From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 173 Date: 10/21/2004 7:21:13 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. KR - 56ML - HS Update (Stephen Jacobs) 2. RE: Glass fuse (Ronald Metcalf) 3. Re: UK builder- Holiday (Phil Matheson) 4. Re: UK builder- Holiday (Phil Matheson) 5. Embarrasing moments in airplane building (Brian Kraut) 6. RE: Embarrasing moments in airplane building (Mark Jones) 7. Re: KR 3 (Donald Reid) 8. Re: Embarrasing moments in airplane building (FIXERJONES@aol.com) 9. Aileron pulley bracket question (Cowgirl2fly@aol.com) 10. RE: Aileron pulley bracket question (Mark Jones) 11. Re: Embarrasing moments in airplane building (Brant Hollensbe) 12. RE: Glass fuse (Stephen Jacobs) 13. Re: Embarrasing moments in airplane building (jscott.pilot@juno.com) 14. RE: Glass fuse (Edward Seaman) 15. Re: Materials (terry jones) 16. KR1 (RENOSADLER@aol.com) 17. kr1 (RENOSADLER@aol.com) 18. Re: Materials (RENOSADLER@aol.com) 19. Re: Inspection (joe) 20. RE: Glass fuse (Doug Rupert) 21. Re: Embarrasing moments in airplane building (Dean Cooper) 22. Aileron pulley bracket question (larry flesner) 23. Re: Glass fuse (Eduardo Iglesias) 24. New Airfoil on KR-1 (John Lindner) 25. Re: New Airfoil on KR-1 (Mark Langford) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 08:32:06 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: KR> KR - 56ML - HS Update To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000201c4b737$b5da6690$0864a8c0@home> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Steve, below is a message I sent to KRnet about 5 years ago ..... After my new ones were built (they were lighter anyway because of a little design change) I started wondering how strong the old ones were, and tested them to failure. The glue joint isn't where the caps separated... ++++++++++++++++ Thank you - should have known you would figure a way. Pity my table saw does not have a controllable tilt adjustment (more like unlock /reset by hand /lock method), but I liked the other idea of using an electric hand-held plane (mine is 3" wide) with a two angle rails to get the progressive angle change Would you share the design change or maybe its obvious from the relevant construction page? How did you load the first spar and how did it fail. I presume that it was un-supported in the torsional sense so it may have twisted. Take care Steve J ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 02:01:45 -0500 From: "Ronald Metcalf" Subject: RE: KR> Glass fuse To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Eduardo's method really appealed to me as a cost effective solution that also produces a pretty >elegant fuselage - BUT, the concern I have with this relates to the >difference in relative stiffness between the wooden structure and the glass >/epoxy skin(s). ///// Stephen I also like his method somply coz it lets me make a rounded body and gets rid of the bowed top stringer i.e. the top stringer stays straight. For me it is also fatsre to do it like this. You worry me when you say it is not good !!! who is zeke Smith Ron _________________________________________________________________ Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 18:40:55 +1000 From: "Phil Matheson" Subject: Re: KR> UK builder- Holiday To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <02c201c4b749$b7c08680$7030ddcb@Office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi all you UK members I'm planing a few week in England next year, June July 2005?? ( may be a week over the Channel as well??? It would be nice to meet some of you ( depending on many things of course) But, will give details when and IF all goes to plan. Phil Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au VH-PKR ( Phil's KR) 61 3 58833588 Australia.( Down Under) See My KR2 Building Web Page at: http://mywebpage.netscape.com/flyingkrphil/VHPKR.html See our VW Engines and Home built web page at http://www.vw-engines.com/ www.homebuilt-aviation.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 20:08:38 +1000 From: "Phil Matheson" Subject: Re: KR> UK builder- Holiday To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <031601c4b755$f1df1a50$7030ddcb@Office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi guys I had a great response from Christian , Austria and Mac from England. I just had a great idea, this KR net is such a great my to meet people, we could use it as a great holiday planer. Say anyone coming to Australia could sent out a KR net email (as I did to England), and we in Australia may be able help plan or give the ideas on where to visit, AND even offer a day or so stay. I'm sure people would not like Free loaders to stay for a complete cost free holiday, but a day here and here would be a great extension of the KR Net. Just like you guys drop in on each in the States Any comments, Phil Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au VH-PKR ( Phil's KR) 61 3 58833588 Australia.( Down Under) See My KR2 Building Web Page at: http://mywebpage.netscape.com/flyingkrphil/VHPKR.html See our VW Engines and Home built web page at http://www.vw-engines.com/ www.homebuilt-aviation.