From: To: Subject: krnet Digest 9 Feb 2003 22:49:42 -0000 Issue 628 Date: Sunday, February 09, 2003 2:50 PM krnet Digest 9 Feb 2003 22:49:42 -0000 Issue 628 Topics (messages 15043 through 15066): Re: Update 15043 by: Mark Jones 15050 by: Robert Stone Re: kr flight training( need help.) 15044 by: Ron Lee Re: Lights, Strobes and cheap shortcuts 15045 by: virgnvs.juno.com Epoxy and T88 15046 by: Leigh Plymale 15064 by: Dan Heath T-Tails 15047 by: Ross Youngblood 15053 by: WMartensJr.aol.com 15054 by: Kevin Re: Re scarf joints 15048 by: Ross Youngblood 15051 by: Kenneth L Wiltrout Re: a long x/c with about 5 cups of coffee 15049 by: Ross Youngblood Re: LED nav lights 15052 by: bill kirkland Re: krnet Digest 9 Feb 2003 13:18:53 -0000 Issue 627 15055 by: Joseph H Horton 15058 by: Mark Jones 15063 by: Rick Wilson Pilgrimage 15056 by: Mark Langford 15066 by: virgnvs.juno.com Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. 15057 by: Frank Ross 15060 by: Richard.Cowles 15061 by: Mark Jones 15062 by: norm-ruth Flight training 15059 by: Darren Pond Sonic Boom 15065 by: Patrick Driscoll Administrivia: To subscribe to the digest, e-mail: To unsubscribe from the digest, e-mail: To post to the list, e-mail: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 08:02:43 -0600 To: From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Update Message-ID: <002501c2d043$ea964ca0$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Bob, you also mentioned a crust surface on the foams you used. Ant expanding foam, regardless of the brand will have a slick crust surface. It just happens the Urethane Instafoam is very thin as far as the crust goes and does not hamper sanding at all. Once you start sanding you will notice how much different this foam is compared to any others you have tried. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Stone" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 7:19 AM Subject: Re: KR> Update > Mark, > Thanks much, I will take your advice and use the foam from Wicks. > > Bob Stone > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Jones" > To: > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:34 PM > Subject: Re: KR> Update > > > > Robert, > > What I use is a two part "Urethane Instafoam" from Wicks Aircraft Supply. > > They sell it in 4lb (part #INSTFM-1/2G $13), 8lb (INSTFM-1 $23) and 24lb > > (INSTFN-3 $60) kits. This is a 50-50 mixture and is 2lb density. Sands > very > > easily. Be careful though...this stuff sticks to everything it touches. I > > have tried the spray foams...just don't work. The 2-part Urethane > Instafoam > > is the only way to go. Page 22 of Wicks 2002 catalog. > > > > Mark Jones (N886MJ) > > Wales, WI USA > > E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > > Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > > http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Robert Stone" > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:22 PM > > Subject: Re: KR> Update > > > > > > > Mark, > > > Almost every foam I have used to fill, that is a two part mix or > out > > of > > > a spray can dries with a hard crust that must be removed prior to > sanding > > to > > > shape. Have you had this same problem. If not, what brand of foam are > > you > > > using and where is it available. > > > > > > Bob Stone, Harker Heights, TX > > > rstone4@hot.rr.com > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Mark Jones" > > > To: "KR-Net" > > > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 7:43 PM > > > Subject: KR> Update > > > > > > > > > Photo of The Week section on my web page has been updated again. > > > > > > Mark Jones (N886MJ) > > > Wales, WI USA > > > E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > > > Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > > > http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 12:07:40 -0600 To: From: "Robert Stone" Subject: Re: KR> Update Message-ID: <000a01c2d066$25ac84e0$05d81a18@hot.rr.com> Mark, As I said, I will try the stuff from Wicks. I have never been very good at cutting a piece of foam to fit without gaps so I need to find a good foam filler and with your information, I think I have. Thanks again. Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Jones" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 8:02 AM Subject: Re: KR> Update > Bob, you also mentioned a crust surface on the foams you used. Ant expanding > foam, regardless of the brand will have a slick crust surface. It just > happens the Urethane Instafoam is very thin as far as the crust goes and > does not hamper sanding at all. Once you start sanding you will notice how > much different this foam is compared to any others you have tried. > > Mark Jones (N886MJ) > Wales, WI USA > E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Stone" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 7:19 AM > Subject: Re: KR> Update > > > > Mark, > > Thanks much, I will take your advice and use the foam from Wicks. > > > > Bob Stone > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Mark Jones" > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:34 PM > > Subject: Re: KR> Update > > > > > > > Robert, > > > What I use is a two part "Urethane Instafoam" from Wicks Aircraft > Supply. > > > They sell it in 4lb (part #INSTFM-1/2G $13), 8lb (INSTFM-1 $23) and > 24lb > > > (INSTFN-3 $60) kits. This is a 50-50 mixture and is 2lb density. Sands > > very > > > easily. Be careful though...this stuff sticks to everything it touches. > I > > > have tried the spray foams...just don't work. The 2-part Urethane > > Instafoam > > > is the only way to go. Page 22 of Wicks 2002 catalog. > > > > > > Mark Jones (N886MJ) > > > Wales, WI USA > > > E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > > > Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > > > http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Robert Stone" > > > To: > > > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 8:22 PM > > > Subject: Re: KR> Update > > > > > > > > > > Mark, > > > > Almost every foam I have used to fill, that is a two part mix or > > out > > > of > > > > a spray can dries with a hard crust that must be removed prior to > > sanding > > > to > > > > shape. Have you had this same problem. If not, what