From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 171 Date: 10/19/2004 8:59:30 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. RE: Gathering photos, finally... (Stephen Jacobs) 2. Re: Gathering photos, finally... (terry jones) 3. R?f. : Re: KR> Gathering photos, finally ... (Serge VIDAL) 4. Re: CorvAircraft> cure for my Tiny Tach problem (Mark Langford) 5. Re: KR List (Scott) 6. Here in Florida (Colin & Bev Rainey) 7. Materials (Colin & Bev Rainey) 8. Re: Re: aileron balancing - How close to perfect must the balance be? (JAMES FERRIS) 9. KR2S (Dick Goff) 10. Re: R?f. : KR> drills$WAF's (Dene Collett (SA)) 11. Re: Here in Florida (larry severson) 12. UK builders/was Gathering photos, finally... (Oscar Zuniga) 13. Horizontal Stab. Rib material grain orientation (Steven Phillabaum) 14. Re: Gathering photos, finally... (Ron Eason) 15. Inspection (Colin & Bev Rainey) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 08:06:15 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: RE: KR> Gathering photos, finally... To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c4b5a1$c8211570$9464a8c0@home> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" they are reduced and compressed by an average factor of 120x, so the slow modem guys won't choke on them ++++++++++++++++++++++++ Thank you Mark - highly motivating What a treat it must be to actually be around these folks and airplanes. ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 12:53:48 +0100 From: terry jones Subject: Re: KR> Gathering photos, finally... To: KRnet Message-ID: <4175004C.7010403@ntlworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Hi All, this is my first posting. Looked like a nice gathering of people 'n aircraft. Shame it all happened over 5000 miles away. I am in the UK, over in East Anglia, almost as far away from the US as you can get in England. Question:- Are there any/many KR2S builders in the UK, as I am looking into this as a possible project. The problem seems to be (apart from the restraints of the CAA/PFA) that all material has to be sourced from the States. This means that timber for example cost almost as much for shipping/delivery as it does to buy. Anyway, good luck to all you existing builders, and may the space between your bum and the ground never reduce faster than you intend.... Terry Jones > > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:18:10 +0200 From: "Serge VIDAL" Subject: R?f. : Re: KR> Gathering photos, finally ... To: KRnet Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi, Terry! There are a couple KR2 builders in the UK. One of them surprised us all when he launched in a world tour with his KR. Went all the way to Australia, despite an awful lack of preparation. You don't have to import everything from the States, far from it. Here in France, I know one guy who built everything from scratch, except for the canopy, using only locally available supplies. As far as timber is concerned, I am fairly sure there are sources of aircraft grade timber near you, since a lot of wooden aircraft are being built in the UK. Just contact the PFA and ask a few builders / rebuilders what kind of wood they use, and where they buy it. My 2 cents worth. Serge Vidal KR2 ZS-WEC Paris, France terry jones Envoyé par : krnet-bounces@mylist.net 2004-10-19 13:53 Veuillez répondre à KRnet Remis le : 2004-10-19 13:56 Pour : KRnet cc : (ccc : Serge VIDAL/DNSA/SAGEM) Objet : Re: KR> Gathering photos, finally... Hi All, this is my first posting. Looked like a nice gathering of people 'n aircraft. Shame it all happened over 5000 miles away. I am in the UK, over in East Anglia, almost as far away from the US as you can get in England. Question:- Are there any/many KR2S builders in the UK, as I am looking into this as a possible project. The problem seems to be (apart from the restraints of the CAA/PFA) that all material has to be sourced from the States. This means that timber for example cost almost as much for shipping/delivery as it does to buy. Anyway, good luck to all you existing builders, and may the space between your bum and the ground never reduce faster than you intend.... Terry Jones > > _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 09:45:19 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR> Re: CorvAircraft> cure for my Tiny Tach problem To: "Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft" , Cc: info@wicksaircraft.com, gpasc@earthlink.net, info@aircraft-spruce.com Message-ID: <0da201c4b5ea$46eabc60$5e0ca58c@net.tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Wilson Lamb wrote: > A few minutes experimenting with a series resistor and capacitor on > the circuit board would get it done. Ideally, one would use an > oscilloscope to see when the filtered pickup was providing just the > right trigger puilses. > > I'd try winding the pickup wire around the spark wire a few inches > outside the cap. That MIGHT increase the desired pulse and suppress > the others a little. When I first bought the thing, I had the same results. I called the manufacturer, and was given his usual tweaks, which involved using different numbers of turns of the pickup wire wrapped around the chosen sparkplug wire, then various different resistors in the system, and I eventually asked why I couldn't just use a potentiometer and dial it around until I got results, and he said that ought to work. It didn't. On one extreme it was all over the place (as usual) and at the other, the signal died