From: krnet-request@mylist.net Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 2003 12:00 PM To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 161, Issue 1 Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Materials list (Colin) 2. Re: Message for Brian Krout (Brian Kraut) 3. Re: Message for Brian Krout (William Clapp) 4. Gathering photos (Mark Langford) 5. RE: Aileron Weight (Jim Faughn) 6. aircraft design info (Mark Langford) 7. Re: KR crashes (Jim Sellars) 8. RE: Pushtubes (Scott Cable) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 17:40:49 -0400 From: "Colin" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: KR>Materials list Message-ID: <001401c37c9b$325f7e40$05462141@Beverly> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 1 For anyone interested here is the list Dana gave me; very complete and = reasonable. Here's a pic of the end of my aileron pushtube, the elevator pushtube is = assembled in the same manner. The aileron tube is T6 .035 1.125 as = opposed=20 to the elevator being T6 .035 1.5. The tube inserts for my elevator=20 pushtube are Van's part number VA-101 $11.28, the rob end bearings are=20 MD3616 $13.42 with AN316-6 nuts to lock to the rod ends. The tube is = part=20 number AT60-035x1.5 78" at $19.65. Total cost of a tube for the KR = would be=20 $19.65 with a total cost of $69.05. If you want to pic showing how the bellcrank is assembled using a = bearing,=20 very, very simple install let me know. I left out the pic since he already provided it. Colin Rainey KR2(td) crainey1@cfl.rr.com Sanford, Florida FLY SAFE!!!!From engalt@earthlink.net Tue Sep 16 14:41:05 2003 Received: from albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.120.120]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 19zNZJ-000DK6-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Tue, 16 Sep 2003 14:41:05 -0700 Received: from louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net ([207.217.78.221]) by albatross.mail.pas.earthlink.net with esmtp (Exim 3.33 #1) id 19zNba-0004ns-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Tue, 16 Sep 2003 14:43:26 -0700 Message-ID: <31188291.1063748605972.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 17:43:25 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: Brian Kraut To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>KR crashes Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Earthlink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: Brian Kraut , KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Well put Dana. Thank you. -----Original Message----- From: Dana Overall I'm sure there will be some Monday morning second guessing but if the thread gets started I would encourage those respondants to offer advice on avoiding/responding to unexpected weather conditions and not finger pointing on "what those two did wrong". ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 17:48:03 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: Brian Kraut To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>Message for Brian Krout Message-ID: <30972966.1063748883909.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 2 I am in Jacksonville. Plane is at Craig. There is a KR at Fernandina also, but nobody seems to know who owns it. Kip Laundry from Main has a second house in Palm Coast and he flies his KR down here a few times a year. And I believe you already know Art Bruce. By the way, I spoke to you about selling you the remainder of my Smooth Prime a few months ago. I wound up repainting the wings also and used it all. -----Original Message----- From: William Clapp Sent: Sep 15, 2003 11:14 PM To: KR builders and pilots Subject: KR>Message for Brian Krout Hi Brian - I was wondering where you were located at. I am trying to get an idea where all the local Fl/GA Kr owners are. It would be fun to see how many are down here. I have located a few already and one will possibly visit me this weekend. If interested contact off the Krnet - Thanks - Bill _______________________________________________ see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 18:15:43 -0400 From: "William Clapp" To: "Brian Kraut" , "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>Message for Brian Krout Message-ID: <002201c37ca0$13a1faa0$49fcd241@clapp> References: <30972966.1063748883909.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 3 Brian - what is your email so I can contact off the KR net. I am going to be in the Jax area this week - maybe I can visit by. Thanks Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian Kraut To: KR builders and pilots Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 5:48 PM Subject: Re: KR>Message for Brian Krout > I am in Jacksonville. Plane is at Craig. There is a KR at Fernandina also, but nobody seems to know who owns it. Kip Laundry from Main has a second house in Palm Coast and he flies his KR down here a few times a year. And I believe you already know Art Bruce. > > By the way, I spoke to you about selling you the remainder of my > Smooth Prime a few months ago. I wound up repainting the wings also and used it all. > > -----Original Message----- > From: William Clapp > Sent: Sep 15, 2003 11:14 PM > To: KR builders and pilots > Subject: KR>Message for Brian Krout > > Hi Brian - I was wondering where you were located at. I am trying to > get an idea where all the local Fl/GA Kr owners are. It would be fun to see how many are down here. I have located a few already and one will possibly visit me this weekend. If interested contact off the Krnet - Thanks - Bill > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 20:52:14 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" To: "KRNet" Subject: KR>Gathering photos Message-ID: <160f01c37cbe$53235200$2402a8c0@800Athlon> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 4 OK, I threw some Gathering photos out there, at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/redoak2003/ . Not much commentary, but the pictures say a lot. I'll throw some of the better air-to-air shots out there later as screen savers. The Gathering was a blast, and my hat's off to Terri and Mike Garbez, and Linda and Steve Bennett. Thanks a bunch! Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 16 Sep 2003 22:05:50 -0500 From: "Jim Faughn" To: "'KR builders and pilots'" Subject: RE: KR>Aileron Weight Message-ID: <000701c37cc8$9a8644e0$cb476ad8@jfaughn> In-Reply-To: <003301c37bee$639aad20$6401a8c0@mdgwd52jlrmc3l> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 5 Chris, I updated the site some tonight. Take care and I will be back at Oshkosh next summer. We should look to having about 10 KR's there. Jim -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] On Behalf Of cgardn628 Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 8:04 PM To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>Aileron Weight Glad you made it there and back , Jim. I was following your progress on your web page and wishing I was there. My aileron counterbalance brackets are also Aluminun ( as I'm sure most KR's are) . I made my own brackets from 1/8 " 6061 Al using a large ( 1/2" ) radius to avoid cracking . But after hearing your story , will be checking them regularly for any evidence of cracking. Thanks for the tip. Chris Gardiner C-GKRZ ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Faughn" To: "KR Net Response" Sent: Monday, September 15, 2003 6:27 PM Subject: KR>Aileron Weight > Hi all. I had a great trip to the Gathering this year. You read that I > was stuck in Trenton, MO when I made a no-go decision after looking at > the weather heading up to Red Oak. I have been portrayed as a > conservative pilot and that is a title I like. I enjoyed my time in > lovely Trenton and the airport manager was great. I stayed overnight > and then back to the airport the next morning to watch the clouds go > by. About 2:30 in the afternoon, I had seen the cloud layer stay the > same height for quite awhile so I thought it was time to see if I > really had a 700 ft ceiling. I did and got out of Trenton and headed > to Red Oak. I can't say it stayed that high the entire trip and if I > was doing it over, I would have stayed in Trenton. However, I made it > under the scud and on to a great Gathering. After arriving and the > usual Hi's and initial questions, I unloaded the plane and went flying > with Steve Alderman. We went for a few passes in formation and Steve > told me he saw something fall off my plane. Since I didn't feel > anything I thought it was probably one of the gap seals or part of > one. They are made of a very light Mylar and have broken and come off > in the past. I made another 200 mph missed approach and then came back > around and made a 60 mph pass. I then landed and was looking for the > missing gap seal. None were. What happened was I was missing an > aileron counterweight. The weight didn't fall off, actually the > aluminum L bracket broke at the manufactured corner and the weight > with the arm fell off. This was something that you can't inspect > because it is buried under the fiberglass. At 6:30 I tapped Mike > Garbez and we went to his shop, made a new bracket out of 4130, made > new weights, drilled the holes and brought it back to the hanger. I > assembled most of it Friday evening and quit at 10:30. Finished it up > in about an hour Saturday morning and declared it fit for flight after > inspecting everything another 3 times. > > Everything worked well so I gave rides to the people that were > anticipating their first flight within the next few months. I was very > pleased to do this and that is what I enjoy doing. Sorry about not > jumping to give rides to those who are thinking about a KR or who are > thinking about whether or not to finish one, that just isn't my thing. > I have a passion for keeping people alive who are about to fly but I'm > just not the factory giving rides for motivation or a new sale. The > "new wave" will have to step in for giving rides next year. > > Anyway, the purpose of the message is to acknowledge that I no longer > have a "plans built" KR. I have changed something so Mark, I guess > I've come around. PLEASE think very seriously about changing your > aluminum balance arms to steel. PLEASE. > > Take care. > > Jim > > Jim Faughn > 4323D Laclede Ave. > St. Louis, MO 