From: krnet-bounces+johnbou=speakeasy.net@mylist.net on behalf of krnet-request@mylist.net Sent: Friday, October 17, 2003 12:00 PM To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 191, Issue 1 Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. KR1 and Bill Stead's Miss Cosmic Wind (Scott Cable) 2. Re: paint (Mark Jones) 3. Re: KR1 and Bill Stead's Miss Cosmic Wind (Dan Heath) 4. Re: Hi Fellow KR netters (Dan Heath) 5. Re: Coaxial cable (KRJerry) 6. pop riveting piano hinge to coulings. (Harold Woods) 7. Re: paint (Mark Langford) 8. Re: paint (Ameet Savant) 9. Justin's Web Page (Mark Jones) 10. fairings (Oscar Zuniga) 11. Re: fairings ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:45:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Cable To: KR builders and pilots Subject: KR>KR1 and Bill Stead's Miss Cosmic Wind Message-ID: <20031016204523.20870.qmail@web40804.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <020701c393f3$b8960000$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 1 Netters, I'm staring at a picture of the Official Program of the 03 Reno Air Races. Under the Air Race History section is a photo of Bill Stead's "MIss Cosmic Wind" She looks amazingly very much like a KR-1 with the exception of: Mid-Wing, with the cheek cowls serving as "leading edge extensions". Was the KR-1 Designed after this beautiful little bird? Is it feasable to make a KR-1 a mid-wing? Without washout and WAF's? Hershey Bar wing? > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 15:53:17 -0500 From: "Mark Jones" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>paint Message-ID: <00a401c39427$87017180$1b65a8c0@insp4100> References: <3F8ECFAD.2020007@newtech.com> <3.0.6.32.20031016124459.007f9100@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 2 A KR of Color......the new wave is coming. Just wait!!! > WHEEW DOGGY, IS THAT THING RED !!!!!! Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 16:54:45 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: Subject: Re: KR>KR1 and Bill Stead's Miss Cosmic Wind Message-ID: <3F8F0595.000001.03216@Computer> References: <20031016204523.20870.qmail@web40804.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 3 Was the KR-1 Designed after this beautiful little bird? =0D =0D No, It is a take off of the Taylor Monoplane.=0D =0D Is it feasable to make a KR-1 a mid-wing? =0D =0D Sure, you can do anything you want to do, but feasable, that depends on w= hat you consider feasable. I would say that the most difficult thing you wou= ld have to deal with would be the spar and seating arrangement. You can, bu= t why not find one that is already designed that way?=0D =0D Hershey Bar wing?=0D =0D Why not?=0D =0D =0D N64KR=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering=0D =0D See our KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Click on the pic=0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =20From matheson@dodo.com.au Thu Oct 16 13:59:28 2003 Received: from 149.32.220.203.comindico.com.au ([203.220.32.149] helo=relay01.kbs.net.au) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1)id 1AAFDT-000H5Z-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 13:59:28 -0700 Received: from [203.220.150.205] (helo=Office) by relay01.kbs.net.au with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AAFHQ-0003Ze-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Fri, 17 Oct 2003 07:03:32 +1000 Message-ID: <003a01c39428$ec844540$cd96dccb@Office> From: "Phil Matheson" To: "KR builders and pilots" References: <1193.66.196.7.98.1066319417.squirrel@www.vvm.com> Subject: Re: KR>Hi Fellow KR netters Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 07:02:47 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Welcome Brian. Happy flying. Phil Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au VH-PKR ( reserved) 61 3 58833588 See our VW Engines and Home built web page at http://www.vw-engines.com/ www.homebuilt-aviation.