From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 235 Date: 12/10/2004 8:59:12 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Need dual in a KR near Dallas (Tom Andersen) 2. RE: Need dual in a KR near Dallas (Brian Kraut) 3. RE: bible code / KR code (Dana Overall) 4. KR registration numbers (Oscar Zuniga) 5. AS504x wing sections (Stephen Jacobs) 6. Re: AS504x wing sections (Mark Langford) 7. more kr1 questions (John Lindner) 8. AS504x wing sections (Oscar Zuniga) 9. KR1 on EBay (Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff) 10. Rear drive (Colin & Bev Rainey) 11. Re: Rear drive (larry severson) 12. RE: AS504x wing sections (Stephen Jacobs) 13. Re: gathering video (RENOSADLER@aol.com) 14. Re: more kr1 questions (VIRGIL N SALISBURY) 15. ground adjustable props (Brian Kraut) 16. Re: ground adjustable props (larry severson) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2004 23:03:52 -0600 From: "Tom Andersen" Subject: Re: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <005601c4de75$a6860f40$0200a8c0@DAVINCI> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Thanks Brian! How is my boat doing? I checked your website and didn't see anything on it? Unfortunately that KR-2S model had a spectacular finale. I was out at a model fly-in wringing it out and I called out real loud "Hey Yol, watch this 10G turn!" Well the wing popped in half when I think I pulled an 11G turn. Everyone was glad I called that out beforehand so they didn't miss the action... I have the parts, it may rise again. It was a way cool model that would float on and on at landing yet still do 100mph. If I reflexed the ailerons up 15deg at landing it would come down very predictably and three-point right in front of me, a dramatic change from trying to wheel land it on an uneven runway. Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Kraut" To: "KRnet" Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 10:34 PM Subject: RE: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas > Welcome Tom. Just break down and start another KR!. > > Everyone needs to look at Tom's site and click at the link on the > bottom > to > his 1/4 scale radio controlled KR. I saw some pictures and got the flight > reports when I picked up the 2S and it looked and sounded like the > slickest > R/C plane you would ever want to see. The R/C lawnmower was pretty cool > also. > > Brian Kraut > Engineering Alternatives, Inc. > www.engalt.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: krnet-bounces+brian.kraut=engalt.com@mylist.net > [mailto:krnet-bounces+brian.kraut=engalt.com@mylist.net]On Behalf Of > Tom Andersen > Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 11:11 AM > To: krnet@mylist.net > Subject: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas > > > Hi folks, > Is there anyone near Dallas, TX that could give me some dual time in > their KR-2? I bought an airplane very similar to a KR-1 that is > single seat, lightweight and aerodynamically slick, and I could use a > little time in something lightweight, responsive, and slick like a > KR-2. The plane I bought is a modified Star-lite, the single-seat > predecessor to the Pulsar. This Star-lite has had the ailerons reduced > in length so they are 4' long instead of full-span ailerons, and it is > a tri-gear. VNE is 150mph, cruise 100mph, stall 42mph, empty weight > is only 262lbs empty with Rotax 447 40hp for power. I'm a private > pilot with 280hrs in GA planes like the Grumman Cheetah I owned last > year, but I don't know the lightweight touch and speed > management required for a KR or Starlite. I started building a KR-2S a > few > years back but had to sell the project (to Brian Kraut) and move on so I'm > a > bit familiar with the KR. I did get a little time in Tom Crawford's KR-2 > a > few years back and it was great. Here's a link to some pics from that > ride. > http://home.triad.rr.com/wingspan/TomCKR/crawford.htm > If anyone has any helpful tips on transitioning to this Starlite plane, > I'd > love to hear it. There is an obvious difference in the mass of the > Starlite > in comparison to just about every other plane out there. How will that > interact with the Rotax's 50x38 prop and aerodynamically smooth shape? > -Tom Andersen > Dallas, TX > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 00:15:54 -0500 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" O.K., who is going to volunteer to try reflexed ailerons on their KR to see how it works in full scale? Tom, I'll send you some pictures off the net tomorrow. The KR has been slightly delayed due to a Midget Mustang I bought a few months ago that is nearly done. Also had another KR, almost bought a half share of a 172, and joined a glider club that has 5 gliders and a Navy flying club with 6 planes. Too many planes and too little time, but the KR is first in my heart. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Tom Andersen Sent: Friday, December 10, 2004 12:04 AM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas Thanks Brian! How is my boat doing? I checked your website and didn't see anything on it? Unfortunately that KR-2S model had a spectacular finale. I was out at a model fly-in wringing it out and I called out real loud "Hey Yol, watch this 10G turn!" Well the wing popped in half when I think I pulled an 11G turn. Everyone was glad I called that out beforehand so they didn't miss the action... I have the parts, it may rise again. It was a way cool model that would float on and on at landing yet still do 100mph. If I reflexed the ailerons up 15deg at landing it would come down very predictably and three-point right in front of me, a dramatic change from trying to wheel land it on an uneven runway. Do not archive ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Kraut" To: "KRnet" Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 10:34 PM Subject: RE: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas > Welcome Tom. Just break down and start another KR!. > > Everyone needs to look at Tom's site and click at the link on the > bottom to his 1/4 scale radio controlled KR. I saw some pictures and > got the flight reports when I picked up the 2S and it looked and > sounded like the slickest > R/C plane you would ever want to see. The R/C lawnmower was pretty cool > also. > > Brian Kraut > Engineering Alternatives, Inc. > www.engalt.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: krnet-bounces+brian.kraut=engalt.com@mylist.net > [mailto:krnet-bounces+brian.kraut=engalt.com@mylist.net]On Behalf Of > Tom Andersen > Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2004 11:11 AM > To: krnet@mylist.net > Subject: KR> Need dual in a KR near Dallas > > > Hi folks, > Is there anyone near Dallas, TX that could give me some dual time in > their KR-2? I bought an airplane very similar to a KR-1 that is > single seat, lightweight and aerodynamically slick, and I could use a > little time in something lightweight, responsive, and slick like a > KR-2. The plane I bought is a modified Star-lite, the single-seat > predecessor to the Pulsar. This Star-lite has had the ailerons reduced > in length so they are 4' long instead of full-span ailerons, and it is > a tri-gear. VNE is 150mph, cruise 100mph, stall 42mph, empty weight > is only 262lbs empty with Rotax 447 40hp for power. I'm a private > pilot with 280hrs in GA planes like the Grumman Cheetah I owned last > year, but I don't know the lightweight touch and speed > management required for a KR or Starlite. I started building a KR-2S a > few > years back but had to sell the project (to Brian Kraut) and move on so I'm > a > bit familiar with the KR. I did get a little time in Tom Crawford's KR-2 > a > few years back and it was great. Here's a link to some pics from that > ride. > http://home.triad.rr.com/wingspan/TomCKR/crawford.htm > If anyone has any helpful tips on transitioning to this Starlite plane, > I'd > love to hear it. There is an obvious difference in the mass of the > Starlite > in comparison to just about every other plane out there. How will that > interact with the Rotax's 50x38 prop and aerodynamically smooth shape? > -Tom Andersen > Dallas, TX > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 07:29:48 -0500 From: "Dana Overall" Subject: RE: KR> bible code / KR code To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed My bad for not coming clean at the very beginning............ Firewall painted gold, engine mount painted black, engine gold powder coated, now wiring this metal KR (with appropriated shoulder spacing:-) for flight. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY i39 RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod.com http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg do not archive ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:41:21 -0600 From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR> KR registration numbers To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed It's Friday, so bear with me here. You would think that something registered as "N100KR" would be a KR, right? Wrong. It's an award-winning gyrocopter, built and owned by Ken Rehler, right here in Texas... http://www.rvk-architects.com/ken/gyro/ I know that's only marginally KR related, but it's a very nice gyro, plus I'll throw in something else: two evenings ago I was fortunate to have bent elbows at the table with KRNet moderator Mark Langford, and enjoyed several adult beverages as well as a discussion about Corvair heads. I found out that Langford has long-range bladder tanks, making only a single pit stop to my three. But I've got a few years on him, too ;o) Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 19:12:13 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: KR> AS504x wing sections To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c4dedb$69914a30$9064a8c0@stephen> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Happy Friday guys Mr. Langford (alias Flinkdink, AKA long ranger), please straighten us out on the above topic. My KR2 plans have only 2 wing sections, both RAF48 - one is 48" chord (for the centre section) and the other is 36" for the tip. According to my plans, these are the final dimensions as the urethane foam is sanded to these templates. The Ashok sections generated and made available by your kind self and others offer the 48" section, but offer a shorter section for the tip - closer to 30". No doubt a good reason, but I am missing it. If you have a moment, maybe talk about the differences in the selection of airfoils included in the pdf file. Neat idea