63108 > (314)652-7659 > Email - sub @ for "at" jfaughn "at" socket.net > Web Site http://jfaughn.com > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html _______________________________________________ see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 06:58:28 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" To: Subject: KR>aircraft design info Message-ID: <003401c37d13$02249b70$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 6 NetHeads, I was downloading the latest version of Airplane PDQ last night and noticed that they also sell a CD of some "experimental design technical documents" for 45 bucks. They have a web page that shows what's included, and I'm pretty sure that every bit of that stuff is available for free on the web. It's a nice list of some of the "biggies" aircraft design and construction, but they also point the way to many other documents on even more obscure stuff that designer/builders are always looking for. If you go to https://www.davincitechnologies.com/ADDLv1.htm?PHPSESSID=bd331bcba64c4bb9959 c5a26a21af745 (make sure you cut and paste EVERYTHING above into ONE line of your browser) and then cut out one of the things you're interested in, such as NACA Report 354, and paste it into Google's "exact phrase" box at http://www.google.com/advanced_search?hl=en , you'll get a list of where this report lives on the web. About the third one down is NASA's site, and the thing is published to the web, waiting for you do download it. This particular one, Aircraft Wood Properties, at http://naca.larc.nasa.gov/reports/1931/naca-report-354/ , answers just about every question a guy could have about wood for aircraft use. The CD is probably worth $45 because it has way more documents than are listed, and puts them all in one nice little bundle for you. And it focuses on the ones that are most important to designer/builders. But the page of links reminded me just how much stuff is out there, and how easy it is to access. I'm not saying "don't ask dumb questions here", but if want to educate yourself, and become an expert YOURSELF, rather than accepting heresay as gospel, the stuff is out there, and easy pickins for those who want to get to the root of the technical information that separates the designers from the wannabees. Rather than being a poor helpless builder with lots of questions, go to the source, you could become an expert, and ANSWER the questions instead... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 12:06:37 -0300 From: "Jim Sellars" To: "Brian Kraut" , "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>KR crashes Message-ID: <001801c37d2d$4d639cc0$93a89aa5@LAPTOP> References: <31188291.1063748605972.JavaMail.root@louie.psp.pas.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 7 Brian and crew; I have need of a new prop having this morning broken another. It was on my KR2 trike and I guess it was a tad long or I ran into a rut on the field, but anyway I need a new one now. I had a 56x58 prop and would very much appreciate if there is anyone out there who has one approximately this size I could buy. Contact me at 506-856-7977 Thanks; Jim ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Kraut" To: "KR builders and pilots" Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 2003 6:43 PM Subject: Re: KR>KR crashes > Well put Dana. Thank you. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Dana Overall > > > I'm sure there will be some Monday morning second guessing but if the thread > gets started I would encourage those respondants to offer advice on > avoiding/responding to unexpected weather conditions and not finger pointing > on "what those two did wrong". > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html > > ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Sep 2003 11:07:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Cable To: kr2cooper@earthlink.net, KR builders and pilots Subject: RE: KR>Pushtubes Message-ID: <20030917180756.80128.qmail@web40810.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <410-220039216173312670@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 8 > http://www.jackandsandycooper.com/stickandpedals.html Nice pedals Jack! I like the way that the Master Cylinders attach to Directly to the pedal itself, thus eliminating any possiblity of differental braking pressure due to the different mounting positions if you were floor mounting the Master Cylinders. By the way, It was a real pleasure meeting you at the gathering. Pretty wild we served so close together in the same unit over in Korea! While I was at the Helicopter Co in Mesa, AZ. WE had a 4/7th Cav reunion of sorts... Turned out that many people that worked on the Apache (either Flight test, assembly or engineering) actually spent time in the 4/7th Cav! About 20 people showed up! God knows where they are now, it was over 12 years when it happened! I wonder how many KR builders and Pilots actually served in the 4th / 7th U.S.Air Cavalry? ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Linden, MI s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! 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