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:07:08 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: Subject: Re: KR>Hi Fellow KR netters Message-ID: <3F8F087C.000005.03216@Computer> References: <1193.66.196.7.98.1066319417.squirrel@www.vvm.com> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 4 Glad to have you and hope to see you and your plane at Mt. Vernon. =0D =0D N64KR=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering=0D =0D See our KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Click on the pic=0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =20From VANCE@claflinwildcats.com Thu Oct 16 16:57:12 2003 Received: from 63-245-139-250.kitusa.com ([63.245.139.250] helo=mail.claflinwildcats.com) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1)id 1AAHzU-000Jrp-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 16:57:12 -0700 Received: from oemcomputer ([]) by mail.claflinwildcats.com (Merak 5.7.4) with SMTP id EYB37074 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 19:01:03 -0500 Message-ID: <004901c39442$07a349c0$0900a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "JIM VANCE" To: "krnet" Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 19:03:00 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1b3 Subject: KR>Coaxial cable X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: All aircraft radios use 50 ohm cable. Be sure to use RG58 FOAM. The = foam coax has about 1/4 the loss of the regular RG58. You can buy it at = any two-way communications shop or in the internet. The Radio Shack = stuff may cost 20% less, but it is almost as bad as hooking up the = antenna using the zip cord used on table lamps. Jim Vance = Vance@ClaflinWildcats.comFrom krjerry@bellsouth.net Thu Oct 16 17:17:18 2003 Received: from imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net ([205.152.59.65]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AAIIw-000KN6-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:17:18 -0700 Received: from oldmerlin ([68.212.80.232]) by imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.27 201-253-122-126-127-20021220) with SMTP id <20031017002110.ZYSK1795.imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net@oldmerlin> for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:21:10 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <3F8F3601.000001.03576@oldmerlin> Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:21:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) X-Mailer: IncrediMail 2001 (2001138.2001138) From: "KRJerry" References: <3.0.6.32.20031016124459.007f9100@pop.midwest.net> X-FID: FLAVOR00-NONE-0000-0000-000000000000 X-FVER: X-CNT: ; X-Priority: 3 To: Subject: Re: KR>paint ........and antennas....... Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1b3 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: =0D =0D Hey, while I'm thinking about it , is the antenna coax=0D 50 or 75 ohm, (58 or 59 or will the new RG6 work?)=0D =0D >>>>>>> Larry,=0D =0D You will want to use RG58 (50ohm)........=0D =0D KRJerry=0D Jerry Mahurin=0D Lugoff, SC=0D e-mail: KRJerry@bellsouth.net=0D Website: http://KR-Builder.org =0D =0D >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>=0D =0D Larry=0D =0D =0D =0D _______________________________________________=0D see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html=0D =2EFrom krjerry@bellsouth.net Thu Oct 16 17:31:37 2003 Received: from imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net ([205.152.59.65]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AAIWn-000KWD-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:31:37 -0700 Received: from oldmerlin ([68.212.80.232]) by imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net (InterMail vM.5.01.05.27 201-253-122-126-127-20021220) with SMTP id <20031017003530.DMW1795.imf17aec.mail.bellsouth.net@oldmerlin> for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:35:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <3F8F395D.000003.03576@oldmerlin> Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:35:41 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) X-Mailer: IncrediMail 2001 (2001138.2001138) From: "KRJerry" References: <20031016175343.68740.qmail@web40801.mail.yahoo.com> X-FID: FLAVOR00-NONE-0000-0000-000000000000 X-FVER: X-CNT: ; X-Priority: 3 To: Subject: Re: KR>Piano hinge for Cowl....and backing plates........ Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1b3 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Scott, et al,=0D =0D =2E.........the mounting screws for the cowl attachment will be going aro= und the edge of the firewall/bulkhead. You can't get in behind there to put = in backing plates or even washers for that matter. However, It is a good i= dea though to use backing plates, with blind nuts, for mounting anything to t= he firewall. Then you can detach things without someone standing on their h= ead behind the firewall holding the mounting nut. We have backing plates wit= h nutplates for everything, even the motor mount; four backing plates with = 4 nutplates each.......16 of them little boogers. But one person can pull = the motor mount......