From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 47 Date: 4/27/2004 9:00:23 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. delaminations! (Larry A Capps) 2. Gear attach fittings (Gavin Donohoe) 3. Re: Gear attach fittings (Dan Heath) 4. Re: Gear attach fittings (Dean Cooper) 5. RE: Gear attach fittings (Stephen Jacobs) 6. RE: delaminations! (Brian Kraut) 7. RE: Gear attach fittings (Brian Kraut) 8. WAFs (Brian Kraut) 9. delaminations! (larry flesner) 10. Re: fillers (larry flesner) 11. Re: Weapons Release News (Scott Cable) 12. RE: delaminations! (larry flesner) 13. RE: Successful VW Conversion (Ron Butterfield) 14. WAF's (danharris@pacific.net) 15. Lakeport,ca (danharris@pacific.net) 16. Re: delaminations! (Ron Eason) 17. Re: fillers (Ron Eason) 18. Re: fillers (larry severson) 19. gas canopy struts (larry severson) 20. RE: WAF's (Kevin Angus) 21. Re: gas canopy struts (Dan Heath) 22. RE: delaminations! (Brian Kraut) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 26 Apr 2004 23:38:45 -0500 From: "Larry A Capps" Subject: KR> delaminations! To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <001e01c42c11$8732b510$0500a8c0@schpankme> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" In my earlier post, I mentioned that the peeks get sanded down but not the valleys, they remain un-sanded; the inside of these microscopic broken glass bubbles (cups) are made of smooth glass or cured un-sanded epoxy. Knowing this, I would not consider "hard-shelling" as a practical alternative to the conventional lay-up. Epoxy dose not stick to GLASS. Try gluing some epoxy to a mirror (reflective side - plz) and see how easily the epoxy peels off the mirror, after cured. Your creating much the same effect when you allow the Micro Slurry to cure (hard-shelling). By only knocking of the sharp points prior to your layup, you haven't even come close to preparing the Epoxy surface for the secondary bond (removing the impurities and the sheen). This is why we use peel-ply, if you can't sand it, you peel-ply it. Even then, hit it a few times with the sand paper and wipe clean before bonding! As for testing which is stronger, were not talking about grabbing a handful of glass cloth, epoxied to foam, and pulling to see which is stronger. Were talking about the bond between the cured fiberglass top layer and the hard-shell. The test I'm looking for would be to insert a balloon between the Epoxy/GLASS (hard-shell) and the cured Epoxy/Fabric layer and inflate. Isn't this what's going on during extreme temperature changes and differing atmospheric pressures? Maybe someone could show me where it say's, the best way to get a secondary bond on cured epoxy part is to do nothing, no sanding, no washing, no wiping/vacuuming - once cured just add more epoxy and your good to go. I'd luv to see that. Also, could someone be so kind as to show me where it says, Epoxy sticks to GLASS - It would really put this whole, should I or shouldn't I hard-shell to rest. Larry A Capps Naperville, IL "Good judgment comes from bad experience, and a lot of that comes from bad judgment." -----Original Message----- the problem was not in "hard-shelling" if it happened only in a localized area. I used slurry much the consistancy of honey. I applied it with a rubber squeege and removed as much as possible so as to seal the foam only. I brushed the foam with sandpaper once or twice after the slurry cured to remove little "prickleys" that would snag the glass when I would attempt to move it before wetting it out. I would then wet the glass in the normal manner. I laid up all the glass on my KR without assistance from anyone and never felt rushed and that includes scratch built wings. I'm still convinced that the bond between the cured slury and the glass/resin is stronger than the foam core and that the glass is bonded to the foam with the same strength as when the glass is laid up over wet slurry. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 16:02:27 +1000 From: "Gavin Donohoe" Subject: KR> Gear attach fittings To: "KR builders and pilots" Message-ID: <000801c42c1d$3a8cdb80$bc4d8690@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Hi all, Is there any real need to flox my Deihl gear leg fittings to the spar ?? I was planning on using some wax paper under them, and then floxing them to the spar so they would be removable if need be. The flox is just there to fill any irregularities on the surface isn't it ?? Gav --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.668 / Virus Database: 430 - Release Date: 24/04/2004 ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 05:56:55 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> Gear attach fittings To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <408E2E67.000026.02164@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Yes, the flox is there to fill the irregularities. I would not advise anyone to put wax paper under them, but I can't see that it will hurt anything. I would not do it. How are you going to get in there to remove them anyway. Why would you ever want to remove them? If you want a removable gear, use the Grove type. It bolts on from the outside and you can see and check the bolts anytime you choose. There is a time for building and a time for flying, and the time for building has long since expired. See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC KR_Dan@KR-Builder.org See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 06:52:01 -0400 From: "Dean Cooper" Subject: Re: KR> Gear