altogether and the tach reverted to hourmeter status. A capacitor in there somewhere probably would have helped, but he didn't offer that solution. Instead he sent me a whole 'nuther unit (which he later billed me for, after I'd installed it) that had a filter network already built in. He calls it the -X. I think as cheap as filters are, maybe he should include them in all his units, but apparently you have to be at the end of your rope to receive one, and then you have to pay for it. Anyway, the new unit was no better than the old one with regards to wild and random fluctuations anywhere from half to five times actual RPM, despite another hour of tweaking with the pickup wire, etc. I finally decided that it must have to do with the pickup receiving EMI from the other wires, so I shielded it with aluminum foil and grounded the shield, and now it works. You may be right that it's a capacitive thing, but what I did works, and that's good enough for me. If I build a new panel, that thing will probably go in the trash, but for now I hate to leave a hole in my panel that was specifically designed for the thing (http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/kpanel.html). And like I said, it now seems to work better than the EIS's tachometer, although I should mention that I haven't called EIS for suggestions on how to fix the problem with theirs bouncing around and not reading correctly, despite proper and careful installation. The last time I posted this story I sent a copy of it to the manufacturer, and got a nice note from them last week explaining that "The basic Tiny-Tach was designed to be an inexpensive method for tracking RPM and hours on small one and two cylinder engines -- basically Briggs and Stratton and Koher type lawn mower engines. Because of its low cost, it spread through the marketplace and is now being used on a wide variety of applications for which it was never intended. It was not meant to be used on multi-cylinder engines, cars, airplanes, etc." Oddly, their web site doesn't mention this limitation, and Aircraft Spruce, Wicks, and Great Plains are selling them with no mention of that limitation, and with no mention of the X-version. I don't know of very many aircraft installations that are single cylinder, but I'm sure there are a few. To be fair, the email also said that if I thought I'd been cheated, they'd refund my money if I returned the unit, but the one I've got works, the previous one was disfigured in several ways (regarding the way the wiring ended up), and their warranty clearly doesn't cover dead batteries, which is what's wrong with the first one, so I'll pass on that offer. I don't think I'll be buying another one, but if you have one already, this might be the answer to getting it working, and spiral wound sparkplug wires may also be part (or all) of the problem. Since I've had to buy three, I now have about $135 in my one Tiny Tach that works, and am facing the prospect of having to buy another one in three years when the potted-in battery croaks . Actually, I guess I have even more in it, because I had to buy a $50 optical tach to help me figure out which one was right, the EIS or the Tiny Tach! After my "fix", the optical tach and Tiny Tach agree perfectly, as if they have the same electronic guts in them. Aircraft Spruce's catalog says the battery is good for 8 years, Tiny Tach's site says "more than five", and my first one lasted a little more than three in the comfort of my basement, never having counted a single rev. Of course you could argue that it sat on the shelf at Wicks for several years before being shipped to me, but I seriously doubt that. I'll probably make a new panel when this TT croaks and buy something that I know will work, and runs on ship's power with battery backup... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 12:57:32 -0400 From: Scott Subject: Re: KR> KR List Cc: KRnet Message-ID: <4175477C.1090102@ctc.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed I have created a list for KR netters to sign up with you address and phone number (if you want to, nothing is mandatory). It also has fields for your KR's registration number (N-number) and the status of your project. You can find a link to it at http://krnet.scottstanton.us You can go directly there with http://krnet.scottstanton.us/cgi-bin/krnet_list.pl Also if someone needs a few pictures of your project thrown out on the web, let me know and I can put them here too. PS. For those that remembered that Matthew Elder volunteered for this. I passed this by him before I put it out for the group. I used code I'd already written, so I had a jump start on him. Scott Raleigh, NC Scott wrote: > Mike Mims put this together a while ago (More than 2 years, less than > 5 based on the address he has for me.) It is a good starting place > for finding local KRs, but since it isn't current so you may not find > the people on the list anymore. > > Scott Stanton > Raleigh NC > > Mark Jones wrote: > >> I just stumbled across this list. I have never seen it before nor do >> I know >> who provides this. Take a look. >> >> http://www.fortunecity.com/marina/anchor/270/KRlist.html >> >> >> Mark Jones (N886MJ) >> Wales, WI >> _______________________________________ >> to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >> please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html >> >> >> > > ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 15:24:45 -0400 From: "Colin & Bev