=0D =0D KRJerry=0D Jerry Mahurin=0D Lugoff, SC=0D =0D =0D e-mail: KRJerry@bellsouth.net=0D Website: http://KR-Builder.org =0D =2E However, you could back-up the=0D plywood by placing an angle or a flat doubler behind=0D the plywood to make a sandwich. That way you don't=0D have the end of the rivet unsupported. I would be=0D hesitant to use the pop-rivet back-up washers however=0D in this critical area. Since this is a Firewall,=0D you'll need to make sure that every penetration is=0D sealed.=0D =2EFrom rfreiberger@swfla.rr.com Thu Oct 16 17:40:26 2003 Received: from ms-smtp-02.tampabay.rr.com ([65.32.1.39]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AAIfJ-000Kl3-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:40:26 -0700 Received: from zippersystems (153-25.201-68.swfla.rr.com [68.201.25.153]) by ms-smtp-02.tampabay.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.5) with ESMTP id h9H0iI8p015388 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:44:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Ron Freiberger" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: RE: KR>KR1 and Bill Stead's Miss Cosmic Wind Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:44:02 -0400 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) In-reply-to: <20031016204523.20870.qmail@web40804.mail.yahoo.com> X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Importance: Normal X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: rfreiberger@swfla.rr.com, KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Buy Cassutt plans... exactly what you want. Ron Freiberger mailto: rfreiberger@swfla.rr.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Scott Cable Sent: Thursday, October 16, 2003 4:45 PM To: KR builders and pilots Subject: KR>KR1 and Bill Stead's Miss Cosmic Wind Netters, I'm staring at a picture of the Official Program of the 03 Reno Air Races. Under the Air Race History section is a photo of Bill Stead's "MIss Cosmic Wind" She looks amazingly very much like a KR-1 with the exception of: Mid-Wing, with the cheek cowls serving as "leading edge extensions". Was the KR-1 Designed after this beautiful little bird? Is it feasable to make a KR-1 a mid-wing? Without washout and WAF's? Hershey Bar wing? > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 20:46:48 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) From: "KRJerry" To: Subject: Re: KR>Coaxial cable Message-ID: <3F8F3BF8.000005.03576@oldmerlin> References: <004901c39442$07a349c0$0900a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 5 Jim,=0D =0D I've never had any trouble with the 'McShack' RG58 (50ohm) solid wire ca= ble I use the solid wire cause it is easier to work with and you don't need the braided unless you are going to put it in some high flexing area. Ju= st be sure and get the length you need from bulk roll in the back of the sto= re. Don't get the pre packaged stuff....it costs more.=0D =0D Jim Weir, who built the antennas for Voyager (12 of em) and antenna Guru = in general, uses the Radio Shack stuff and sez he can't tell any diffrence i= n performance.=0D =0D KRJerry=0D Jerry Mahurin=0D Lugoff, SC=0D e-mail: KRJerry@bellsouth.net=0D Website: http://KR-Builder.org =0D -------Original Message-------=0D =0D From: KR builders and pilots=0D Date: Thursday, October 16, 2003 8:01:46 PM=0D To: krnet=0D Subject: KR>Coaxial cable=0D =0D All aircraft radios use 50 ohm cable. Be sure to use RG58 FOAM. The foam coax has about 1/4 the loss of the regular RG58. You can buy it at any two-way communications shop or in the internet. The Radio Shack stuff may cost 20% less, but it is almost as bad as hooking up the antenna using th= e zip cord used on table lamps.=0D =0D Jim Vance=0D Vance@ClaflinWildcat= s com_______________________________________________=0D see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html=0D =2EFrom crainey1@cfl.rr.com Thu Oct 16 17:56:46 2003 Received: from ms-smtp-03.tampabay.rr.com ([65.32.1.41]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AAIv8-000L2w-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 17:56:46 -0700 Received: from Beverly (5.70.33.65.cfl.rr.com [65.33.70.5]) by ms-smtp-03.tampabay.rr.com (8.12.10/8.12.5) with SMTP id h9H10b1f002076 for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:00:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <002d01c3944a$12e6eb40$05462141@Beverly> From: "Colin" To: "KR builders and pilots" Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:00:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1b3 Subject: KR>Welcome X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Welcome Brian, hope to see you in Mt Vernon. Colin & Bev Rainey KR2(td) crainey1@cfl.rr.com Sanford, Florida FLY SAFE!!!!From WA7YXF@aol.com Thu Oct 16 18:51:23 2003 Received: from imo-m03.mx.aol.com ([64.12.136.6]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AAJlz-000Lag-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 18:51:23 -0700 Received: from WA7YXF@aol.com by imo-m03.