From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 184 Date: 10/29/2004 6:12:39 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: bolt shear strength / Axle size (Allen Wiesner ) 2. RE: bolt shear strength / Axle size (Brian Kraut) 3. Great KR1 for sale (Bill Starrs) 4. Re: tailwheel noise and wing request (j stevens) 5. Re: tailwheel noise and wing request (j stevens) 6. Re: kr wing sets (gleone) 7. Tailwheel noise/axle size (larry flesner) 8. Re: Great KR1 for sale (Ed Janssen) 9. Oooops!; Re: KR> Great KR1 for sale (Ed Janssen) 10. RE: bolt shear strength / Axle size [long] (Matthew Elder) 11. Garmin MAPGPS 296 (Robert L. Stone) 12. Re: kr wing sets (JAMES FERRIS) 13. Re: kr wing sets (gleone) 14. Re: kr wing sets (JAMES FERRIS) 15. Re: kr wing sets (Orma) 16. Re: kr wing sets (RENOSADLER@aol.com) 17. Re: kr wing sets (larry flesner) 18. the heartbreak of Spraylat (Mark Langford) 19. Re: the heartbreak of Spraylat (Mark Jones) 20. Re: the heartbreak of Spraylat (Mark Langford) 21. RE: bolt shear strength / Axle size [long] (Brian Kraut) 22. RE: the heartbreak of Spraylat (Brian Kraut) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 00:02:02 -0400 From: "Allen Wiesner " Subject: Re: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <003901c4bd6c$0cd32ba0$0000a398@CPQ69645694259> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" For an AN3 bolt in single shear mode, steel is 2,125 lbs.; aluminum is 990 lbs. A AN4 bolt used as a tailwheel axle has a shear strength of 3,680 lbs. Hmmm, assuming a 36 pound load on the tail that's a 100g landing. :-) Reference: the table on page 84 of the 2004 Wicks catalog. Allen G. Wiesner KR-2SS/TD S/N 1118 65 Franklin Street Ansonia, CT 06401-1240 (203) 732-0508 flashyal@usadatanet.net ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 00:27:48 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Thanks Al. You must have the early version of the catalog they had at Sun N Fun. The newer one they did for Oshkosh has the pages a little different and I can't find it there. I will dig out my older one. I guess that 12 Gs on my seat belt bolts is plenty strong enough. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Allen Wiesner Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 12:02 AM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size For an AN3 bolt in single shear mode, steel is 2,125 lbs.; aluminum is 990 lbs. A AN4 bolt used as a tailwheel axle has a shear strength of 3,680 lbs. Hmmm, assuming a 36 pound load on the tail that's a 100g landing. :-) Reference: the table on page 84 of the 2004 Wicks catalog. Allen G. Wiesner KR-2SS/TD S/N 1118 65 Franklin Street Ansonia, CT 06401-1240 (203) 732-0508 flashyal@usadatanet.net _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Thu, 28 Oct 2004 23:27:16 -0600 From: "Bill Starrs" Subject: KR> Great KR1 for sale To: "KR1" Message-ID: <004101c4bd77$f4f596b0$8229b83f@Bill> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" My KR1 for sale contact me billstarrs@peoplepc.com for details and photos ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 01:36:44 -0500 From: j stevens Subject: KR> Re: tailwheel noise and wing request To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <4181E4FC.1020608@usfamily.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed k > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Brian Kraut" >To: "KRnet" >Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 9:45 PM >Subject: RE: KR> Tail Wheel - Pneumatic > >Larry if you cant find a suitable tire, there is a way to cut that >noise way down. It seems as though the fusalage acts like a megaphone >into the cockpit, > by damping the vibration of the wheel assembly against the fusalage It lessens the noise considerably. A bike inner tube doubled over and bolted between the tailspring and the body worksfine. Joel BTW does anyone know of a set of wet wings for sale? > > >>Could you put a picture on your web site? >> >>Brian Kraut >>Engineering Alternatives, Inc. >>www.engalt.com >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On >>Behalf Of Mark Jones >>Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 8:47 PM >>To: KRnet >>Subject: Re: KR> Tail Wheel - Pneumatic >> >> >>They do not list them on their web site. As soon as I seen the tire, I >> >> >knew > > >>it was what the tail draggers needed. The tire is 5" OD and I would >> >> >estimate > > >>inflated it is about 3/4" diameter. they had a price of $14.95 on the >>tire and $9.95 on the tube. I forgot to check the hub price. This >>store is only >> >> >a > > >>couple blocks from where I work. I can get you more info if needed or >>pick one up for you. >> >>Mark Jones (N886MJ) >>Wales, WI USA >>E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com >>Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at >>http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html >> >> >> >> ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 01:37:05 -0500 From: j stevens Subject: KR> Re: tailwheel noise and wing request To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <4181E511.9060308@usfamily.