Rainey" Subject: KR> Here in Florida To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <014e01c4b611$4acb4030$2d432141@RaineyDay> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I am located in Sanford not far from Orlando, not flying yet, trying to get thru the FAA inspections. I am due to have an A&P look at the plane this weekend, and hopefully that will substitute for the EAA Tech counselor since none want to come out. I believe that Dean Cooper and know that Brian Kraut is in Jacksonville. Glenda Maclewee is somewhere here in Central Florida. Another new builder is Jim who also lives here in Sanford. I think that there was one more builder near Brian and Dean. Colin & Bev Rainey KR2(td) N96TA Sanford, FL crainey1@cfl.rr.com http://kr-builder.org/Colin/index.html ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 15:28:26 -0400 From: "Colin & Bev Rainey" Subject: KR> Materials To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <016301c4b611$ce52f920$2d432141@RaineyDay> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Terry To help reduce your costs you may want to build the fuselage the way Eduardo and Dr Dean did out of the spruce frame and glass over foam core. This is the way all do the wings now, and many are starting to do the fuselage. Some thoughts for economy without loss of strength. The Vision has been built this way and is proven to be as strong given same weights. Colin & Bev Rainey KR2(td) N96TA Sanford, FL crainey1@cfl.rr.com http://kr-builder.org/Colin/index.html ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 15:32:57 -0400 From: JAMES FERRIS Subject: Re: KR> Re: aileron balancing - How close to perfect must the balance be? To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20041019.153258.180.2.mijnil@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii It is possible to have flutter and not destroy the airplane, so the closer you are to perfect the lower the loads if it does flutter. Jim On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 12:15:50 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) "Dan Heath" writes: > Paul, > > I think that with the ailerons at neutral, you are going to be in > the > slipstream, and that is not a problem. I am going to get as close to > > balanced" as I can and if off a little, I will not sweat it. I have > heard > that it does not have to be perfect, but that is just hearsay. > > There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for > building > has expired. > > See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics > > Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC > > See you in Mt. Vernon - 2005 - KR Gathering > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 15:23:46 -0500 From: dcgoff@webtv.net (Dick Goff) Subject: KR> KR2S To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <11911-417577D2-2287@storefull-3316.bay.webtv.net> Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=US-ASCII Hi Netters, Finally took the plunge! I just sent William Dominiac the check for his KR2S "Stretched" project. Who wanted me to by them a lottery ticket ? Dick Goff ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 14 Oct 2004 22:38:45 +0200 From: "Dene Collett \(SA\)" Subject: Re: R?f. : KR> drills$WAF's To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000001c4b613$e5dfcda0$37e5fea9@telkomsa127179> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi Serge Thanks for the info, she hasn't put much weight on considering all the mods done. Rob welded those wing tanks himself and I don't know how you could make them any lighter than they are. I suppose he could have used slightly thinner ally but that wouldn't have saved much. Have you managed to get it certified to fly over there yet? As for the cast ally gear attach brackets, they were aparently a local casting done by someone in SA. Just a word of caution, keep an eye on the bolts holding those castings to the spar. I once found one of them with its head snapped off under the passenger side. It was probably due to a rough landing he had on one of his outings to a bumpy strip somewhere. Go well Cheers Dene Collett KR2S-RT builder Port Elizabeth South Africa mailto: dene.collett@telkomsa.net P.S: checkout www.whisperaircraft.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Serge VIDAL" To: "KRnet" Sent: Monday, October 11, 2004 9:36 AM Subject: Réf. : KR> drills$WAF's Dene, ZS-WEC was last weighted on July last year, just before I left South Africa. She had had some modifications since her first flight. First, at a certain point in time, Rob Van der Merwe added aluminium long range fuel tanks (in the stubwings), and I suspect these are a bit on the heavy side. Then, I made a much heavier instrument panel, meaning also more wiring, etc. Last but not least, I changed the engine to a 2.4 liter VW, with full dual electronic ignition. And many more small things that add on and on... Result: 321 Kg empty (that is #707, for those who still use Units of Measure from the "stone" age ;-) ) Now, talking about the spring steel undercarriage, it sure is heavy, but not that much, and boy! It is reliable and forgiving, that much I can say. What I could never figure out is the brackets that link the U/C to the spar. They are L-shaped, and look as if they are made of cast aluminium. I always wondered where they came from. Serge Vidal Paris, France (Gee, how much I mis South Africa!) "Dene Collett (SA)" Envoyé par : krnet-bounces@mylist.net 