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v36_r1.1.) id g.1e0.11c0cb14 (18707) for ; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:55:07 -0400 (EDT) From: WA7YXF@aol.com Message-ID: <1e0.11c0cb14.2cc0a5fa@aol.com> Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:55:06 EDT Subject: Re: KR>Coaxial cable To: krnet@mylist.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: 7.0 for Windows sub 10708 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: The thing you want to avoid with coax is leakage along the length of the cable. The longer the cable, better the shielding must be. On VHF and UHF the loss can be very high. When going from a transceiver across the back yard and up a tower, Hard-line is required costing dollars per foot. With the short runs we use in an aircraft the loss would not be enough to worry about. The Radio Shack stuff works for me. Lynn ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:59:40 -0400 From: "Harold Woods" To: Subject: KR>pop riveting piano hinge to coulings. Message-ID: <002801c39452$5445b730$08ee6418@HAROLD> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 6 Try this. Take a 5/8" square length of spruce, Fit a piece of piano = hinge to it . Predrill the piano hinge and spruce every second piano = hinge loop.Rough sand the under side of the piano hinge and then wash it = in acetone and hang up to dry.Use long 3/4 " aluminum pop rivets. Place = them in acetone and then dry them. Mix up some epoxy and cover the wood = including the holes. Cover the loops of the piano hinge with vinyl or = masking tape to keep the hinge clear of epoxy. Dip each rivet in epoxy = and insert them in the holes. Pull each rivet in turn. Lay two layers of = fibreglass over the top of the riveted area .This will be for the = connection to the fibreglass couling.Let it cure for 24 hours. You will = destroy the hinge in trying to tear it apart. The othe side of the hinge can go onto the stainless steel fire wall or = onto the wooden structure using the same epoxy/pop rivet treatment = followed by glass cloth over the riveted area onto the wood of the = fuselage. I used 2" hinge on the top and two vertical sides to hold on = the top couling.The bottom half is similarly fastened to the top by two = hinges, fore and aft on each side. In all cases the pops are = fibreglassed in as part of the "meat" in the sandwich. All comments both + and - are greatfully received. Harold Woods Orillia,ON.Can. haroldwoods@rogers.com --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.522 / Virus Database: 320 - Release Date: 9/29/2003From rossy65@operamail.com Thu Oct 16 21:25:29 2003 Received: from 205-158-62-67.outblaze.com ([205.158.62.67] helo=spf13.us4.outblaze.com) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1)id 1AAMB7-000Nja-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Thu, 16 Oct 2003 21:25:29 -0700 Received: from 205-158-62-68.outblaze.com (205-158-62-68.outblaze.com [205.158.62.68]) by spf13.us4.outblaze.com (Postfix) with QMQP id 173A31804494 for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2003 04:29:23 +0000 (GMT) Received: (qmail 59289 invoked from network); 17 Oct 2003 04:29:21 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO ws5-2.us4.outblaze.com) (205.158.62.133) by 205-158-62-153.outblaze.com with SMTP; 17 Oct 2003 04:29:21 -0000 Received: (qmail 6191 invoked by uid 1001); 17 Oct 2003 04:29:20 -0000 Message-ID: <20031017042920.6188.qmail@operamail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: MIME-tools 5.41 (Entity 5.404) Received: from [199.108.226.254] by ws5-3.us4.outblaze.com with http for rossy65@operamail.com; Fri, 17 Oct 2003 05:29:20 +0100 From: "Ross Youngblood" To: "KR builders and pilots" Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 05:29:20 +0100 Subject: Re: KR>Coaxial cable (Random Babble.. may be usefule to some) X-Originating-Ip: 199.108.226.254 X-Originating-Server: ws5-3.us4.outblaze.com X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Vance posted that the FOAM coax has 25% less loss. Coax loss