brand of foam > are > > > you > > > > using and where is it available. > > > > > > > > Bob Stone, Harker Heights, TX > > > > rstone4@hot.rr.com > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Mark Jones" > > > > To: "KR-Net" > > > > Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 7:43 PM > > > > Subject: KR> Update > > > > > > > > > > > > Photo of The Week section on my web page has been updated again. > > > > > > > > Mark Jones (N886MJ) > > > > Wales, WI USA > > > > E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com > > > > Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at > > > > http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 07:24:04 -0700 To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Ron Lee Subject: Re: KR> kr flight training( need help.) Message-Id: <5.1.0.14.0.20030209072306.00a257a0@127.0.0.1> Here is the link for one RV school. http://www.vansaircraft.com/public/trainfly.htm Ron Lee Made hotel reservation for Red Oak! At 06:03 AM 2/9/03 -0800, you wrote: >If you cannot find someone, you might consider RV school. I believe there >is one in Seattle. A chapter member finished her RV last year and spent a >week in RV school somewhere in Washington. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 10:30:58 -0500 To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: KRnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Lights, Strobes and cheap shortcuts Message-ID: <20030209.103328.-522083.1.virgnvs@juno.com> Use the Plastic canopy's that are sold in hobby shops, Virg On Sat, 08 Feb 2003 07:18:25 -0600 larry flesner writes: > >Better yet.. make a male mold... get a high temp heat gun.. and you > can > >drape the plastic over the mold while carefully heating it with the > heat > >gun.. I have created a couple of different light 'lenses' this > way.. > >Vince > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > A "ready to use" lense can be had from the the dispensing machines > for kids that sell the small football helments, etc. for 50 cents > (US). > They are a perfect dome of about 1.5 inches diameter and 1.5 inches > tall. I bought one dozen of them on a yard sale for $1.00. I plan > to epoxy one to the fuselage (after painting) over each strobe > tube. > I'm using the Radio Shack strobes cut down to only the circuit > board > with enough of the case to hold it and have them mounted on rubber > blocks in the fuselage. Two screws removes the assembly and the > lense stays glued to the fuselage. > > Larry Flesner > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > Virgil N. Salisbury AMSOIL WWW.LUBEDEALER.COM/SALISBURY ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 12:30:17 -0500 To: From: "Leigh Plymale" Subject: Epoxy and T88 Message-ID: <006801c2d060$e9e2fc00$58224044@chvlva.adelphia.net> ------=_NextPart_000_0065_01C2D037.00A83EC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable OK before I am chastised for not consulting the archives I looked for = about 1/2 hour reading what looked promising. I have gathered that T88 = is an epoxy for wood bonding. West is OK for fiberglassing and most = thought it would be OK for wood bonding as well. So my question is this, = does any one have any info on real world set up time for T88 and West = slow cure. I'm kinda worried about the time it will take to staple down = the plywood to the spruce. I have only moderate experience with West but = a friend is building an Osprey and I like the results. Also in order to = "Build light and it will be right" I intend to use mahogany for its = light weight and I think it is beautiful wood. I was hoping to turn the = fuse sides over after stapling and clean up excess glue most especially = in the cockpit area. This would allow for a seal coat of epoxy or = urethane and would show off that beautiful expensive wood. Also I can = save the weight of upholstery or carpeting. Any thoughts? Leigh Plymale flyboy232@adelphia.net ------=_NextPart_000_0065_01C2D037.00A83EC0-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:53:47 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time) To: From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> Epoxy and T88 Message-Id: <3E46F81B.000001.01216@dan> --------------Boundary-00=_NHI2QL80000000000000 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable T88 is very slow, you should have all the time you need. Besides, you wi= ll probably only mix up a little at a time.=0D =0D N64KR=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Red Oak - 2003=0D =0D See our KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Click on the pic=0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: KRnet@mailinglists.org=0D Date: Sunday, February 09, 2003 09:31:21 AM=0D To: krnet@mailinglists.org=0D Subject: KR> Epoxy and T88=0D =0D OK before I am chastised for not consulting the archives I looked for abo= ut 1/2 hour reading what looked promising. I have gathered that T88 is an ep= oxy for wood bonding. West is OK for fiberglassing and most thought it would = be OK for wood bonding as well. So my question is this, does any one have an= y info on real world set up time for T88 and West slow cure. I'm kinda worr= ied about the time it will take to staple down the plywood to the spruce. I h= ave only moderate experience with West but a friend is building an Osprey and= I like the results. Also in order to "Build light and it will be right" I intend to use mahogany for its light weight and I think it is beautiful w= ood I was hoping to turn the fuse sides over after stapling and clean up exc= ess glue most especially in the cockpit area. This would allow for a seal coa= t of epoxy or urethane and would show off that beautiful expensive wood. Al= so I can save the weight of upholstery or carpeting.=0D =0D Any thoughts?