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed k > >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Brian Kraut" >To: "KRnet" >Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2004 9:45 PM >Subject: RE: KR> Tail Wheel - Pneumatic > >Larry if you cant find a suitable tire, there is a way to cut that >noise way down. It seems as though the fusalage acts like a megaphone >into the cockpit, > by damping the vibration of the wheel assembly against the fusalage It lessens the noise considerably. A bike inner tube doubled over and bolted between the tailspring and the body worksfine. Joel BTW does anyone know of a set of wet wings for sale? > > >>Could you put a picture on your web site? >> >>Brian Kraut >>Engineering Alternatives, Inc. >>www.engalt.com >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On >>Behalf Of Mark Jones >>Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 2004 8:47 PM >>To: KRnet >>Subject: Re: KR> Tail Wheel - Pneumatic >> >> >>They do not list them on their web site. As soon as I seen the tire, I >> >> >knew > > >>it was what the tail draggers needed. The tire is 5" OD and I would >> >> >estimate > > >>inflated it is about 3/4" diameter. they had a price of $14.95 on the >>tire and $9.95 on the tube. I forgot to check the hub price. This >>store is only >> >> >a > > >>couple blocks from where I work. I can get you more info if needed or >>pick one up for you. >> >>Mark Jones (N886MJ) >>Wales, WI USA >>E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com >>Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at >>http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html >> >> >> >> ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 05:38:40 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) From: "gleone" Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <4035FFD0.000001.03612@YOUR-FD6NVJCER4> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Don, It's really simple. Using wax paper (or peel ply), cover the stubs and tape in place using gorilla tape or waxed paper. Then, build your outer wings as normal. Once the fiberglass work is done, cut as per plans. The peel ply or waxed paper will protect the stub from any "splash over". If you're concerned about the WAF's being dripped on by the resin, cover the exposed part liberally with Johnson's Turtle Wax. I'm building the KR-1 /-1B. Right now I'm building the -1 wings but come spring, I'll be building the -1B wings. And in both cases, I'm using the 5046 airfoil. Enjoy! Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming -------Original Message------- From: Don Chisholm Date: 10/29/04 04:53:59 To: gleone@rtconnect.net Subject: KR> kr wing sets has anyone figured how to build wing sets separately _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 06:45:03 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> Tailwheel noise/axle size To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20041029064503.007dbd70@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Larry, Check the shear strength on a 1/4" bolt!! It is probably >overkill, Virg Virgil N. Salisbury +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ You're right. If we were talking just shear strength. I believe the original KR retracts only used 1/4" bolts for the axles on the main gear. My tailwheel is a single fork tailwheel and I'm concerned that, supported on one end only, the 1/4" bolt/axle will bend, not shear. Normal loads would probably not be a problem but when it hits that break in the cement at 30 miles per hour ! My present tailwheel has an axle in the 3/8" to 7/16" range and is rated for (I'm guessing here) about 250 pound load. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 06:49:46 -0500 From: ejanssen@chipsnet.com (Ed Janssen) Subject: Re: KR> Great KR1 for sale To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <006c01c4bdad$63a7cdf0$7a00a8c0@dad> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi, Bill, I'm REALLY intrigued by the details of your KR-1 and would love to see some more pictures of it and a description. If you have something (pictures, etc.) ready to send out to potential buyers by e-mail, could you send me a copy? Don't go through any extra work for me because I'm pretty far away to consider purchasing. Anyway, good luck - and thanks! Former KR-1 driver, Ed Central Illinois Ed Janssen mailto:ejanssen@chipsnet.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Starrs" To: "KR1" Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 12:27 AM Subject: KR> Great KR1 for sale > My KR1 for sale contact me billstarrs@peoplepc.com for details and photos > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 07:09:02 -0500 From: ejanssen@chipsnet.com (Ed Janssen) Subject: Oooops!; Re: KR> Great KR1 for sale To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <008501c4bdb0$147433b0$7a00a8c0@dad> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Guys, My sincere apologies for posting a personal message on the list. I DO know better. My "senior moment" of the day. It was meant for Bill Starrs only. Ed Ed Janssen mailto:ejanssen@chipsnet.com ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 06:27:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Matthew Elder Subject: RE: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size [long] To: KRnet Message-ID: <20041029132731.1673.qmail@web13908.