is specified in dB per 100 feet. We are not wiring a C5 galaxy here, my KR coax length was probably about 10 feet. The numbers for loss/100feet I found were from 3db/100feet to 6db/100feet (3db is bad, that is 50% of the power lost). So I found a website that will calculate the loss for RG58. Go to http://www.timesmicrowave.com/cgi-bin/calculate.pl And you can calulate the db loss of various cable types. I plugged in 10' and 121.5Mhz for RG58 and got 0.5dB loss. Not too much loss. After having said this, using expensive cable is like buying a more powerful transmitter and reciever as it imporves your efficiency and weighs the same... can you notice the difference of 0.5dB loss vs 0.0dBloss. (I don't know if Vance's 25% more efficient for foam cable applies to the dB loss, or the transmitted power. (3dB is 50%) I think I purchased my *cheap* 50 ohm coax at Frys electronics (non foam insulated). When we are talking about 25% less loss, I'm thinking what is the loss per foot, and how many feet are we talking about.xI did a google search on cable loss... My antenna is a RST kit type, (Jim Weir?[sp]) Based on the type of testing I have done... I don't think it will be worth the $$. Antenna placement and other factors might contribute to loss more than cable selection. On the other hand... if you can throw money at a problem to make things better... it's easier than fussing with it. I think the only "critical" thing is to get 50 ohm instead of 75 ohm cable. ----- Original Message ----- From: "JIM VANCE" Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 19:03:00 -0500 To: "krnet" Subject: KR>Coaxial cable > All aircraft radios use 50 ohm cable. Be sure to use RG58 FOAM. The > foam coax has about 1/4 the loss of the regular RG58. You can buy it > at any two-way communications shop or in the internet. The Radio > Shack stuff may cost 20% less, but it is almost as bad as hooking up > the antenna using the zip cord used on table lamps. > > Jim Vance > > Vance@ClaflinWildcats.com_______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html -- ___________________________________________________ OperaMail free e-mail - http://www.operamail.com OperaMail Premium - 28MB, POP3, more! US$29.99/year Powered by Outblaze ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 16 Oct 2003 23:39:14 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" To: "KR builders and pilots" Subject: Re: KR>paint Message-ID: <002d01c39468$9ec18c60$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> References: <3F8ECFAD.2020007@newtech.com><3.0.6.32.20031016124459.007f9100@pop.midwest.net> <00a401c39427$87017180$1b65a8c0@insp4100> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 7 > A KR of Color......the new wave is coming. Just wait!!! > > > WHEEW DOGGY, IS THAT THING RED !!!!!! I really had no idea that I'd paint it red until last week when I bought the paint. I'm surprised that nobody's pointed out that the manual says to paint the thing white yet. My argument is that the structure of this plane is wood, not composite. All the composite stuff does while on the ground is help the airfoils and decks retain their shape (kinda like fabric on a steel tube plane). The spar and landing gear take the 1g loads while sitting on the ground. When flying, the skin temperature will be down to ambient about 100 yards down the runway on takeoff, if not while taxiing, so it's not a factor. I'm going to paint the thing a light gray on top, ever since I discovered that silver is pure aluminum metallic chips, which wouldn't be good for my "perfect" antenna. Right now only he very bottom is red, but if I get one more weekend that's still in the 70's, I'll paint the tops of the stub wings and the side of the fuselage. I can paint the other stuff later inside. That is, if I ever get off work. Right now I'm finishing up an 18 hour day at the salt mine. At least I get paid overtime... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 06:42:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Ameet Savant To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>paint Message-ID: <20031017134220.16208.qmail@web11006.mail.