attach fittings To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <069701c42c45$abe3b8d0$0502a8c0@office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Gav wrote: > Is there any real need to flox my Deihl gear leg fittings to the spar > ?? Gav, et al: I thought the brackets were floxed to avoid any vibration or shifting and also to increase the strength of the gear/spar combo? This is similar to floxing the WAF's to the spars, isn't it? Anyway, I agree with Dan and I'm not sure you would ever need to remove the gear brackets. Just a thought... Dean Cooper Jacksonville, FL Email me at dean_cooper@bellsouth.net See my KR project at www.geocities.com/djramccoop1/KR2_Home.html ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 13:17:44 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: RE: KR> Gear attach fittings To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000c01c42c49$46de6030$9564a8c0@homedesktop> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" How are you going to get in there to remove them anyway .............................................. I had not thought about this before, but surely we need future access to each and every bolt /rivet /screw etc. on the airplane. I would hope to be able to inspect and torque every bolt on the airplane during the annual inspection, plus check on every other fastener or connector - particularly metal to wood attachments where shrinkage could be as issue - like the gear where we have fittings bolted to wooden. This is a big head-up for me - thanks. Steve J ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 08:24:13 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> delaminations! To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have thought of taking something like a thin steel ruler and putting 1/4" deep grooves in the foam in a 6" X 6" grid pattern before putting on the micro. That would prevent the glass from separating from the foam and also give it a little more stiffness while adding very little weight. Has anyone ever tried this? Maybe I will do some test pieces. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of larry flesner Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 11:27 PM To: KRnet Subject: KR> delaminations! The problem we have experienced is localized in only >one area that is already repaired, but it could happen to others who >have done what we have done. I WILL NOT be doing any hard-shelling and >will recommend against it. - Michael Pollock - Flying Velocity N173DT >Larry A Capps Naperville, IL +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The above "snip" would indicate to me that the problem was not in "hard-shelling" if it happened only in a localized area. From the a ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 08:32:26 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> Gear attach fittings To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I thought of wrapping mine with bagging film first, but then I realized that if I needed to remove them I could probably just pop them off the aluminum bracket. The Diehl instructions say the flox is to prevent rocking. I think it also gives you a nice flat, even surface between the leg and the aluminum whick keeps the pressure from being concentrated on the high points of the leg. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces+brian.kraut=engalt.com@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces+brian.kraut=engalt.com@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Gavin Donohoe Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 2:02 AM To: KR builders and pilots Subject: KR> Gear attach fittings Hi all, Is there any real need to flox my Deihl gear leg fittings to the spar ?? I was planning on using some wax paper under them, and then floxing them to the spar so they would be removable if need be. The flox is just there to fill any irregularities on the surface isn't it ?? Gav --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.668 / Virus Database: 430 - Release Date: 24/04/2004 _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 08:32:29 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: KR> WAFs To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I checked with Jeanette yesterday and she is not discontinuing the WAFs. Se just doesn't have the big ones in yet. She does have plenty of the small ones. My offer to make and sell fittings was more to help builders, not to take business away from Jeanette for not much profit. Therefore, I will not be selling WAFs, unless my price comes back good enought that Jeanette wants to buy them from me. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 07:55:57 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> delaminations! To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040427075557.007eb500@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Epoxy dose not stick to GLASS. >Try gluing some epoxy to a mirror (reflective side - plz) and see how >easily the epoxy peels off the mirror, after cured. (Larry Capps) +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ If my "hard-shelled" foam had a mirror finish, even I wouldn't try glassing to it. Fact is that isn't the case. On my "hard-shelled" foam I saw plenty of surface irregularities for the epoxy to bond to and appearantly that was the case. (L.Flesner) ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >As for testing which is stronger, were not talking about grabbing a >handful of glass cloth, epoxied to foam, and