to express the section outline with two lines - any builder that has screwed up will appreciate the value of the back-up line. Regards SteveJ ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 14:39:20 -0600 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> AS504x wing sections To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <106301c4def8$53d5e940$5e0ca58c@net.tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Steve Jacobs wrote: > The Ashok sections generated and made available by your kind self and > others offer the 48" section, but offer a shorter section for the tip > - closer to 30". No doubt a good reason, but I am missing it. > If you have a moment, maybe talk about the differences in the selection > of airfoils included in the pdf file. Ashok designed that airfoil specifically for the KR2S, but the set of points he generated was for a standard "unity" profile, based on the chord length being 1.000. Not that it won't work just fine on a KR2, but at the time, I couldn't imagine anybody wanting to build a KR2 wing if they were starting from scratch, so the templates are also designed for the KR2S, rather than the KR2, hence the lack of a 36" chord tip template. The S wing planform is different, by virtue of the fact that the aft WAFs (wing attach fittings) are ALL bent 3 degrees, rather than just half, so the aft spar rakes forward 6 degrees. That makes the template at the end of the spar smaller (33"), and answers your question. The wing area is compensated for by adding a hoaky foam extension. The drawings that I made allow for the forward-thinking builder to make his spars longer, and include a template (30-11/16") for a tip located way out at 132.75" from the centerline. There's a dotted outline of a spar and the mention of this option printed on the template itself. There are a lot of details on these templates that I put in just to make building them easy and more foolproof. Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:18:18 -0500 From: "John Lindner" Subject: KR> more kr1 questions To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001301c4defd$c5702610$0200a8c0@solarium> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Has anyone ever heard of a place that sells KR1 premolds? I didn't see any mention of it on the RR site, and the archives turned up zero results. Also, what's the difference between ordering spruce from RR and ordering from Wick's? The Wick's kit is something like $7 cheaper in the end (not that it really matters), and that's the only difference I know of. One more thing: What's the dirt on the VW rear drive system? Seems like a nice deal, but I want to know if there is a catch that can be avoided with a front drive system. Thanks John Lindner jrlindner@comcast.net ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 15:28:25 -0600 From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR> AS504x wing sections To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Steve wrote- >Mr. Langford (alias Flinkdink, AKA long ranger), please straighten us >out on the above topic. The Ashok sections... offer a shorter section >for the tip -closer to 30". No doubt a good reason, but I am missing >it. Unless I'm mistaken, you might be a while waiting for Mr. Langford to reply directly to this one. He should be just between unpacking his bags to launder his jeans and get them re-packed again, headed overseas on travel. My recollection is that one of the objectives of the design exercise was to dispense with the stock KR-2S wingtip, which consists of gluing a block of foam to the outboard rib and shaping it to become the outboard end of the wing (or wing extension). The AS50xx wings carry a "real" airfoil all the way out to the end, leaving the builder to simply add a wingtip of his/her choice (winglet, squared tip, Hoerner, whatever). So the templates reflect a "real" wing all the way out to the end to develop the full wing area without what Langford calls the "hokey" or "hoaky" wing extensions. Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 13:53:58 -0800 From: "Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff" Subject: KR> KR1 on EBay To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <015301c4df02$c124ce80$6401a8c0@charlesmidkiff> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original There is a KR-1 advertised on EBay. It's at $63.00 at this time. It's located in Tacoma, WA. Maybe someone has already brought this to our attention, but if not here it is. The ad says he has the boat with inner spars installed and the plans. Bud Midkiff KR2 Stretched Lynnwood, WA email: c.midkiff@verizon.net ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 18:23:09 -0500 From: "Colin & Bev Rainey" Subject: KR> Rear drive To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <003301c4df0f$36242b20$2d432141@RaineyDay> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" All the rear drive accomplishes is to dampen the engine pulses to the prop so that other than wood props can be used, and the theory is that that end of the engine is designed for the rotational stress. No added torque or Hp is achieved with the direct drive model. Use of a PSRU on the rear end model multiplies the TORQUE output from the engine by whatever the reduction is, while Hp remains