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <002d01c39468$9ec18c60$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 8 Okay, I am not totally convinced with this argument. If the heat radiating from a really hot asphalt parking spot happens to delaminate your airfoil skin over and over again. The birds flights also impose repeated stresses on the delaminated skins. then eventually the skin might depart from the structure. I don't think an aircraft can fly only on it's "wood spars". You give the anology of the steel structure with fabric on it. well I don;t think the plane can fly with the fabric torn in many places. I am talking about the wing only... The fueslage might be ok. However, I wouldn't want to reskin my fuselage every few years. The pain looks great!... but I have concerns that it is an unneccesary risk for an otherwise beautiful job! my 2¢ Ameet Savant > I'm surprised that nobody's pointed out that > the manual says to > paint the thing white yet. My argument is that the > structure of this plane > is wood, not composite. All the composite stuff > does while on the ground is > help the airfoils and decks retain their shape > (kinda like fabric on a steel > tube plane). The spar and landing gear take the 1g > loads while sitting on > the ground. When flying, the skin temperature will > be down to ambient about > 100 yards down the runway on takeoff, if not while > taxiing, so it's not a > factor. > Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search http://shopping.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 08:56:45 -0500 From: "Mark Jones" To: "KR-Net" Subject: KR>Justin's Web Page Message-ID: <003901c394b6$8e1d7600$1b65a8c0@insp4100> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 9 Hi Justin, I was just checking out your web page... = http://www.geocities.com/attngrabber14/Home ...I am curious, what is = your beef with cops. =20 Mark Jones Mueller Sales Ph: 262-781-5310 Fax: 262-781-4130 www.muellersales.comFrom newtech@newtech.com Fri Oct 17 07:33:19 2003 Received: from 63-69-213-180.res.evv.cable.sigecom.net ([63.69.213.180] helo=cherry.newtech.com) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1)id 1AAVfK-0002gk-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Fri, 17 Oct 2003 07:33:18 -0700 Received: from newtech.com (cherry.newtech.com [192.168.1.10]) by cherry.newtech.com (8.11.6+Sun/8.11.6) with ESMTP id h9HEaDt21469 for ; Fri, 17 Oct 2003 09:36:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3F8FFE5B.6050707@newtech.com> Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 09:36:11 -0500 From: Steven Eberhart User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; SunOS sun4u; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020920 Netscape/7.0 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>paint References: <20031017134220.16208.qmail@web11006.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by cherry.newtech.com id h9HEaDt21469 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KR builders and pilots List-Id: KR builders and pilots List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Interesting thought. Not jumping in on either side of this discussion=20 but those that know me know that I usually run off to find the nearest=20 expert to get the facts when a discussion like this comes up. In this=20 case I headed for my library. I don't think much of Martin Hollman but=20 in this case he is just reporting facts from reputable sources. In his=20 book "Modern Aircraft Design Volume 2" he lists some temperatures that=20 were measured by embedded thermocouples in the Red Lancair 320 factory=20 demonstrator. A surface temperature of 153F was measured on the top surface of the=20 wing on a 95F ambient day at Oshkosh. A surface temperature of 180F was=20 measured on a 104F ambient day. On the same type of surface but painted=20 white a surface temperature of 126F was measured on a 95F ambient day. The glass transition temperature for Safe-T-Poxy With room temperature=20 cure is 151F but when post cured at a temperature of 200F the glass=20 transition temperature goes up to 196F. I wonder if sitting out on a hot asphalt ramp would result in a post=20 cure that would actually increase the glass transition temperature.=20 Just don't think I would want to launch into the wild blue immediately=20 after the first environmental post cure before the surfaces had a chance=20 to return to normal temperatures. :-) Just the facts mam. Now on Dana's black RV-7 I think the only thing he=20 should be concerned with it the glass transition temperature of his=20 posterior :-) Steve Eberhart Ameet Savant wrote: > Okay, >=20 > I am not totally convinced with this argument. >=20 > If the heat radiating from a really hot asphalt > parking spot happens to delaminate your airfoil skin > over and over again. The birds flights also impose > repeated stresses on the delaminated skins. then > eventually the skin might depart from the