=0D =0D Leigh Plymale=0D flyboy232@adelphia.net --------------Boundary-00=_NHI2QL80000000000000-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 09:40:31 -0800 To: KRnet@mailinglists.org, KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Ross Youngblood Subject: T-Tails Message-Id: My take on T-Tails... In the mid to late '70's T tails seemed popular, both on sailplanes, powered GA aircraft, and commercial aircraft. (Mc Donnal Douglas MD-80). I started flying sailplanes around that time, and some of the coolest sailplanes had T-tails... the 1-35 from Schweizer aircraft in Elmira New York comes to mind. One of the pluses for powered aircraft was that the elevator was out of the prop wash (I think). Plus I read somewhere that Marketing people found that they looked "cool" and helped sell airplanes. The biggest negative is that in a deep stall, ( in theory at least) the elevator will be in the disturbed area of the wing. In this area it becomes ineffective to correct the stall. (So conventional wisdom states) In a normally tailed aircraft the horizental elevator is below this disturbed area and remains effective. I suspect that this is all hogwash. I did some of my primary training in a Piper Tomahawk (Trama-Hawk as they later became known). Coming from sailplanes, I tended to use full stick back to force a stall, and full stick forward to correct, and never had any problems. If I recall I even did some spin training in the Piper, with no ill effects... although we didn't sit and let the thing rotate lots of turns like I did once in a 2-33 training glider (we had to loose 10,000 feet so I could get the plane back for the next student). --- Ross 2/8/2003 8:14:45 PM, "kevin" wrote: >I always thought the "T" tail was a bad idea. I learned to fly in a Piper >Tomahawk. It was ok, but have you ever looked back at one in a full hard >stall? That tail really flexes up and down. The "T" tailed Piper Arrows >are worth less than the standard tails. You cannot raise the nose on a T >tail as quickly as you can on a standard tail for times like short field >takeoffs. This guys "T" isn't all the way to the top of the vertical >stabilizer. I like the looks of his "T" tail and it seems he gave it a lot >of thought. I wonder if he plans any external bracing? > >Kevin. > > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Brian J Bland" >To: >Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 6:26 PM >Subject: KR> T Tail KR > > >> I remember seeing something in the newsletter about a KR being built with >a >> T tail. Does anyone remember this? I will try to find where I saw it. >> >> Brian J Bland >> Claremore, OK >> >> mailto:bruiser@dellepro.com >> >> >> --- >> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. >> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). >> Version: 6.0.408 / Virus Database: 230 - Release Date: 10/24/2002 >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" >> >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> >> See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >> or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files >> >> > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > >To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > Ross Youngblood http://N541RY.com mailto:rossy65@attbi.com (Home) mailto:ross_youngblood@credence.com (Work) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:33:45 EST To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: WMartensJr@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> T-Tails Message-ID: --part1_a4.3390ff1f.2b77f909_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/9/2003 12:37:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, rossy65@attbi.com writes: > One of the pluses for powered aircraft was that the elevator > was out of the prop wash (I think). Plus I read somewhere > that Marketing people found that they looked "cool" and helped > sell airplanes. > Actually that would be a negative for the T-tail. With the tail surface IN the prop wash you can still get effective control out of the tail surfaces even in a deep stall using prop wash. Makes for some fun aerobatics. Watch Shawn Tucker in his Pitts sometime and you'll see what I mean. Not exactly what a general aviation aircraft would be doing but having the ability to put a little blast over the tail in a croswind situation has helped me recover from an unexpected gust right before touchdown. The T-tail also makes for a slower takeoff as the aircraft needs to be going at a higher speed before the air over the stab reaches effective control speed. Those pilots who have never flown one, Tomahawk, would find the elevator/rudder to be a bit mushy or slow to respond in slow flight regimes compared to a KR or even a C-152 or small Grumman aircraft like my father's AA-1A. Man I love flying that thing. > The biggest negative is that in a deep stall, ( in theory at > least) the elevator will be in the disturbed area of the wing. > In this area it becomes ineffective to correct the stall. > (So conventional wisdom states) In a normally tailed aircraft > the horizental elevator is below this disturbed area and remains > effective. > > I suspect that this is all hogwash. I did some of my primary > training in a Piper Tomahawk (Trama-Hawk as they later became known). > Coming from sailplanes, I tended to use full stick back to force a > stall, and full stick forward to correct, and never had any problems. > If I recall I even did some spin training in the Piper, with no > ill effects... although we didn't sit and let the thing rotate lots > of turns like I did once in a 2-33 training glider (we had to loose > 10,000 feet so I could get the plane back for the next student). It's not hogwash for the above stated reasons, T-Tail out of prop-wash gives up low speed control, and getting blanked by disturbed air from the wing is no joke either. Admittedly it's a rare occurance as you need to be in a fairly highly loaded situation, i.e. pulling substantial G in a turn or what have you, but it does happen. Departure situations are most common. Just as importanly though they have some disadvantages in uncontrolled situations such as spins. yes the Traumahawk isn't supposed to be spun but if you were to enter into a spin inadvertantly there is a much larger load imparted to the stab/fuselage juncture in recovery. Failures did occur in that aircraft in just such a situation. In truth though, it's a pretty safe aircraft, just a few different flight characteristics but nice enough when flown within it's restrictions. Interesting story. Whenever I think of Tomohawks I can't help but remember a situation flying out of Downtown Airport in OKC a few years ago. A friend of mine ran a small