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Brian, Actually I think most seat belt bolts are sized for 20g for shear. Not so much for flight maneuvers as much as a "hard landing" (aka nose first)... You can get a good idea of shear strength of any section with the following formula: Section area * .577 * tensile strength.... The .577 I know applies to steels, but I'm still looking around to see if it applies to ductile materials other than steel (aka aluminum). Anyone that might know, chime in so I can stop my hunt. (distortion-energy theorem if you want to look it up) So for a bolt (round section) you get: (radius ^ 2) * 3.1415 * .577 * tensile strength Example: AN-3 Bolt (3/16in dia) 0.09375^2 * 3.1415 * .577 * 125000psi = 1990 lbs I used 125000psi because that was the number I got from the Spruce catalog on the bolt tensile. It will vary based on the material you use, but all you have to do is look it up. Spruce lists that number as "minimum tensile" so where Wicks got the 2125lb figure, may be that the 125000psi number is conservative. I'm sure "AN" bolts aren't all made from the same materials... There are probably 2 or 3 acceptable ones that they make them out of, and it would depend on who made them. Spruce lists 4037 and 8740 with the 8740 being the most used. Don't forget to add a safety factor and of course you must keep in mind the amount of shear planes.... Also, you can forget about the bearing area on the surface you are transferring the load to... Just make sure you have enough bearing area to transfer the load without over-stressing the supporting material. Matt Brian Kraut wrote: Thanks Al. You must have the early version of the catalog they had at Sun N Fun. The newer one they did for Oshkosh has the pages a little different and I can't find it there. I will dig out my older one. I guess that 12 Gs on my seat belt bolts is plenty strong enough. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Allen Wiesner Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 12:02 AM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size ------------------------------------------------- Matthew Elder Orangeburg, SC http://www.infinigral.com/melder ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 10:27:12 -0500 (Central Daylight Time) From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: KR> Garmin MAPGPS 296 To: "KR Builders Pilots" Message-ID: <41826150.000008.00900@YOUR-AT5QGAAC3Z> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Netters I am sure can get a fleet price that will beat any other price I have ever seen on a brand new (with guarantee). Garmin MAPGPS 296. Reputed to be one of the best navigation units on the market. Any one interested, contact me off net. The more buyers I get the better the price will be. You will not be required to send me any money. When I get a list of people who are sincere in their desire to own one of these fine units, each buyer will be required to furnish the dealer with his or her credit card number and the unit will be shipped to you direct. Dealer will add shipping cost depending on how far away you live. The dealer is in Temple Texas. Aircraft Spruce lists this GPS for $1695.00. The dealer here has allready agreed to a price of $1600.00 each and $1500.00 for the purchase of two. I am sure if I tell him that I have 5 or six more lined up ready to buy, the price will be even lower. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx rstone4@hot.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 14:13:44 -0400 From: JAMES FERRIS Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20041029.141344.1516.0.mijnil@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Are you building the outboard panels attached to the center or building them separate, detached from the center section? Thanks Jim On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 05:38:40 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) "gleone" writes: > Don, > > It's really simple. Using wax paper (or peel ply), cover the stubs > and tape > in place using gorilla tape or waxed paper. Then, build your outer > wings as > normal. Once the fiberglass work is done, cut as per plans. The > peel ply > or waxed paper will protect the stub from any "splash over". If > you're > concerned about the WAF's being dripped on by the resin, cover the > exposed > part liberally with Johnson's Turtle Wax. I'm building the KR-1 > /-1B. > Right now I'm building the -1 wings but come spring, I'll be > building the > -1B wings. And in both cases, I'm using the 5046 airfoil. Enjoy! > > Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Don Chisholm > Date: 10/29/04 04:53:59 > To: gleone@rtconnect.net > Subject: KR> kr wing sets > > has anyone figured how to build wing sets separately > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2004 12:39:02 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) From: "gleone" Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <40366256.000001.03660@YOUR-FD6NVJCER4> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Yes, tThey will be bolted to the center spars when I build the second set of wings. That is the reason for protecting the wing stubs with peel ply or waxed paper. Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming. -------Original Message------- From: JAMES FERRIS Date: 10/29/04 12:17:24 To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets Are you building the outboard panels attached to the center or building them separate, detached from the center section? Thanks Jim On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 05:38:40 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) "gleone" writes: > Don, > > It's really simple. Using wax paper (or peel ply), cover the stubs > and tape > in place using gorilla tape or waxed paper. Then, build your outer > wings as > normal. Once the fiberglass work is done, cut as per plans. The > peel ply > or waxed paper will protect the stub from any "splash over". If > you're > concerned about the WAF's being dripped on by the resin, cover the > exposed > part liberally with Johnson's Turtle Wax. I'm building