structure. I > don't think an aircraft can fly only on it's "wood > spars". >=20 > You give the anology of the steel structure with > fabric on it. well I don;t think the plane can fly > with the fabric torn in many places. I am talking > about the wing only... The fueslage might be ok. > However, I wouldn't want to reskin my fuselage every > few years. >=20 > The pain looks great!... but I have concerns that it > is an unneccesary risk for an otherwise beautiful job! >=20 > my 2=A2 >=20 > Ameet Savant >=20 >=20 >>I'm surprised that nobody's pointed out that >>the manual says to >>paint the thing white yet. My argument is that the >>structure of this plane >>is wood, not composite. All the composite stuff >>does while on the ground is >>help the airfoils and decks retain their shape >>(kinda like fabric on a steel >>tube plane). The spar and landing gear take the 1g >>loads while sitting on >>the ground. When flying, the skin temperature will >>be down to ambient about >>100 yards down the runway on takeoff, if not while >>taxiing, so it's not a >>factor. >=20 >=20 >>Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL >=20 >=20 >=20 > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > The New Yahoo! Shopping - with improved product search >http://shopping.yahoo.com =20 > _______________________________________________ > see KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html >=20 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:11:36 -0500 From: "Oscar Zuniga" To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KR>fairings Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 10 Netters; Someone asked the question about the possibility or benefit of fairing the tailwheel. I haven't seen any takers on that, so I thought I'd throw out something I just read in the Fall '03 issue of "To Fly" last night, about a Thorp T-18 that a gent built and documented the performance changes due to fairings, cowlings, and etc. since the Thorp was originally conceived and designed as an open-cockpit airplane with the engine cylinders hanging out in the breeze and unfaired Wittman-style spring gear. The Thorp is similar to the KR in a few ways, but that's not the point. What is of interest is the magnitude of the gain for each modification or improvement. Among other things, the builder said that each of the following gained 2 to 4 MPH in top speed: adding wheel pants, fairing the pant/landing gear leg junction, and fairing the tailwheel spring. He did not mention a "pant" for the tailwheel itself. He also said that down-pointing exhaust stacks cost him 3 MPH (ergo, Mark Langford's approach of turning them into the slipstream. Also a potential for some thrust gain). He figured that with the fairings and streamlining he did on his airplane, every 10 MPH gain in top speed due to drag reduction equated to 25 fewer HP required (for the Thorp)... with the associated weight, complexity, cost, fuel consumption, and the rest of it. And of course the rate of climb has the same gains and losses as top speed. In passing, and since it's Friday (in Texas, anyway), here's something I didn't know... also from "To Fly". Art Chester, the racer who built the "Goon", "Jeep", and "Swee' Pea" back in the pre-WWII days, worked for North American and was on the P-51 design team. He is responsible for the design and construction of the innovative box-beam bed mount for the Allison engine in the P-51. Also interestingly, the British specs for the airplane (we made some for them) were for a pilot size of 5'-10" and 145 lbs., which were Art's exact measurements. So he was the "test dummy" for fitting the cockpit of the prototype to the British specs and everything was made to fit him. The longer I live, the more I learn! Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net _________________________________________________________________ Cheer a special someone with a fun Halloween eCard from American Greetings! Go to http://www.msn.americangreetings.com/index_msn.pd?source=msne134 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 17 Oct 2003 13:24:50 -0500 From: DPurduski@CaldwellMfgCo.com To: KR builders and pilots Subject: Re: KR>fairings Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 11 Speaking of fairings and performance: Anyone have experience "dropping" a lip from the lower cowl to let heat escape? Any design recommendations and performance decrease / increase numbers? Over................ ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 191, Issue 1 *************************************