charter operation, chief pilot. Paul used to let me fly right seat in a truly beautiful Baron they had on lease-back. We took off one day for Kansas and headed south. On departure levelling off at 2100ft I noticed a Tomahawk off our ten-oclock position, had to be from the flight school down in Norman as they ran up into the OKC airspace and back regulary for proficiency. I'd just asked Paul if he thought the Tomahawk saw us as we were co-altitude and he was barely over a quarter mile away. I no sooner asked him that and the T-bird made a turn that would perfect ly place us into occupation of the same airspace. Paul said "I guess he didn't see us." Next thing I know Paul said he'd wake him up a bit to teach him to scan the sky before initiating a turn and took over control of the aircraft. Paul banked us hard left so we stood on the left wing while we both leaned forward and peered out the top of the windscreen to keep visual contact. You should have seen how quickly that T-bird changed it's flight path as he noticed the big white cross with two engines occupying the sky in front of him! Might not have been all that nice a thing to do but I bet he scanned the sky before turns after that. Course he probably had to change his shorts also. Regards, Walt Walter Martens Virginia --part1_a4.3390ff1f.2b77f909_boundary-- ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 10:54:02 -0500 (EST) To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Kevin Subject: Re: Re: KR> T-Tails Message-ID: <4443681.1044816843249.JavaMail.nobody@bert.psp.pas.earthlink.net> I went from the Tomohawk to my purchased '76 Grumman Tr2. The elevator was by far the biggest difference. That was one touchy dude! The Grummans are fun to fly. I have never flown one of the round wing early Yankees, but it has to be that much more fun. Kevin. -------Original Message------- From: WMartensJr@aol.com Sent: 02/09/03 01:33 PM To: KRnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> T-Tails > > In a message dated 2/9/2003 12:37:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, rossy65@attbi.com writes: > One of the pluses for powered aircraft was that the elevator > was out of the prop wash (I think). Plus I read somewhere > that Marketing people found that they looked "cool" and helped > sell airplanes. > Actually that would be a negative for the T-tail. With the tail surface IN the prop wash you can still get effective control out of the tail surfaces even in a deep stall using prop wash. Makes for some fun aerobatics. Watch Shawn Tucker in his Pitts sometime and you'll see what I mean. Not exactly what a general aviation aircraft would be doing but having the ability to put a little blast over the tail in a croswind situation has helped me recover from an unexpected gust right before touchdown. The T-tail also makes for a slower takeoff as the aircraft needs to be going at a higher speed before the air over the stab reaches effective control speed. Those pilots who have never flown one, Tomahawk, would find the elevator/rudder to be a bit mushy or slow to respond in slow flight regimes compared to a KR or even a C-152 or small Grumman aircraft like my father's AA-1A. Man I love flying that thing. > The biggest negative is that in a deep stall, ( in theory at > least) the elevator will be in the disturbed area of the wing. > In this area it becomes ineffective to correct the stall. > (So conventional wisdom states) In a normally tailed aircraft > the horizental elevator is below this disturbed area and remains > effective. > > I suspect that this is all hogwash. I did some of my primary > training in a Piper Tomahawk (Trama-Hawk as they later became known). > Coming from sailplanes, I tended to use full stick back to force a > stall, and full stick forward to correct, and never had any problems. > If I recall I even did some spin training in the Piper, with no > ill effects... although we didn't sit and let the thing rotate lots > of turns like I did once in a 2-33 training glider (we had to loose > 10,000 feet so I could get the plane back for the next student). It's not hogwash for the above stated reasons, T-Tail out of prop-wash gives up low speed control, and getting blanked by disturbed air from the wing is no joke either. Admittedly it's a rare occurance as you need to be in a fairly highly loaded situation, i.e. pulling substantial G in a turn or what have you, but it does happen. Departure situations are most common. Just as importanly though they have some disadvantages in uncontrolled situations such as spins. yes the Traumahawk isn't supposed to be spun but if you were to enter into a spin inadvertantly there is a much larger load imparted to the stab/fuselage juncture in recovery. Failures did occur in that aircraft in just such a situation. In truth though, it's a pretty safe aircraft, just a few different flight characteristics but nice enough when flown within it's restrictions. Interesting story. Whenever I think of Tomohawks I can't help but remember a situation flying out of Downtown Airport in OKC a few years ago. A friend of mine ran a small charter operation, chief pilot. Paul used to let me fly right seat in a truly beautiful Baron they had on lease-back. We took off one day for Kansas and headed south. On departure levelling off at 2100ft I noticed a Tomahawk off our ten-oclock position, had to be from the flight school down in Norman as they ran up into the OKC airspace and back regulary for proficiency. I'd just asked Paul if he thought the Tomahawk saw us as we were co-altitude and he was barely over a quarter mile away. I no sooner asked him that and the T-bird made a turn that would perfect ly place us into occupation of the same airspace. Paul said "I guess he didn't see us." Next thing I know Paul said he'd wake him up a bit to teach him to scan the sky before initiating a turn and took over control of the aircraft. Paul banked us hard left so we stood on the left wing while we both leaned forward and peered out the top of the windscreen to keep visual contact. You should have seen how quickly that T-bird changed it's flight path as he noticed the big white cross with two engines occupying the sky in front of him! Might not have been all that nice a thing to do but I bet