pulling to see which is >stronger. Were talking about the bond between the cured fiberglass top >layer and the hard-shell. The test I'm looking for would be to insert >a balloon between the Epoxy/GLASS (hard-shell) and the cured >Epoxy/Fabric layer and inflate. Isn't this what's going on during >extreme temperature changes and differing atmospheric pressures? >(L.Capps) >+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Isn't that basiclly a peel test? As I see it, for your concern to be valid, you would have to have pockets of trapped air between the "hard-shell" layer and the epoxy/fiber layer. I can't imagine doing a layup that poorly and then flying it. I don't see any factor to start a "failure mode" here. It seems to me our concern with the epoxy/fiber to foam or "hard-shell" bond is stresses in shear and peel. In either case, if the foam fails 100 PERCENT of the time before the bond fails, why do I care if the bond is only 1 percent stronger than the foam ,as your logic might suggest, or X to the power of 10 times stronger than the foam. When I recently pulled a 1 foot by 7 foot section of glass off the bottom of my left wing to get to the tank, it pulled 100 percent foam. There was absolutely no spots where the epoxy/fiber pulled from the "hard-shell". (L.Flesner) +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >Maybe someone could show me where it say's, the best way to get a >secondary bond on cured epoxy part is to do nothing, no sanding, no >washing, no wiping/vacuuming - once cured just add more epoxy and your >good to go. I'd luv to see that. (L.Capps) ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I had heard and read that you don't try to bond epoxy to epoxy without some prep. In my quest for knowledge I tried it. I took two pieces of whith pine and painted on enough FPL-16A epoxy on each piece to have it cure with a very shinny finish. After curing I painted on some more FPL-16A and clamped the two pieces of wood together. When cured I tried to separate the two pieces. The failure point was entirely in the wood. I'm not saying this is the strongest possible bond but it was stronger than the material being bonded and that's my point with the method I used for "hard-shelling". (L.Flesner) +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > >Also, could someone be so kind as to show me where it says, Epoxy >sticks to GLASS - It would really put this whole, should I or shouldn't >I hard-shell to rest. Larry A Capps ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ So what keeps the micro balloons in the filler from falling out all over the shop floor? :-) Larry Flesner ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >"Good judgment comes from bad experience, and a lot of that comes from >bad judgment." >+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ So far I've had no bad experiences with my "hard-shelling". Does that mean I used good judgement? YOUR RESULTS MAY VARY. DO YOUR OWN TESTING. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 07:56:43 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: Re: KR> fillers To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040427075643.007d6bb0@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I guess you are right for your method. My goal was to not have any >finishing for the final glass and it happened that way. I don't want to >risk sanding through to cloth. KRron +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Ron, Are you talking "finishing" or "fill" here. The way to eliminate "fill" is to get the foam right to start with. I used the 1.4 oz deck cloth over my "KR cloth" and even it required some amount of "finishing" before priming, generally some light sanding. Your post would suggest that when your epoxy/fiber layup cured you were ready for primer/paint. I personally would not suggest "hard-shelling" as the method to cure irregularities in the foam. The best way to eliminate irregularities in the foam is with a new piece of foam. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 06:09:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Cable Subject: Re: KR> Weapons Release News To: KRnet Message-ID: <20040427130909.48005.qmail@web40811.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sure Larry, I'm positive that the KR could carry 20 or more of these SSB's in the internal bomb bay of your KR-2B ;) ;) --- larry flesner wrote: > >The project that I'm working on (X-45)recently made > an > >aviation milestone by atonomously releasing a Small > >Diameter Smart Bomb (SSB). From 35,000 ft., flying > at > >over .65 mach, the inert bomb stuck within inches > of > >the center of the target(an old 2 1/2 ton truck). > >Scott Cable > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > Scott, > > Please forward info on bomb weight, dimensions, > number of > hard points required, and other suggestions for > mounting, > release, targeting, and lunch box size required to > sneak one > of those babys out of the plant. > > There is a Q-200 I'd like to take out before he has > a chance > to get airborne. :-) :-) > > Larry Flesner > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 08:06:56 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: RE: KR> delaminations! To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040427080656.007d2ad0@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >I have thought of taking something like a thin steel ruler and putting >1/4" deep grooves in the foam in a 6" X 6" grid pattern before