a > pilot would at least have a chance of a dead-stick as > opposed to a dead-pilot landing... > What you're talking about is a spin chute, which is used during envelope expansion and spin testing during commercial/military test programs. Yes it would work, BUT... you would have to mount it so that it did not interfere with rudder or elevator operation when deployed, or, more preferrably, design a way to jettison it once the aircraft was pointing the right direction again. The good news is that it doesn't have to be large, as the amount of drag necessary will not be that great. I considered this approach when I was contemplating spin testing, but haven't done any work on it yet. My first thought was to mount a flat-pack drogue chute to the bottom of the fuselage, anchored to the tail wheel block. Lots of problems with that idea, but again, that's one I'll address down the road a bit. Cheers, Rick Junkin, St. Charles MO EagleGator@aol.com --part1_93.75dd3d5.27caebbb_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 15:51:28 -0800 (PST) To: Robert Stone , krnet@mailinglists.org From: CS Subject: Re: KR> Chutes? (hypothetical) Message-ID: <20010225235128.20022.qmail@web2304.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Bob, Since I am using wing tanks and only a small (6 gal) header tank, I could mount it in either the foredeck where tank would have been, or in the turtledeck as that space will be empty. BRS says there has to be an attach point in front of CG. Since I plan to stretch the KR another 10" longer than a 2S, I will have to look at the CG once I get the engine weight figures. A supercharged rotary Mazda 13B is what I'm planning right now, and will use that unless I find a good reason not to (ie gph burn). Also, tell your friend that under the new "sport pilot" category due out soon, a sportpilot can have either a medical OR a state driver's license in order to fly. However, the way I understand it, he will only be legal in a "sport plane," something like 1250 lbs. gross, stall speed around 52, cruise around 110 (I think), max two passengers. You can get info at www.eaa.org., link is near top right on homepage (it's a little small link). Honestly, after seeing weight (49 lbs, including launcher) of chute, I doubt that I will use it. Chuck __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:15:08 EST To: ralphndori@juno.com, krnet@mailinglists.org From: GARYKR2@cs.com Subject: Re: KR> ELT antenna Message-ID: <8b.2df421c.27cafa0c@cs.com> In a message dated 2/23/01 10:48:22 PM Eastern Standard Time, ralphndori@juno.com writes: << Does anyone know why it has to be an external mount, instead of a vertical mount in the baggage area? >> Yes, because the manufacture is planing on it being installed on an all metal airplane. You can put it inside the fuselage. Besides that, you could have made your own for about $5.00 and had extra money for more parts. Gary Hinkle (A/P) Middletown, Pa. garykr2@cs.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:18:22 -0600 To: , , From: "FIDNET" Subject: RE: KR> ELT antenna Message-ID: -----Original Message----- you could have made your own for about $5.00 and had extra money for more parts. Gary Hinkle (A/P) Middletown, Pa. garykr2@cs.com You have my attention, now don't leave me hanging....HOW? D. DuRossette N21KC@MO1 Ft. Lost in the Woods, Ozarks ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 19:57:42 EST To: taildrags@hotmail.com, krnet@mailinglists.org From: GARYKR2@cs.com Subject: Re: KR> turning engines backwards Message-ID: In a message dated 2/24/01 6:32:52 PM Eastern Standard Time, taildrags@hotmail.com writes: << Perhaps I'm mistaken, but I thought I read or heard something that said that certain types of magneto ignitions could be damaged by rotating them backwards. >> Any of the aircraft mags can be turned backwards with NO ill effects. The only item that could possibly be damaged would be a vacuum pump if one of the vanes were to stick in the extended position. This is most likely to happen with a high time pump. Gary Hinkle (A/P) Middletown, Pa. garykr2@cs.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 25 Feb 2001 17:27:12 -0800 (PST) To: Aggie lewanda , krnet@mailinglists.org From: CS Subject: Rotary weight, hp, etc... Message-ID: <20010226012712.9439.qmail@web2303.mail.yahoo.com> Hi Dean, > > What are the specs on the Mazda rotary? H.P.? > Low RPM, or PSRU required? > Dry weight? > Turbocharged? > Air cooled or water cooled? > If water, where are you mounting a radiator? > > I have been thinking about a Corvair conversion > but wonder how yours will compare? ------------------- Everything I'm about to tell you is what I have dug up on the web over the past week or two. I am not an engine expert, and there are is a lot of conflicting info out there. Your mileage may vary. So, what I THINK I've learned... HP--From what I gather about 180 with EFI but not w/ supercharger. One site says SC will add 30% at 6 lbs. boost, jury is still out on that. PSRU--I'll give links at end of a couple of places that sell them. The rotary is by design a high RPM engine. Dry weight--I don't know, but "all in" wet weight should be around 300 from what I'm hearing. Turbo---some folks are but I don't want to deal with the extra heat. If SC isn't practical, I'll just go with EFI and engine management, possibly mild porting. Water-cooled, and from what I gather they're not very forgiving on the heat issue. Radiator mounting---I don't know yet, I'm not that far along. Compared to Corvair---my gut feeling is that I will get more horses per pound but less horses per dollar. Check out the links below. I'm going with the first guy (Tracy Crook). He's honest, knowledgeable, and reasonable, what more do you want? The second folks never answered my emails, and the third guy wants $18,000 for an engine/psru, so I didn't bother writing. He may be using 20B engine (I'll have 13B) so that may be part of the difference. He states 215 hp at 265 lbs. dry weight including PSRU, so I'd figure all-in somewhere around 325. If you go that heavy you'll have to stretch the KR, I would think. Also there may be stress/torque issues, I haven't looked at that yet. http://www.rotaryaviation.com/ http://www.atkinsrotary.com/ http://powersportaviation.com/ Hope this helps. Chuck __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ End of krnet Digest ***********************************