he scanned the sky before turns after that. Course he probably had to change his shorts also. Regards, Walt Walter Martens Virginia > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 09:44:38 -0800 To: KRnet@mailinglists.org, KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: Re: KR> Re scarf joints Message-Id: <76QPTQOLEC86A6A5XWOK7YE9LFQKDC.3e469386@cx239334-a> >> Well, I have held off as long as I can. Why scarf joints at all? With >today;s glues, you should be able to put a good butt joint on a slightly >wider stringer and have a solid joint. > The problem with this solution (IMHO) is that it will not gracefully transfer the stresses from one piece to the other, and there will be localized stress concentration points. This will yield space shuttle like results when under stress. -- Ross ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:19:04 -0500 To: krnet@mailinglists.org From: Kenneth L Wiltrout Subject: Re: Re: KR> Re scarf joints Message-ID: <20030209.131905.2364.2.klw1953@juno.com> OK guys I think we beat this scarf joint business to death now. For the last 20 or more years this was the recommended and accepted practice of creating an overlapping glue joint in plywood. It has been proven time and time again. After sanding the plywood blow off the dust and glue----------that's all there is to it. On Sun, 09 Feb 2003 09:44:38 -0800 Ross Youngblood writes: > >> Well, I have held off as long as I can. Why scarf joints at all? > With > >today;s glues, you should be able to put a good butt joint on a > slightly > >wider stringer and have a solid joint. > > > The problem with this solution (IMHO) is that it will not gracefully > > transfer the stresses from one piece to the other, and there will > be localized stress concentration points. This will yield space > shuttle like results when under stress. > > -- Ross > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > ________________________________________________________________ Sign Up for Juno Platinum Internet Access Today Only $9.95 per month! Visit www.juno.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 09 Feb 2003 09:49:13 -0800 To: KRnet@mailinglists.org, greenr2@earthlink.net From: Ross Youngblood Subject: Re: RE: KR> a long x/c with about 5 cups of coffee Message-Id: This reminds me of my first reall long X-C in a rented Mooney from Eugene, OR to Scottsdale, AZ. On my second day from Bakersfield California back home (at the time).... I field IFR and was enjoying the fact that ATC took care of me and all I had to do was update the auto-pilot... much nicer than the 152's I used to rent. So, I had to go... and I'm past Needles, CA and there is nothing really around worth stopping for... so I grab a water bottle and proceed to "C A R E F U L L Y" fill it (using two hands). At this time, ATC who has been silent for the last 30-45 minutes calls me and says... Mooney 201 Echo Tango... contact Alberquerqe Center on 123.45 (you get the idea).... so I had to "stop" what I was doing, find the PTT switch, and the radio frequency knob, to aknowledge and switch frequencies, and make my new call-up to ABQ center. Murphys Law... the rest of the flight was uneventful. -- Ross 2/9/2003 3:29:52 AM, "Richard Green" wrote: >Some of the Aero Commander twins have a pilot relief tube >installed under the pilots seat that ports out under the >the plane. It can really come in handy on long flights. >Sounds like some of you might need to consider >adding that convenience to your KRs. > >-----Original Message----- >From: william walsh [mailto:billyboywalsh@yahoo.com] >Sent: Saturday, February 08, 2003 11:43 PM >To: KRnet@mailinglists.org >Subject: Re: KR> LED nav lights > > >that was gooooood. that sounds just about what happend > >to me on a long x/c out a few hundred miles from the >nearest airport with about 5 cups of coffee. the bad >thing about that was i only had one cup in the plane >and my freinds did't bring any soap for the shower. >thanks now i don't feel so bad. i am not so sure my >friends have got over it yet. i tell them that >i won't drink any thing before we fly any more. >but they still don't trust me. >thanks again >william > > >--- Leigh Plymale wrote: >> Thanks Oscar I had a bad day Friday and reading this >> was the lift I needed >> :-} >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Oscar Zuniga" >> To: >> Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:50 AM >> Subject: KR> LED nav lights >> >> >> > Has anyone on the list experimented with LEDs for >> nav lights? All the new >> > cars seem to have 'em instead of filament type >> bulbs, and the obvious >> > advantages are extremely long life (maybe could >> even be sealed in rather >> > than have to be accessible) and low power draw. >> > >> > And, since it's Friday, here's something from a >> Piet list member, >> regarding >> > avoiding intermediate stops on x-c flights: >> > >> > >Remind me to tell you sometime of when I was 17 >> on a solo >> > >cross country (after drinking a half-gallon of >> root beer >> > >on a hot day while pre-flighting). In my infinite >> wisdom, I >> > >decided to try and pee out the side window of a >> 172. >> > > >> > >The radios did work after they dried out...... >> > >> > Oscar Zuniga >> > San Antonio, TX >> > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com >> > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> >_________________________________________________________________ >> > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months >> FREE* >> > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail >> > >> > >> > >> >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org >> , NOT "reply all" >> > >> > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: >> krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> > For additional commands, e-mail: >> krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> > >> > See the KRNet archives at >> http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >> > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files >> > >> >> >> >> >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >> To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , >> NOT "reply all" >> >> To UNsubscribe, e-mail: >> krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: >> krnet-help@mailinglists.org >> >> See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >> or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files >> > > >__________________________________________________ >Do you Yahoo!? >Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. >http://mailplus.yahoo.com > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > >To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------- >To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > >To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org >For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > >See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp >or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > Ross Youngblood http://N541RY.com mailto:rossy65@attbi.com (Home) mailto:ross_youngblood@credence.com (Work) ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:27:06 -0500 To: From: "bill kirkland" Subject: Re: KR> LED nav lights Message-ID: <003e01c2d068$d9f9d400$eb942a18@lndn.phub.net.cable.rogers.com> We had a fellow who was trying to fulfill a friends request to scatter his ashes over the countryside. He tried to toss then out the window. Most of them came bacck inside the airplane. hell ofa job to clean up but in one way his friend is still flying. W.G.(Bill) KIRKLAND kirkland@vianet.on.ca ----- Original Message ----- From: "william walsh" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 12:42 AM Subject: Re: KR> LED nav lights > that was gooooood. that sounds just about what happend > > to me on a long x/c out a few hundred miles from the > nearest airport with about 5 cups of coffee. the bad > thing about that was i only had one cup in the plane > and my freinds did't bring any soap for the shower. > thanks now i don't feel so bad. i am not so sure my > friends have got over it yet. i tell them that > i won't drink any thing before we fly any more. > but they still don't trust me. > thanks again > william > > > --- Leigh Plymale wrote: > > Thanks Oscar I had a bad day Friday and reading this > > was the lift I needed > > :-} > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Oscar Zuniga" > > To: > > Sent: Friday, February 07, 2003 8:50 AM > > Subject: KR> LED nav lights > > > > > > > Has anyone on the list experimented with LEDs for > > nav lights? All the new > > > cars seem to have 'em instead of filament type > > bulbs, and the obvious > > > advantages are extremely long life (maybe could > > even be sealed in rather > > > than have to be accessible) and low power draw. > > > > > > And, since it's Friday, here's something from a > > Piet list member, > > regarding > > > avoiding intermediate stops on x-c flights: > > > > > > >Remind me to tell you sometime of when I was 17 > > on a solo > > > >cross country (after drinking a half-gallon of > > root beer > > > >on a hot day while pre-flighting). In my infinite > > wisdom, I > > > >decided to try and pee out the side window of a > > 172. > > > > > > > >The radios did work after they dried out...... > > > > > > Oscar Zuniga > > > San Antonio, TX > > > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > > > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months > > FREE* > > > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org > > , NOT "reply all" > > > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > > > See the KRNet archives at > > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , > > NOT "reply all" > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > See the KRNet archives at > > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:59:28 -0500 To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Joseph H Horton Subject: Re: krnet Digest 9 Feb 2003 13:18:53 -0000 Issue 627 Message-ID: <20030209.135929.-227067.0.joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com> Guys, I finished installing all the plumbing for my Cleveland brakes last night. The instructions that I got don't seem complete. The thing that I'm not sure of at this point is how are they to be filled with fluid? From the hole in the top of the cylinders or through the tube from the calipers? Or some other way? The thread about strobe and position lights- what I have planned for position lights is that I bought just surplus red and green lenses at SNF and plan on using Clear 1157 bulbs in each building my own housing into the wing tips. Mark Jones -I see you installed a light in the bottom. Is this instead of the tail light? I keep confusing myself on which way would be best. I have the light but can't decide where to put it. Thanks in advance -- Joe Horton PS - Mark,, I wish you would have done your stubs 5 or 6 weeks ago. Putting that little piece of ply at the trailing edge looks a lot easier than the sand, check, and compare method that I did. It looks great. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 14:22:49 -0600 To: From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Re: krnet Digest 9 Feb 2003 13:18:53 -0000 Issue 627 Message-ID: <007901c2d079$04614920$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> > Mark Jones -I see you installed a light in the bottom. Is this instead > of the tail light? I keep confusing myself on which way would be best. I > have the light but can't decide where to put it. Actually, I will have fory storbes. One on each wing tip. one on the fuselage top and one on the fuselage bottom. Also, I will have position lights. red and green on the wing tips and a white on the back of the rudder. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:30:21 -0800 (PST) To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Rick Wilson Subject: Re: KR> Re: krnet Digest 9 Feb 2003 13:18:53 -0000 Issue 627 Message-ID: <20030209213021.4787.qmail@web21207.mail.yahoo.com> Joe, The best way I've found to put brake fluid in is to put it in through the bleed valve. This way air is forced out of the system as it is filled. I use a good quality oil squirt can with a piece of tubing pushed over the end of the tube and pushed over the end of the bleed valve. Open the valve and squirt fluid in until the reservoir is full, then close the bleed valve and remove the tubing. You need to remove the plug from the top of the reservoir until it is full, then replace it and it's done. Maybe this will help. Rick Wilson. rwdw2002@yahoo.com --- Joseph H Horton wrote: > Guys, > I finished installing all the plumbing for my > Cleveland brakes last > night. The instructions that I got don't seem > complete. The thing that > I'm not sure of at this point is how are they to be > filled with fluid? > From the hole in the top of the cylinders or through > the tube from the > calipers? Or some other way? > The thread about strobe and position lights- what I > have planned for > position lights is that I bought just surplus red > and green lenses at SNF > and plan on using Clear 1157 bulbs in each building > my own housing into > the wing tips. > Mark Jones -I see you installed a light in the > bottom. Is this instead > of the tail light? I keep confusing myself on which > way would be best. I > have the light but can't decide where to put it. > Thanks in advance -- Joe Horton > PS - Mark,, I wish you would have done your stubs 5 > or 6 weeks ago. > Putting that little piece of ply at the trailing > edge looks a lot easier > than the sand, check, and compare method that I did. > It looks great. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , > NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: > krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: > krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:37:41 -0600 To: "krnet" From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Pilgrimage Message-ID: <135901c2d072$b66078a0$2402a8c0@800Athlon> Well, the pilrimage is over. Seven or eight folks showed up, and a good time was had by all. Dana brought one of his RV-7 flaps, and "assembled" it from a pile of parts into a clecoed assembly in under five minutes (see http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/03020808m.jpg ). Another hour of squeezing rivets, and that flap would be ready for primer and paint. Try THAT on a KR. Miles Humphrey probably had visions of RVs dancing in his head as he drove back to Iowa today, and I wouldn't blame him! I posted a photo of the group at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/03020813m.jpg . Left to right are Rick Johnson and son, Bob Lee, Richard Cowles, Mike Wolf, Miles Humphrey, Ron Thomas, Dana Overall, and me. We did a lot of talking about stuff like KRnet characters, Home Depot plywood, and KR construction methods, among other things. Thanks for coming, and we'll see you at the Gathering... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL mailto:langford@hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 17:47:07 -0500 To: langford@hiwaay.net From: virgnvs@juno.com Cc: krnet@mailinglists.org Subject: Re: KR> Pilgrimage Message-ID: <20030209.175150.-475691.5.virgnvs@juno.com> SEE YOU AT LAKELAND, Virg On Sun, 9 Feb 2003 13:37:41 -0600 "Mark Langford" writes: > Well, the pilrimage is over. Seven or eight folks showed up, and a > good > time was had by all. Dana brought one of his RV-7 flaps, and > "assembled" it > from a pile of parts into a clecoed assembly in under five minutes > (see > http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/03020808m.jpg ). Another hour of > squeezing > rivets, and that flap would be ready for primer and paint. Try THAT > on a > KR. Miles Humphrey probably had visions of RVs dancing in his head > as he > drove back to Iowa today, and I wouldn't blame him! > > I posted a photo of the group at > http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/03020813m.jpg . Left to right are > Rick > Johnson and son, Bob Lee, Richard Cowles, Mike Wolf, Miles > Humphrey, Ron > Thomas, Dana Overall, and me. We did a lot of talking about stuff > like > KRnet characters, Home Depot plywood, and KR construction methods, > among > other things. > > Thanks for coming, and we'll see you at the Gathering... > > Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL > mailto:langford@hiwaay.net > see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply > all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > Virgil N. Salisbury AMSOIL WWW.LUBEDEALER.COM/SALISBURY ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 12:14:46 -0800 (PST) To: KRnet@mailinglists.org From: Frank Ross Subject: Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. Message-ID: <20030209201446.26463.qmail@web40902.mail.yahoo.com> So, does this explain why women won't fly with us? Or, is it just me? Don't know if I could keep a KR flying AND operate a 'relief tube' too. Sounds like someone could make a lot of money selling 'Depends' at the Gatherings. Ross, good to hear from you again. Hope things are going well for you and yours. Frank Ross in San Antonio, TX --- Ross Youngblood wrote: > This reminds me of my first reall long X-C in a > rented Mooney > from Eugene, OR to Scottsdale, AZ. On my second > day from > Bakersfield California back home (at the time).... I > field > IFR and was enjoying the fact that ATC took care of > me > and all I had to do was update the auto-pilot... > much nicer > than the 152's I used to rent. > > So, I had to go... and I'm past Needles, CA and > there is > nothing really around worth stopping for... so I > grab a > water bottle and proceed to "C A R E F U L L Y" fill > it > (using two hands). > > At this time, ATC who has been silent for the last > 30-45 > minutes calls me and says... > Mooney 201 Echo Tango... contact Alberquerqe Center > on > 123.45 (you get the idea).... so I had to "stop" > what I > was doing, find the PTT switch, and the radio > frequency > knob, to aknowledge and switch frequencies, and make > my > new call-up to ABQ center. Murphys Law... the rest > of > the flight was uneventful. > > -- Ross __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 15:03:05 -0600 To: From: "Richard.Cowles" Subject: Re: KR> Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. Message-ID: <002101c2d07e$a4352c00$1a2ad618@knology.net> If you would use a Texas condom catheter, you would not have to land. Old glider pilot trick for long flights. Richard Cowles richardcowles@knology.net ----- Original Message ----- From: "Frank Ross" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 2:14 PM Subject: KR> Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. > So, does this explain why women won't