putting >on the micro. That would prevent the glass from separating from the >foam and also give it a little more stiffness while adding very little >weight. Has anyone ever tried this? Maybe I will do some test pieces. >Brian Kraut +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The foam will just fail with a "grid" pattern attached. I really don't see the need for anything more than sealing the foam with whatever method you chose and glassing it. How many KRs have flown before us using that method and how many have fallen from the sky because of the epoxy/fiber delaminating from the foam? It's a beautiful morning out and I need to run by the hangar. I think I'll take my ol' "hard-shelled" bird up for a quick flight! :-) Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 12:20:34 -0400 From: Ron Butterfield Subject: RE: KR> Successful VW Conversion To: mjgill@webone.com.au, KRnet Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.0.20040427121326.01b7cec0@pop.mebtel.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed The basic idea is to take a stock flywheel, cut in down on a lathe to an appropriate diameter, and drill it with a bolt pattern. This becomes the flange for a hand-start engine. Then, a spool is machined from aluminum, with a center section of about 2-3/4" diameter, about 4" long overall, with a flange on each end (one with the bolt pattern of the prop, the other with the bolt pattern of the flange). There is a hole about 1-3/4" diameter through the middle, I am assuming for weight reduction. Caveat: I have not seen this, nor flown behind one, nor built one. This is just the information I have been able to find. I have also read that if the machining, especially the bolt circles, is not done accurately, the resulting offset can create a horrendous vibration and possibly break cranks or cases. Regards, RonB ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 16:11:08 -0700 From: danharris@pacific.net Subject: KR>WAF's To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <20040427220529.M25958@pacific.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Brian K. Did Janet have any idea whin she would have the WAF's available ? Please let me know. Thanks Dan Harris N667PD ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 16:28:47 -0700 From: danharris@pacific.net Subject: KR> Lakeport,ca To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <20040427222403.M54259@pacific.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hey I feel like the ugly step-child out here in Lakeport. Are there any KR's in the near surroundings? If so where are you. Thanks Dan Harris N667PD ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 18:10:24 -0500 From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Re: KR> delaminations! To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <023d01c42cac$d27f6d60$6701a8c0@JRLENGINEERING> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Not a bad idea in my opinion. KRron ----- Original Message ----- From: "Brian Kraut" To: "KRnet" Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 7:24 AM Subject: RE: KR> delaminations! > I have thought of taking something like a thin steel ruler and putting 1/4" > deep grooves in the foam in a 6" X 6" grid pattern before putting on > the micro. That would prevent the glass from separating from the foam > and also > give it a little more stiffness while adding very little weight. Has anyone > ever tried this? Maybe I will do some test pieces. > > Brian Kraut > Engineering Alternatives, Inc. > www.engalt.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On > Behalf Of larry flesner > Sent: Monday, April 26, 2004 11:27 PM > To: KRnet > Subject: KR> delaminations! > > > The problem we have experienced is localized in only > >one area that is already repaired, but it could happen to others who > >have done what we have done. I WILL NOT be doing any hard-shelling > >and will recommend against it. - Michael Pollock - Flying Velocity > >N173DT Larry A Capps Naperville, IL > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > The above "snip" would indicate to me that the problem was not in > "hard-shelling" if it happened only in a localized area. From the a > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 18:39:52 -0500 From: "Ron Eason" Subject: Re: KR> fillers To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <024f01c42cb0$f05ab840$6701a8c0@JRLENGINEERING> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I don't know how to finish [sand] raw urethane foam to a smooth un-even surface. It will always have slight valleys and irregularities in it. I forgot to mention I used peel-ply over the "deck cloth" and 5.4 oz fiberglass cloth [one lay-up] after I filled and sanded [finished] the filled-foam structure smooth. Again the intent was to have a finished piece of work before lay-up so the lay-up is final ready for prime. This method was suggested by the aeropoxy rep. some years ago and it makes since to me. I was sure to clean the filler with solvent [lacquer thinner] to remove dust and give the epoxy resin a porous surface to soak into. [note: all low spots were filled and sanded to a straight edge gauge.] Note: don't use polyester filler under epoxy laminates, it will not adhere as well in my opinion. Epoxy chemically bonds better to epoxy. I my case it's a done deal. KRron ----- Original Message ----- From: "larry flesner" To: "KRnet" Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 7:56 AM Subject: Re: KR> fillers > > >I guess