2004-10-07 23:50 Veuillez répondre à KRnet Remis le : 2004-10-09 22:27 Pour : "krnet" cc : (ccc : Serge VIDAL/DNSA/SAGEM) Objet : KR> drills$WAF's Thanks to all who responded to my questions regarding long drill bits and the attaching of the WAF's. I took a regular 3/16 bit to a new friend today who runs a business making all sorts of control cables for auto/marine/industrial and other. He is getting one of his staff to lengthen it for me so it looks like I will get the job done this week end. As for the weight of a retract system compared to a fixed gear, remember I said we mostly used leaf spring material over here because it is readily available unlike the exotic aluminuims like 2024. For interest sake, does someone have the weight of a Deal gear leg and of the attach bracket + bolts.My design does not have any attach brackets to speak of as they piggy back on the WAF bolts (aluminuim plate straddling the two WAF's) also no wheel fairings. Although the steel legs are heavy, ZS-WEC was built to a weight of around 620# originally so it needn't mean an overweight bird at the end of the day.(Serge, I would be interested to know what it weighs now??) Dene Collett KR2S-RT builder Port Elizabeth South Africa mailto: dene.collett@telkomsa.net P.S: checkout www.whisperaircraft.com _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 14:58:34 -0700 From: larry severson Subject: Re: KR> Here in Florida To: KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20041019145433.03179508@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 03:24 PM 10/19/2004 -0400, you wrote: >I am located in Sanford not far from Orlando, not flying yet, trying to >get thru the FAA inspections. I am due to have an A&P look at the plane >this weekend, and hopefully that will substitute for the EAA Tech >counselor since none want to come out. Do you belong to an EAA local group? Many of them have members who are Techs. You might want to contact: Joe Norris EAA 1-888-322-4636 X 6806 I have found him a huge help for EAA members. Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 17:02:47 -0500 From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR> UK builders/was Gathering photos, finally... To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Terry writes- >The problem seems to be (apart from the restraints of the CAA/PFA) that >all material has to be sourced from the States. This means that timber >for example cost almost as much for shipping/delivery as it does to >buy. Not so. You should have plenty of local resources, despite your faraway location and the backward, uncivilised nature of the UK ;o) For instance, there is a good group of Pietenpol builders in the UK, reference the website at http://www.pietenpolclub.co.uk/ , who I'm sure could help you with local sources of supply for aircraft-grade lumber, hardware, and the like. There are some good resources available here on the Net through people like Richard Mole, one of your compatriots who flies a Jodel. Don't give up hope! Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 22:11:05 +0000 From: Steven Phillabaum Subject: KR> Horizontal Stab. Rib material grain orientation To: Message-ID: <3948se$aduq29@mxip10a.cluster1.charter.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hello Net. Can I cut my Horizontal Stab ribs (new wing) out of my 3/32 M90 ply using the grain orientated to the vertical. I over cut my stock of ply and don't want to cut into one full 4' x 8' for the ribs. I have two pieces 8" tall and 48" long I cut for the spar skins but did not use them I am building the stab. before I build my boat to save on building space, so I don't have scraps to use. What yal think? Steven Phillabaum KR2S Spars complete Auburn, Alabama ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 19:06:07 -0500 From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Re: KR> Gathering photos, finally... To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000801c4b638$9912b3a0$6501a8c0@CADENGINEERING> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Tom Gleaser from Dawn Patrol fame brought the plane. He already has a KR2 but he like this copy also, so he has it now in the Dawn Patrol hanger. KRron ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Kraut" To: "KRnet" Sent: Monday, October 18, 2004 10:16 PM Subject: RE: KR> Gathering photos, finally... >I noticed that the KR I sold to Brett from Hog Air made it to the >gathering after I left and was sold. Did anyone catch the name of the >buyer? > > Brian Kraut > Engineering Alternatives, Inc. > www.engalt.com > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Tue, 19 Oct 2004 21:25:28 -0400 From: "Colin & Bev Rainey" Subject: KR> Inspection To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001c01c4b643$aed9a620$2d432141@RaineyDay> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Here is a copy of the email I sent Steve Jones thought I would share with the net: Steve, I am so pumped!!! I just got off the phone with John Murphy and he said he would be glad to look at the KR and just needs a couple of days notice. I have to hurry up and get it over to the airport now, and clean it up, but I am faxing him a copy of the registration and the weight and balance. Thank you so much! Colin & Bev Rainey KR2(td) N96TA Sanford, FL crainey1@cfl.rr.com http://kr-builder.org/Colin/index.html ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 171 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================