fly with us? > Or, is it just me? > Don't know if I could keep a KR flying AND operate a > 'relief tube' too. > Sounds like someone could make a lot of money selling > 'Depends' at the Gatherings. > Ross, good to hear from you again. > Hope things are going well for you and yours. > > Frank Ross in San Antonio, TX > > --- Ross Youngblood wrote: > > This reminds me of my first reall long X-C in a > > rented Mooney > > from Eugene, OR to Scottsdale, AZ. On my second > > day from > > Bakersfield California back home (at the time).... I > > field > > IFR and was enjoying the fact that ATC took care of > > me > > and all I had to do was update the auto-pilot... > > much nicer > > than the 152's I used to rent. > > > > So, I had to go... and I'm past Needles, CA and > > there is > > nothing really around worth stopping for... so I > > grab a > > water bottle and proceed to "C A R E F U L L Y" fill > > it > > (using two hands). > > > > At this time, ATC who has been silent for the last > > 30-45 > > minutes calls me and says... > > Mooney 201 Echo Tango... contact Alberquerqe Center > > on > > 123.45 (you get the idea).... so I had to "stop" > > what I > > was doing, find the PTT switch, and the radio > > frequency > > knob, to aknowledge and switch frequencies, and make > > my > > new call-up to ABQ center. Murphys Law... the rest > > of > > the flight was uneventful. > > > > -- Ross > > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 15:14:47 -0600 To: From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. Message-ID: <008701c2d080$46772580$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Come on guys, lets stop pi$$ing in the wind and get back to KR building. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html > If you would use a Texas condom catheter, you would not have to land. Old > glider pilot trick for long flights. > > > ----- Original Message ----- >> > > So, does this explain why women won't fly with us? > > Or, is it just me? > > Don't know if I could keep a KR flying AND operate a > > 'relief tube' too. > > Sounds like someone could make a lot of money selling > > 'Depends' at the Gatherings. >> > ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:30:37 -0800 To: "krnet" From: "norm-ruth" Subject: Fw: KR> Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. Message-ID: <004b01c2d09b$a3d44120$d3c13a41@pavilion> What is blazes is a Texas condom catheter. Norm ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard.Cowles" To: Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 1:03 PM Subject: Re: KR> Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. > If you would use a Texas condom catheter, you would not have to land. Old > glider pilot trick for long flights. > > Richard Cowles > richardcowles@knology.net > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Frank Ross" > To: > Sent: Sunday, February 09, 2003 2:14 PM > Subject: KR> Bladder control, Flying KRs with 'relief tubes', etc. > > > > So, does this explain why women won't fly with us? > > Or, is it just me? > > Don't know if I could keep a KR flying AND operate a > > 'relief tube' too. > > Sounds like someone could make a lot of money selling > > 'Depends' at the Gatherings. > > Ross, good to hear from you again. > > Hope things are going well for you and yours. > > > > Frank Ross in San Antonio, TX > > > > --- Ross Youngblood wrote: > > > This reminds me of my first reall long X-C in a > > > rented Mooney > > > from Eugene, OR to Scottsdale, AZ. On my second > > > day from > > > Bakersfield California back home (at the time).... I > > > field > > > IFR and was enjoying the fact that ATC took care of > > > me > > > and all I had to do was update the auto-pilot... > > > much nicer > > > than the 152's I used to rent. > > > > > > So, I had to go... and I'm past Needles, CA and > > > there is > > > nothing really around worth stopping for... so I > > > grab a > > > water bottle and proceed to "C A R E F U L L Y" fill > > > it > > > (using two hands). > > > > > > At this time, ATC who has been silent for the last > > > 30-45 > > > minutes calls me and says... > > > Mooney 201 Echo Tango... contact Alberquerqe Center > > > on > > > 123.45 (you get the idea).... so I had to "stop" > > > what I > > > was doing, find the PTT switch, and the radio > > > frequency > > > knob, to aknowledge and switch frequencies, and make > > > my > > > new call-up to ABQ center. Murphys Law... the rest > > > of > > > the flight was uneventful. > > > > > > -- Ross > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > Do you Yahoo!? > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files > > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To post to the list, email: krnet@mailinglists.org , NOT "reply all" > > To UNsubscribe, e-mail: krnet-unsubscribe@mailinglists.org > For additional commands, e-mail: krnet-help@mailinglists.org > > See the KRNet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > or http://www.bouyea.net/ for the Word files ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 16:03:48 -0500 To: "KR Net" From: "Darren Pond" Subject: Flight training Message-ID: HI Guys. Say are there any female KR net people out there? Just so I politically correct and all. The builder and pilot of my new to me KR may be interested in do some KR training. He does Tail dragger training in a Cub not far from me. Best contact me directly, any that are interested and I'll pass on the name or check into it for ya. Keep at it. Darren Pond CF-VML Taylor Mono plane almost flying. C-GGGW KR2 1835vw coming to a airport near you this spring PondHopper 2 place 2.2 turbo (building stage) Cambridge Ont Canada pond27@rogers.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 9 Feb 2003 15:47:49 -0600 To: "KR Net Mail" From: "Patrick Driscoll" Subject: Sonic Boom Message-ID: <000a01c2d084$e4a3dd80$bcdc6843@oemcomputer> ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2D052.99525280 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You guys should check out this Hornet breaking the sound barrier. Pat Driscoll http://rense.com/general8/boom.htm ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C2D052.99525280-- ------------------------------ End of krnet Digest ***********************************