the KR-1 > /-1B. > Right now I'm building the -1 wings but come spring, I'll be > building the > -1B wings. And in both cases, I'm using the 5046 airfoil. Enjoy! > > Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: Don Chisholm > Date: 10/29/04 04:53:59 > To: gleone@rtconnect.net > Subject: KR> kr wing sets > > has anyone figured how to build wing sets separately > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 15:42:05 -0400 From: JAMES FERRIS Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20041029.154205.1516.1.mijnil@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Has anyone built the outboard panels without them being attached to the center section, it seems it would be easier to work with if a jig was built to maintain the twist and just build them on a table. thanks Jim On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 12:39:02 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) "gleone" writes: > Yes, they will be bolted to the center spars when I build the second > set of > wings. That is the reason for protecting the wing stubs with peel > ply or > waxed paper. > > Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming. > > > -------Original Message------- > > From: JAMES FERRIS > Date: 10/29/04 12:17:24 > To: krnet@mylist.net > Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets > > Are you building the outboard panels attached to the center or > building > them separate, detached from the center section? > Thanks > Jim > On Fri, 20 Feb 2004 05:38:40 -0700 (Mountain Standard Time) > "gleone" > writes: > > Don, > > > > It's really simple. Using wax paper (or peel ply), cover the > stubs > > and tape > > in place using gorilla tape or waxed paper. Then, build your > outer > > wings as > > normal. Once the fiberglass work is done, cut as per plans. The > > peel ply > > or waxed paper will protect the stub from any "splash over". If > > you're > > concerned about the WAF's being dripped on by the resin, cover > the > > exposed > > part liberally with Johnson's Turtle Wax. I'm building the KR-1 > > /-1B. > > Right now I'm building the -1 wings but come spring, I'll be > > building the > > -1B wings. And in both cases, I'm using the 5046 airfoil. Enjoy! > > > > Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming > > > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > From: Don Chisholm > > Date: 10/29/04 04:53:59 > > To: gleone@rtconnect.net > > Subject: KR> kr wing sets > > > > has anyone figured how to build wing sets separately > > _______________________________________ > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > _______________________________________ > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 16:34:48 -0400 From: "Orma" Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <007101c4bdf6$bd08ede0$6c34d445@ROBBINS1> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" just build them on a table Hello Net It's been nearly 10 years now, but back then I had to build a replacement wing for one that suffered from some storage damage. The washout and dihedral was no problem and it was a lot simpler to work on the table. Once the WAF's are attached to the spar put in the correct position and drilled, and bolted, I glued the end ribs into place and put in gusset blocks to make the assembly stable and then unbolted the hole thing and put it on the table to make the wing. Since the assembly did not fit flat on the table, I had to use sand bags to prop up the outboard end. I only built one wing like this. If I had two to build, I would bolt on both sets of spars and make sure that the twist and dihedral are the same for both. Orma Southfield, MI N110LR celebrating 20 years Flying, flying and more flying http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 16:57:09 EDT From: RENOSADLER@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <12e.4fbbe482.2eb408a5@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Hello anybody is there anyway to ck the washout after youve assembled the outboard wings? ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 18:02:37 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: Re: KR> kr wing sets To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20041029180237.007f8d60@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 04:57 PM 10/29/04 EDT, you wrote: >Hello >anybody is there anyway to ck the washout after youve assembled the outboard >wings? +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Yes, if you haven't installed the wing tips yet. If the cord lines aren't marked on the 36" and 48" ribs then mark them and use a digital level or other devise to make your measurement. If the tips have been installed try drawing the 36 inch rib on some ridgid material. Extend the cordline beyond the rib drawing and cut out the rib. Cut out the rib and slip the cutout over the wing and use the extended cord line to make your measurement. Or, it might be easier to just place a digital level across the spars on the bottom side of the wing and take your measurements at the inboard and outboard end. It's probably more important that both wings be equal than the amount of washout being EXACT. As to building a wing off the airplane, you have to start with the WAF's bolted to the centersection. Once you have enough material attached to the spars to hold the set there is no reason to keep it bolted to the aircraft. BUT, if anything moves, you're going to end up with a wing that won't attach to the airplane. You need a PERFECT fit at the fittings. You have no other option. As always, your results may vary. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 18:57:57 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR> the heartbreak of Spraylat To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <010401c4be13$1d76af70$1202a8c0@basement> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" NetHeads, I've spent 4 or 5 hours so far, and expect to spend many more, peeling the Spraylat off my canopy. Spraylat is the acrylic material that most canopy manufacturers apply to their canopies to eliminate scratching during shipping and subsequent construction. It seems that it hardens with age, and is seriously affected by primers. I read on the web somewhere that the cure was to spray a new layer of Spraylat on top of the original, but unfortunately I didn't have the good sense to order any yet. I finally got the hang of the inside and learned the big secret, which is start in the middle and peel outward toward the edges. That worked pretty good for the inside, and I expected similar results on the outside. But I've been scraping at it all afternoon, and it's gotten to be a real pain. It's easy enough out in the middle, but at the edges it has to be scrapped off a square millimeter at a time, which means by fingernail. Where it really gets tough is where Smooth Prime was applied to the Spraylat (accidentally, not thinking it would matter). Apparently there is some sort of hardening reaction between the two, along with some adhesion to the Plexiglas. It flakes off in tiny pieces. At my current rate, I'm stuck for another 10 hours. I'll order some Spraylat tonight and see how it goes, but for now, I'm warning you guys not to get primer, especially Smooth Prime, on your Spraylat. The easiest way to avoid this it to use several widths of electrical tape to make sure that the Spraylat never sees any primer of any kind. Electrical tape is THE ticket, as I learned from Don Reid several years ago. Masking tape will become a permanent part of your canopy if you use it. If you have masking tape (or duct tape) on your canopy, remove it right now to prevent further damage. Anybody with good ideas as to how to make this bearable is welcome to enlighten me, but right now I'm waiting 'till Tuesday when UPS can bring me some Spraylat to put on top of this mess... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 19:07:41 -0500 From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> the heartbreak of Spraylat To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <004801c4be14$7d942260$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Beer....more beer. That is the only thing that will make it beerable. Good luck Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Langford" To: "KRnet" Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 6:57 PM Subject: KR> the heartbreak of Spraylat > NetHeads, > > I've spent 4 or 5 hours so far, and expect to spend many more, peeling the > Spraylat off my canopy. Spraylat is the acrylic material that most canopy > manufacturers apply to their canopies to eliminate scratching during > shipping and subsequent construction. It seems that it hardens with age, > and is seriously affected by primers. I read on the web somewhere that the > cure was to spray a new layer of Spraylat on top of the original, but > unfortunately I didn't have the good sense to order any yet. I finally got > the hang of the inside and learned the big secret, which is start in the > middle and peel outward toward the edges. That worked pretty good for the > inside, and I expected similar results on the outside. But I've been > scraping at it all afternoon, and it's gotten to be a real pain. It's easy > enough out in the middle, but at the edges it has to be scrapped off a > square millimeter at a time, which means by fingernail. > > Where it really gets tough is where Smooth Prime was applied to the Spraylat > (accidentally, not thinking it would matter). Apparently there is some sort > of hardening reaction between the two, along with some adhesion to the > Plexiglas. It flakes off in tiny pieces. At my current rate, I'm stuck for > another 10 hours. I'll order some Spraylat tonight and see how it goes, but > for now, I'm warning you guys not to get primer, especially Smooth Prime, on > your Spraylat. The easiest way to avoid this it to use several widths of > electrical tape to make sure that the Spraylat never sees any primer of any > kind. Electrical tape is THE ticket, as I learned from Don Reid several > years ago. Masking tape will become a permanent part of your canopy if you > use it. If you have masking tape (or duct tape) on your canopy, remove it > right now to prevent further damage. > > Anybody with good ideas as to how to make this bearable is welcome to > enlighten me, but right now I'm waiting 'till Tuesday when UPS can bring me > some Spraylat to put on top of this mess... > > Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama > N56ML "at" hiwaay.net > see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 19:37:43 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> the heartbreak of Spraylat To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <010e01c4be18$abc196a0$1202a8c0@basement> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I said it was acrylic, but obviously it's latex, hence the name. I'm working on your "more beer" suggestion... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 21:10:46 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size [long] To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Thanks. That is pretty much in line with what Al came up with so it is probably accurate. Considering that the load is shared between two lap belt bolts plus the cable that is attached to the shoulder harness I should break well before the bolt. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Matthew Elder Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 9:28 AM To: KRnet Subject: RE: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size [long] Brian, Actually I think most seat belt bolts are sized for 20g for shear. Not so much for flight maneuvers as much as a "hard landing" (aka nose first)... You can get a good idea of shear strength of any section with the following formula: Section area * .577 * tensile strength.... The .577 I know applies to steels, but I'm still looking around to see if it applies to ductile materials other than steel (aka aluminum). Anyone that might know, chime in so I can stop my hunt. (distortion-energy theorem if you want to look it up) So for a bolt (round section) you get: (radius ^ 2) * 3.1415 * .577 * tensile strength Example: AN-3 Bolt (3/16in dia) 0.09375^2 * 3.1415 * .577 * 125000psi = 1990 lbs I used 125000psi because that was the number I got from the Spruce catalog on the bolt tensile. It will vary based on the material you use, but all you have to do is look it up. Spruce lists that number as "minimum tensile" so where Wicks got the 2125lb figure, may be that the 125000psi number is conservative. I'm sure "AN" bolts aren't all made from the same materials... There are probably 2 or 3 acceptable ones that they make them out of, and it would depend on who made them. Spruce lists 4037 and 8740 with the 8740 being the most used. Don't forget to add a safety factor and of course you must keep in mind the amount of shear planes.... Also, you can forget about the bearing area on the surface you are transferring the load to... Just make sure you have enough bearing area to transfer the load without over-stressing the supporting material. Matt Brian Kraut wrote: Thanks Al. You must have the early version of the catalog they had at Sun N Fun. The newer one they did for Oshkosh has the pages a little different and I can't find it there. I will dig out my older one. I guess that 12 Gs on my seat belt bolts is plenty strong enough. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Allen Wiesner Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 12:02 AM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR> bolt shear strength / Axle size ------------------------------------------------- Matthew Elder Orangeburg, SC http://www.infinigral.com/melder _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Fri, 29 Oct 2004 21:12:23 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> the heartbreak of Spraylat To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" There is a warning in the Aircraft Spruce catalog that it can be difficult to remove if left on more than a year, not that you don't already know that. They sell Unmask right under it on page 75 for removing the masking paper, but I don't know if it will help any on the spraylat. I just bought some of the Unmask for when I remove the electrical tape on my Mustang in a few weeks. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Mark Langford Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 7:58 PM To: KRnet Subject: KR> the heartbreak of Spraylat NetHeads, I've spent 4 or 5 hours so far, and expect to spend many more, peeling the Spraylat off my canopy. Spraylat is the acrylic material that most canopy manufacturers apply to their canopies to eliminate scratching during shipping and subsequent construction. It seems that it hardens with age, and is seriously affected by primers. I read on the web somewhere that the cure was to spray a new layer of Spraylat on top of the original, but unfortunately I didn't have the good sense to order any yet. I finally got the hang of the inside and learned the big secret, which is start in the middle and peel outward toward the edges. That worked pretty good for the inside, and I expected similar results on the outside. But I've been scraping at it all afternoon, and it's gotten to be a real pain. It's easy enough out in the middle, but at the edges it has to be scrapped off a square millimeter at a time, which means by fingernail. Where it really gets tough is where Smooth Prime was applied to the Spraylat (accidentally, not thinking it would matter). Apparently there is some sort of hardening reaction between the two, along with some adhesion to the Plexiglas. It flakes off in tiny pieces. At my current rate, I'm stuck for another 10 hours. I'll order some Spraylat tonight and see how it goes, but for now, I'm warning you guys not to get primer, especially Smooth Prime, on your Spraylat. The easiest way to avoid this it to use several widths of electrical tape to make sure that the Spraylat never sees any primer of any kind. Electrical tape is THE ticket, as I learned from Don Reid several years ago. Masking tape will become a permanent part of your canopy if you use it. If you have masking tape (or duct tape) on your canopy, remove it right now to prevent further damage. Anybody with good ideas as to how to make this bearable is welcome to enlighten me, but right now I'm waiting 'till Tuesday when UPS can bring me some Spraylat to put on top of this mess... Mark Langford, Huntsville, Alabama N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 184 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================