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 08:15:50 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" If so many of you were not good friends I would keep quiet, but here goes. I was working on the canopy latch on my Midget Mustang last night. It will have two 1/4" locking rods like a Schweizer sailplane (I will use the same arrangement on the KR and post some pictures). I had an aluminum block mounted to the canopy frame and one mounted to the top of the fusalage. I needed to drill the one on the fusalage with the canopy closed from inside so it would be perfectly in line with the hole in the block mounted to the canopy. Half way through the drill bit got stuck and my flex shaft arrangement broke. Well here I was with a 1/4" drill bit locking pin holding my canopy locked closed and no tools to get it out. After about five minutes I realized I had my cell phone and I had to call my answering machine in the house about 15 times to wake up my wife so she could come to the garage and get me a pair of pliers to pull out the drill bit. I had a hell of a time getting her to wake up and was about to call Dean Cooper and ask him to drive over and get me out. Don't try this one yourself. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 08:01:02 -0500 From: Mark Jones Subject: RE: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building To: 'KRnet' Message-ID: <370D915E4564D611B0530050DABB9FC201902C33@SIC-EXCHANGE> Content-Type: text/plain AHHHHHHHHHH.....another beer circle story for next year's gathering. How many days? Mark Jones (N886MJ Wales, WI -----Original Message----- From: Brian Kraut [mailto:brian.kraut@engalt.com] Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2004 7:16 AM To: KRnet Subject: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building If so many of you were not good friends I would keep quiet, but here goes. I was working on the canopy latch on my Midget Mustang last night. It will have two 1/4" locking rods like a Schweizer sailplane (I will use the same arrangement on the KR and post some pictures). I had an aluminum block mounted to the canopy frame and one mounted to the top of the fusalage. I needed to drill the one on the fusalage with the canopy closed from inside so it would be perfectly in line with the hole in the block mounted to the canopy. Half way through the drill bit got stuck and my flex shaft arrangement broke. Well here I was with a 1/4" drill bit locking pin holding my canopy locked closed and no tools to get it out. After about five minutes I realized I had my cell phone and I had to call my answering machine in the house about 15 times to wake up my wife so she could come to the garage and get me a pair of pliers to pull out the drill bit. I had a hell of a time getting her to wake up and was about to call Dean Cooper and ask him to drive over and get me out. Don't try this one yourself. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 09:00:36 -0400 From: Donald Reid Subject: Re: KR> KR 3 To: KRnet Message-ID: <6.1.0.6.2.20041021085914.01cd6b38@pop.erols.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 10:00 PM 10/20/2004, you wrote: >Don Reid has some information on his site... > >http://users.erols.com/donreid/sportaviation/Kr77-8.HTM > >He also seems to be the foremost authority based on the posts he's made in >the archives...until he writes, I hope this link helps. I have some pictures of the KR3 and KR1B motor glider on my site but I am hardly the authority. Don Reid - donreid "at" erols.com Bumpass, Va Visit my web sites at: AeroFoil, a 2-D Airfoil Design And Analysis Computer Program: http://www.eaa231.org/AeroFoil/index.htm KR2XL construction: http://users.erols.com/donreid/kr_page.htm Aviation Surplus: http://users.erols.com/donreid/Airparts.htm EAA Chapter 231: http://eaa231.org Ultralights: http://usua250.org VA EAA State Fly-in: http://vaeaa.org ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 09:30:46 EDT From: FIXERJONES@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" that's toooooo funny,,,n212kr :-) ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 11:03:31 EDT From: Cowgirl2fly@aol.com Subject: KR> Aileron pulley bracket question To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <15a.41915be3.2ea929c3@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Greetings I'm currently making the aileron pulley assembly However I run into a problem in the drawing of the pulley bracket on page 68 it shows the screws nuts washers and gives the size of the alum tubing to be used for the post for the cable guide. My problem is when I went to order the tubing and screws both Wicks and Aircraft Spruce told me they do'nt carry those size's. Does anyone know where I can get these items or have a altermative I can use? Thanks ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 10:33:14 -0500 From: Mark Jones Subject: RE: KR> Aileron pulley bracket question To: 'KRnet' Message-ID: <370D915E4564D611B0530050DABB9FC201902C35@SIC-EXCHANGE> Content-Type: text/plain If you are talking about the post that keeps the cable from jumping the pulley, simply improvise with a different size. I actually bought my tubing at a local Ace Hardware store. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI -----Original Message----- From: Cowgirl2fly@aol.com [mailto:Cowgirl2fly@aol.com] Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2004 10:04 AM To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KR> Aileron pulley bracket question Greetings I'm currently making the aileron pulley assembly However I run into a problem in the drawing of the pulley bracket on page 68 it shows the screws nuts washers and gives the size of the alum tubing to be used for the post for the cable guide. My problem is when I went to order the tubing and screws both Wicks and Aircraft Spruce told me they do'nt carry those size's. Does anyone know where I can get these items or have a altermative I can use? Thanks _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 10:35:39 -0500 From: "Brant Hollensbe" Subject: Re: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000a01c4b783$9e40eb70$0702a8c0@bruntson> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Only 337 Days till we all Yeee Haaaa together. Now if I can get the @#%*@ T-88 off my hands by then............ > AHHHHHHHHHH.....another beer circle story for next year's gathering. How > many days? > Brant Hollensbe Bhollensbe@mchsi.com DSM Ia. ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 17:35:41 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: RE: KR> Glass fuse To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c4b783$a5740760$7864a8c0@home> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" You worry me when you say it is not good !!! who is zeke Smith +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Hey Ron - As the man always says, your results may differ. I discussed my concerns with Eduardo (this took some time as he speaks Spanish and I speak English). He certainly is a bright guy and appears to have done his homework. Everything else he has done is near perfect, including anodizing his ali parts and making up his own legs and leg attachments, fuel tanks etc. One other South American (Leo, he speaks English) is doing similar things with a GP4, in this case the wing was originally designed for a ply skin, but Leo is doing a KR wing type skin, but staying with the original design spars. http://www.geocities.com/leoadrena/GP4.html Leo built a nice KR before, so he has been around DIY airplanes for a while. Zeke Smith has written various books and articles on composite structures - I see him as knowledgeable in these matters. If he perceives a problem with mixing E-glass and Carbon fibre in the same lay-up due to the differences in stiffness (as suggested in the extract I included) - I must wonder to what extent the same problem will be present in Eduardo's Structure - he is mixing ply with glass. For that matter, how wise is it for Leo to build the wing sub-structure (spars /ribs etc.) according to the plans and then completely change the wing skin from ply to mould-less composite (not even a true sandwich)? I don't know, but my hopes are that one of the netters has an informed opinion and will share it with us. My strong interest is with Eduardo's way - I suppose the question really is which is "stiffer", the spruce frame or the foam/glass composite. If the Composite component of Eduardo's airplane is stiffer and takes the initial load, all is well (if the glass bit is spec'd to do the job.) The spruce frame goes along for the ride. If the spruce frame is stiffer and loads up first - it may not be strong enough without the ply skin and fail. We both seem to like his approach, so let me know if you learn any more. Take care Steve J ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 15:42:50 GMT From: "jscott.pilot@juno.com" Subject: Re: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20041021.084330.3221.123271@webmail05.lax.untd.com> Content-Type: text/plain -- "Brian Kraut" wrote: If so many of you were not good friends I would keep quiet, but here goes. ------------------ Great story Brian! I did the same thing from the other side. I use a set of simple pit pins that I drop into the back of the canopy to lock it down and used to store the pins sitting in their holes in the canopy frame. My KR was complete, sitting in the hanger ready for it's final inspection. When I went to the hanger to meet the inspector and open the plane up for inspection I found that one of the latch pins had slid partway into place, effectively locking the canopy down with no way to access the pin to release it. I must have spent 1/2 hour with the plane tipped over on it's nose bouncing it up and down and banging on the canopy and canopy frame trying to get that pin to slide out far enough to open the canopy. Charlie Reeves has a similar story about finishing glassing the canopy into the frame then finding that the canopy frame was locked from the inside. Seems to me that he had to cut an access hole in the side of the plane to get in. As a final embarrassment, while building an Avid Flyer, I covered the whole airframe and wings, rib stitched, and taped before I discovered that I had used the wrong dope. Anyone that has used Nitrate and Butyrate dopes can easily tell the difference, but for the first time novice, I didn't notice until I had completed all the Nitrate dope work. When I switch to Butyrate, the new can said Nitrate Dope on the label. I knew I had only bought one can of Nitrate, so I checked the can I had been working from. Sure enough, all of the fabric was glued together with the wrong dope. I had to strip the plane back down to bare bones and start over. As an aside, I learned a lot the first time I covered it and did a much better job the second time. -Jeff ________________________________________________________________ Speed up your surfing with Juno SpeedBand. Now includes pop-up blocker! Only $14.95/ month - visit http://www.juno.com/surf to sign up today! ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 17:01:48 +0100 (BST) From: Edward Seaman Subject: RE: KR> Glass fuse To: KRnet Message-ID: <20041021160148.90759.qmail@web25302.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I don't know, but my hopes are that one of the > netters has an informed > opinion and will share it with us. Don't hold your breath on that. This leo guy is sure a messy builder - surprised that you say he made a nice kr. I see what you mean stephen - if the two meterials dont take the load together then one of them is technically just not there. I have read some of zeke Smith somewhere and remember that it was interesting. You seem to just ask questions all the time, are you making a kr or what I must soon choose between a kr or maybe a Fisher airplane - I want two seats. Thanks Edward --- Stephen Jacobs wrote: > You worry me when you say it is not good !!! > > who is zeke Smith > > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > Hey Ron - As the man always says, your results may > differ. > > I discussed my concerns with Eduardo (this took some > time as he speaks > Spanish and I speak English). He certainly is a > bright guy and appears > to have done his homework. Everything else he has > done is near perfect, > including anodizing his ali parts and making up his > own legs and leg > attachments, fuel tanks etc. One other South > American (Leo, he speaks > English) is doing similar things with a GP4, in this > case the wing was > originally designed for a ply skin, but Leo is doing > a KR wing type > skin, but staying with the original design spars. > http://www.geocities.com/leoadrena/GP4.html > > Leo built a nice KR before, so he has been around > DIY airplanes for a > while. > > Zeke Smith has written various books and articles on > composite > structures - I see him as knowledgeable in these > matters. If he > perceives a problem with mixing E-glass and Carbon > fibre in the same > lay-up due to the differences in stiffness (as > suggested in the extract > I included) - I must wonder to what extent the same > problem will be > present in Eduardo's Structure - he is mixing ply > with glass. > > For that matter, how wise is it for Leo to build the > wing sub-structure > (spars /ribs etc.) according to the plans and then > completely change the > wing skin from ply to mould-less composite (not even > a true sandwich)? > > > > My strong interest is with Eduardo's way - I suppose > the question really > is which is "stiffer", the spruce frame or the > foam/glass composite. > > If the Composite component of Eduardo's airplane is > stiffer and takes > the initial load, all is well (if the glass bit is > spec'd to do the > job.) The spruce frame goes along for the ride. > > If the spruce frame is stiffer and loads up first - > it may not be strong > enough without the ply skin and fail. > > We both seem to like his approach, so let me know if > you learn any more. > > Take care > Steve J > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ___________________________________________________________ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 17:51:20 +0100 From: terry jones Subject: Re: KR> Materials To: KRnet Message-ID: <4177E908.5010309@ntlworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Hi Colin/Bev and others. I am not yet involved building, just 'studying' as a potential project. I have seen the notes re the fuselage construction, but bear in mind that if it deviates from the PFA (our version almost of the EAA) approved design, then the CAA (Cancel Amateur Aviation) would be down like the proverbial 'ton of bricks' . I would have to supply all stress figures, bending forces, the list is endless. You are lucky there Stateside in that you can use your own discretion to a large degree, here we would have to seek out the 'powers to be' even if it were to be painted a different colour almost... Terry Jones. Colin & Bev Rainey wrote: >Terry > >To help reduce your costs you may want to build the fuselage the way Eduardo and Dr Dean did out of the spruce frame and glass over foam core. This is the way all do the wings now, and many are starting to do the fuselage. Some thoughts for economy without loss of strength. The Vision has been built this way and is proven to be as strong given same weights. > >Colin & Bev Rainey >KR2(td) N96TA >Sanford, FL >crainey1@cfl.rr.com >http://kr-builder.org/Colin/index.html >_______________________________________ >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:30:05 EDT From: RENOSADLER@aol.com Subject: KR> KR1 To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <78.63ede505.2ea95a2d@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" I'm looking to buy a pair of wings for a kr1 i beleive two's might fit Thanks Bill email RENOSADLER@aol.com ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:32:40 EDT From: RENOSADLER@aol.com Subject: KR> kr1 To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <8e.17fbc9d7.2ea95ac8@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" looking for some wings to buy ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 14:35:21 EDT From: RENOSADLER@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> Materials