you are right for your method. My goal was to not have any > >finishing for the final glass and it happened that way. I don't want > >to risk > >sanding through to cloth. > >KRron > +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > Ron, > > Are you talking "finishing" or "fill" here. The way to eliminate > "fill" is > to get the foam right to start with. I used the 1.4 oz deck cloth > over my "KR cloth" and even it required some amount of "finishing" > before priming, generally some light sanding. Your post would suggest > that when your epoxy/fiber layup cured you were ready for > primer/paint. > > I personally would not suggest "hard-shelling" as the method to cure > irregularities in the foam. The best way to eliminate irregularities > in the foam is with a new piece of foam. > > Larry Flesner > > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 17:04:11 -0700 From: larry severson Subject: Re: KR> fillers To: Ron Eason , KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040427165957.00bc4628@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 06:39 PM 4/27/2004 -0500, you wrote: >I don't know how to finish [sand] raw urethane foam to a smooth >un-even surface. It will always have slight valleys and irregularities >in it. After you get the glassing done, you can get the irregularities out with dry micro. What most people forget to mention is that, once you get the micro dry so that it resembles pie dough in consistency, you can thin it to what ever working level you want with rubbing alcohol. I got 97% alcohol - 3% water from the local drug store - cheap. The alcohol evaporates before the micro and I have had great adhesion and, when applied with a squeegee, almost no sanding for a smooth surface. Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 17:30:52 -0700 From: larry severson Subject: KR> gas canopy struts To: KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040427172759.02e06c80@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Some time ago there was lots of information on the best canopy struts on the net. Of course I wasn't going to use them, so I made the mistake of ignoring the valuable information. Now I need some kind sole to make up for my deficiency by repeating the information of type and best places to get them. Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 18:58:35 -0600 From: "Kevin Angus" Subject: RE: KR>WAF's To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I called today and ordered plans for the KR1, KR1-B, and KR2. While talking with Janet I mentioned the WAF "problem" and she indicated her distain for the rumor mill, she would prefer that people call her rather then speculate. I don't think she understands, people on this list are from around the world so dropping a nickel is really dropping $5.00. The RR web site now talks about the KR-1B! Kevin -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of danharris@pacific.net Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 5:11 PM To: KRnet Subject: KR>WAF's Brian K. Did Janet have any idea whin she would have the WAF's available ? Please let me know. Thanks Dan Harris N667PD _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 21:08:25 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> gas canopy struts To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <408F0409.000014.01968@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Larry, Try these people sales@spdhardware.com I think what you are looking for, they call, gas springs. You can also browse their site spdhardware.com . They have most any type of strut you may be looking for. There is a time for building and a time for flying, and the time for building has long since expired. See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC KR_Dan@KR-Builder.org See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Tue, 27 Apr 2004 21:46:50 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> delaminations! To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" You are correct that it is usually not a big problem if the glass separates from the foam in some places. Most KRs I have seen have seperation in some places. My only concern was cosmetic. My last KR had a big bubble near the trailing edge. It looked O.K. on cold days, but the glass expanded when it was hot and bubbled. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of larry flesner Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 9:07 AM To: KRnet Subject: RE: KR> delaminations! >I have thought of taking something like a thin steel ruler and putting >1/4" deep grooves in the foam in a 6" X 6" grid pattern before putting >on the micro. That would prevent the glass from separating from the >foam and also give it a little more stiffness while adding very little >weight. Has anyone >ever tried this? Maybe I will do some test pieces. >Brian Kraut +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ The foam will just fail with a "grid" pattern attached. I really don't see the need for anything more than sealing the foam with whatever method you chose and glassing it. How many KRs have flown before us using that method and how many have fallen from the sky because of the epoxy/fiber delaminating from the foam? It's a beautiful morning out and I need to run by the hangar. I think I'll take my ol' "hard-shelled" bird up for a quick flight! :-) Larry Flesner _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 47 ************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================