the same. PSRU also allows for the use of alternative props and allows the engine to spin up onto the cam profile while allowing the prop to spins slower making both more efficient. The GP rear drive also makes for a slight thinner profile of the cowling for better aerodynamics, and allows for the use of "correct" rotation props that rotate counter clockwise looking at the front, clockwise to the pilot looking out. Colin & Beverly Rainey Apex Lending, Inc. crainey@apexlending.com 407-323-6960 ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 15:31:37 -0800 From: larry severson Subject: Re: KR> Rear drive To: KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20041210153003.02689a60@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >All the rear drive accomplishes is to dampen the engine pulses to the >prop >so that other than wood props can be used, and the theory is that that end >of the engine is designed for the rotational stress. No added torque or >Hp is achieved with the direct drive model. But it does weigh a bunch, and require different engine mounts and exhaust system. Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2004 03:37:36 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: RE: KR> AS504x wing sections To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000f01c4df22$055587b0$1e64a8c0@stephen> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ashok designed that airfoil specifically for the KR2S ++++++++++++++++++ Thank you - it has now finally sunk in that there is a bit more to the 2S than a fuselage stretch, I had better get the supplement. Take care Steve J ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 21:20:54 EST From: RENOSADLER@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> gathering video To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <5b.5ec660d9.2eebb386@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" video did you know your ph is not working might have it check out ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 22:44:59 -0500 From: VIRGIL N SALISBURY Subject: Re: KR> more kr1 questions To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20041210.225016.2556.0.virgnvs@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Steve benneyt can bring you up to date on that,Virg On Fri, 10 Dec 2004 16:18:18 -0500 "John Lindner" writes: > Has anyone ever heard of a place that sells KR1 premolds? I didn't > see any mention of it on the RR site, and the archives turned up > zero results. > > Also, what's the difference between ordering spruce from RR and > ordering from Wick's? The Wick's kit is something like $7 cheaper > in the end (not that it really matters), and that's the only > difference I know of. > > One more thing: What's the dirt on the VW rear drive system? Seems > like a nice deal, but I want to know if there is a catch that can be > avoided with a front drive system. > > Thanks > > John Lindner > jrlindner@comcast.net > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at > http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > Virgil N. Salisbury - AMSOIL www.lubedealer.com/salisbury Miami ,Fl ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 23:05:42 -0500 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: KR> ground adjustable props To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Can anyone that has use a ground adjustable prop give me some feedback as to how well they work. Is it a simple matter of taking ten minutes to adjust to a higher pitch when you are light and going on a long cross country then adjsting it back for normal flying or is it one of those things that takes a while to do and you adjust it for the best compromise and keep it there? Can you generally get enough increase in cruise speed to make it even worth it on a four hour cross country or will the added time to get to high cruise altitude make the whole thing a wash? Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2004 20:38:06 -0800 From: larry severson Subject: Re: KR> ground adjustable props To: KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20041210202831.00bfef08@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed >Can anyone that has use a ground adjustable prop give me some feedback >as to how well they work. Is it a simple matter of taking ten minutes >to adjust to a higher pitch when you are light and going on a long >cross country then adjsting it back for normal flying or is it one of >those things that takes a while to do and you adjust it for the best >compromise and keep it there? For the Warp Drive Prop, I had to physically take it off the shaft to get at the bolts that let me change the pitch. If you have a spinner, this increases the time required. >Can you generally get enough increase in cruise speed to make it even >worth it on a four hour cross country or will the added time to get to >high cruise altitude make the whole thing a wash? The pitch is how far the prop blade moves forward in one revolution absent drag.Changing pitch from 49 to 54 is 10 percent increase in forward movement (reduced by drag) so, it depends on how clean your plane is vs how much climb you need. Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 235 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================