To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <156.41ff44a5.2ea95b69@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" looking for a pair of wings for kr1 ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 12:16:35 -0700 From: "joe" Subject: Re: KR> Inspection To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001701c4b7a2$7be66c20$0a0110ac@o7p4e3> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Right, slipped up but resent with my email address fegbdf@earthlink.net Sorry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Freiberger" To: "'KRnet'" Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 5:15 PM Subject: RE: KR> Inspection > To whom is this message addressed? Does the KR "world" need this info. > > Ron Freiberger > mail to rfreiberger at swfla.rr.com <- substitute an @ sign ;o) > > -----Original Message----- > From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] On > Behalf Of IFLYKRS@aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, October 20, 2004 5:47 PM > To: krnet@mylist.net > Subject: Re: KR> Inspection > > Since I am self employed I can usually take off whenever. Let me > finish a > couple things up on the plane and then I will come down. Thanks. Bill > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 15:41:14 -0400 From: "Doug Rupert" Subject: RE: KR> Glass fuse To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <001401c4b7a5$edf8f820$3f04e440@office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Steve you have to think about what you just wrote there. Not much difference between foam and ply except for density and weight. If the skin is properly laid up per manufacturers spec the resulting structure will be the same. Mahogany ply is widely available around the world and has been used for years in aircraft construction the same as spruce. Reinforcing these woods with glass, whether E, S (my preference due to it's low cost and higher resistance to heat), Kevlar or Carbon will only make the resulting structure stronger. None of this is engineering but only logic as both wood and foam absorb resin during the lay-up process. Edwardo's idea allows a much easier fuselage construction in my humble opinion as the wood formers definitely take the guesswork out of sanding the foam to shape and assure that both sides are identical. It also allows an infinite choice of shapes as witnessed by the War Replica designs that follow the KR type box boat with wooden formers added to allow the builder to replicate what ever design he/she has chosen. Doug Rupert Simcoe Ontario ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 20:04:31 -0400 From: "Dean Cooper" Subject: Re: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <011801c4b7ca$b51c15d0$0502a8c0@office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Brian, That was a good laugh.... You know, friends don't let freinds drill their canopy alone (or something like that :-) I would have been glad to come over and help you out, of course, I would have brought the digital camera for show and tell at next year's Gathering... :-) Just kidding. Dean Cooper Jacksonville, FL Email me at dean_cooper@bellsouth.net See my KR project at www.geocities.com/djramccoop1/KR2_Home.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Kraut" To: "KRnet" Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2004 8:15 AM Subject: KR> Embarrasing moments in airplane building > If so many of you were not good friends I would keep quiet, but here goes. > > I was working on the canopy latch on my Midget Mustang last night. It will > have two 1/4" locking rods like a Schweizer sailplane (I will use the same > arrangement on the KR and post some pictures). I had an aluminum block > mounted to the canopy frame and one mounted to the top of the fusalage. I > needed to drill the one on the fusalage with the canopy closed from inside > so it would be perfectly in line with the hole in the block mounted to the > canopy. Half way through the drill bit got stuck and my flex shaft > arrangement broke. > > Well here I was with a 1/4" drill bit locking pin holding my canopy locked > closed and no tools to get it out. After about five minutes I realized I > had my cell phone and I had to call my answering machine in the house about > 15 times to wake up my wife so she could come to the garage and get me a > pair of pliers to pull out the drill bit. I had a hell of a time getting > her to wake up and was about to call Dean Cooper and ask him to drive over > and get me out. > > Don't try this one yourself. > > Brian Kraut > Engineering Alternatives, Inc. > www.engalt.com > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 19:22:22 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> Aileron pulley bracket question To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20041021192222.007e5100@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I'm currently making the aileron pulley assembly However I run into a problem >in the drawing of the pulley bracket on page 68 it shows the screws nuts >washers and gives the size of the alum tubing to be used for the post for the >cable guide. ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The cable guard can be anything that will keep the cable from coming off the pulley. I made mine with a piece of spruce. I cut it to the contour of the pulley, sanded it down to just above pulley height, then painted it with epoxy. I drilled two holes and bolted it in place and used "wood washers" that actually overlap the pulley. My guard actually follows the contour of the pulley for about two inches. If you're talking about the actual pulley bracket, I'd suggest using 1/8" aluminum angle. Wick's carries the size that you can cut the bracket from a solid piece. I tried the thinner stuff and didn't like the way it flexed. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 23 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 22:09:26 -0300 From: "Eduardo Iglesias" Subject: Re: KR> Glass fuse To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <00cd01c4b7d3$c7067c50$bb6e55c8@iglesias> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hi Stephen I´m Eduardo Iglesias, from La Pampa, Argentina and I know Eduardo Barros -he leaves near Buenos Aires- and his work. If you have any comunication problems, tell me and I can help you, with pleasure. Regards Eduardo ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Jacobs" To: "'KRnet'" Sent: Thursday, October 21, 2004 12:35 PM Subject: RE: KR> Glass fuse > You worry me when you say it is not good !!! > > who is zeke Smith > > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > Hey Ron - As the man always says, your results may differ. > > I discussed my concerns with Eduardo (this took some time as he speaks > Spanish and I speak English). He certainly is a bright guy and appears > to have done his homework. Everything else he has done is near perfect, > including anodizing his ali parts and making up his own legs and leg > attachments, fuel tanks etc. One other South American (Leo, he speaks > English) is doing similar things with a GP4, in this case the wing was > originally designed for a ply skin, but Leo is doing a KR wing type > skin, but staying with the original design spars. > http://www.geocities.com/leoadrena/GP4.html > > Leo built a nice KR before, so he has been around DIY airplanes for a > while. > > Zeke Smith has written various books and articles on composite > structures - I see him as knowledgeable in these matters. If he > perceives a problem with mixing E-glass and Carbon fibre in the same > lay-up due to the differences in stiffness (as suggested in the extract > I included) - I must wonder to what extent the same problem will be > present in Eduardo's Structure - he is mixing ply with glass. > > For that matter, how wise is it for Leo to build the wing sub-structure > (spars /ribs etc.) according to the plans and then completely change the > wing skin from ply to mould-less composite (not even a true sandwich)? > > I don't know, but my hopes are that one of the netters has an informed > opinion and will share it with us. > > My strong interest is with Eduardo's way - I suppose the question really > is which is "stiffer", the spruce frame or the foam/glass composite. > > If the Composite component of Eduardo's airplane is stiffer and takes > the initial load, all is well (if the glass bit is spec'd to do the > job.) The spruce frame goes along for the ride. > > If the spruce frame is stiffer and loads up first - it may not be strong > enough without the ply skin and fail. > > We both seem to like his approach, so let me know if you learn any more. > > Take care > Steve J > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > --- > [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] ------------------------------ Message: 24 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 22:15:16 -0400 From: "John Lindner" Subject: KR> New Airfoil on KR-1 To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001c01c4b7dc$f93fc290$0200a8c0@solarium> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Netters- I'm planning on building a KR-1 sometime in the future, and the new airfoil occurred to me as an alternative to the dated RAF48. I know the new wing has been successfully used on a KR2S, but I've never heard of it being used on the -1. I believe the RAF48 came off the -1 and went to the -2 to begin with, so it seems logical that the new wing would work on the KR-1 with the original size dimensions. Thoughts? I'm no aeronautical engineer, and I know many of you are happy to share your knowledge (and scathing remarks ;-), so I have donned my HazMat suit. Flame away. John Lindner ------------------------------ Message: 25 Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2004 21:22:25 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> New Airfoil on KR-1 To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000701c4b7dd$f8a6e880$1202a8c0@basement> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" John Lindner wrote: >> I'm planning on building a KR-1 sometime in the future, and the new airfoil occurred to me as an alternative to the dated RAF48. I know the new wing has been successfully used on a KR2S, but I've never heard of it being used on the -1. I believe the RAF48 came off the -1 and went to the -2 to begin with, so it seems logical that the new wing would work on the KR-1 with the original size dimensions. Thoughts?<< I think you are exactly right, in that the new airfoil series is certainly no worse for the KR1 than it is for the KR2S, and considering they both used the RAF48. Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 173 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================