From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 76 Date: 5/18/2004 9:03:50 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. RE: Air brake holes/ C.G. (Doug Rupert) 2. control stick (larry flesner) 3. carbon fiber (Mike Turner) 4. Re: CC ing the heads-Buret (Ron Butterfield) 5. Re: CC ing the heads-Buret (Scott Cable) 6. Re: Air brake holes/ C.G. (larry severson) 7. RE: Corvair engines (Kevin Angus) 8. Re: CC ing the heads-Buret (Mark Langford) 9. RE: CC ing the heads-Buret (Brian Kraut) 10. Re: CC ing the heads-Buret (Mark Langford) 11. Thank you to Mark Langford (Ron Smith) 12. SB: Holes vs No Holes (ronevogt@cox.net) 13. RE: Alternator/ Solar Power (Doug Rupert) 14. Re: Microair 760 (Dene Collett (SA)) 15. Re: Microair 760 to X-Com (Barry Kruyssen) 16. Re: Microair 760 (FIXERJONES@aol.com) 17. Re: Building my cowl mold (Joseph H Horton) 18. Re: RE: KR> Corvair engines (skphil@charter.net) 19. Re: Building my cowl mold (Mark Jones) 20. Re: Larger KR Flaps / air brakes (Phillip Matheson) 21. SB: Holes vs No Holes (larry flesner) 22. Larger KR Flaps / air brakes (larry flesner) 23. engine update (Mark Langford) 24. Re: engine update (Mark Jones) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 01:10:08 -0400 From: "Doug Rupert" Subject: RE: KR> Air brake holes/ C.G. To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c43c96$65abb7d0$b104e440@office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Larry: How long is your control stick? Doug Rupert ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 07:29:35 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> control stick To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040518072935.0083b860@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 01:10 AM 5/18/04 -0400, you wrote: >Larry: How long is your control stick? >Doug Rupert ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I don't have that measurement handy so I'll have to check the next time I'm at the hangar. In the mean time you can go to http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/flesner/02092590.jpg and get an idea on their length. Larry ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 08:45:37 -0500 From: "Mike Turner" Subject: KR> carbon fiber To: "krnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Ron Smith please e-mail me off line. Mike Turner Spin the prop, light the fire, dance among the stars............N428CM ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 09:57:47 -0400 From: Ron Butterfield Subject: Re: KR> CC ing the heads-Buret To: KRnet Message-ID: <6.0.1.1.0.20040518095648.01c500a0@pop.mebtel.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 07:15 PM 5/17/04, Orma wrote: >Man !!! $100 to $150 is too rich for my budget. How about these? $15 http://www.vwalley.com/images/head_cc_kit.jpg I know nothing. I am only a messenger. Regards, Ron Butterfield ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 07:42:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Cable Subject: Re: KR> CC ing the heads-Buret To: KRnet Message-ID: <20040518144221.95009.qmail@web40804.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Ron & Orma, There are other alternatives, like the one below, As I mentioned earlier, you can pick up a veterinary syringe for $4-5 at a Feed and Farm Supply Store. Like Tractor Supply Co. --- Ron Butterfield wrote: > How about these? > > $15 > http://www.vwalley.com/images/head_cc_kit.jpg ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! - Internet access at a great low price. http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/ ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 07:45:11 -0700 From: larry severson Subject: Re: KR> Air brake holes/ C.G. To: KRnet Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040518074256.03102418@pop-server.socal.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 08:10 PM 5/17/2004 -0700, you wrote: >Is there any kind of guidance on these holes in the >speed brake? I have a belly board (speed brake) and >it is solid. I can easily put holes in it. What is >the optimum size hole and number? Does layout matter? In the newsletters, there was a diagram of a speed brake installation dated 8/15/76. It had two offset rows of 2 inch holes on a 6X30 inch brake. Larry Severson Fountain Valley, CA 92708 (714) 968-9852 larry2@socal.rr.com ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 09:30:10 -0600 From: "Kevin Angus" Subject: RE: KR> Corvair engines To: , "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" After hunting around Utah for a month I made a "road trip" to LA and purchased four engines, one running and three long blocks with extra heads (these cost more then $100 each). That little 1200 mile trip was a nice break but I really hated the 55mph right lane only CA. Next step: Sandblaster! (and a lift to get the motors out of my enclosed trailer!). Kevin Angus -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces+kangus=talkcycle.com@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces+kangus=talkcycle.com@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Jack Cooper Sent: Monday, May 17, 2004 5:52 PM To: Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft; KR builders and pilots Subject: KR> Corvair engines April 18, 2004, Oscar Zuniga wrote. "I had a guy call me today from southern Virginia with a bunch of Corvair engines. He wanted to know if I wanted them for around $100 each. He thinks they are all 164 cu in engines. We don't need any engines right now and Virginia is a long way from Iowa so I thought I'd give you all his number incase you have any ideas of your own. His name is Ray and his number is (434) 848-2810." I am now the proud owner of these engines. See picture at, http://jackandsandycooper.com/engine.html Mike Hyers drove me to Virginia with his trailer to pick up the engines. Thanks Mike. Jack Cooper kr2cooper@earthlink.net Why Wait? Move to EarthLink. _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 10:48:53 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> CC ing the heads-Buret To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <012e01c43cef$9f268a90$5e0ca58c@net.tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Ron Butterfield wrote: > How about these? > > $15 > http://www.vwalley.com/images/head_cc_kit.jpg I played around with one of these last night (my brother's a vet), as well as my pipette. The syringe conveniently goes to 60cc, perfect for VW and Corvair chambers. But you can wiggle the syringe handle back and forth and get a .1cc error. Maybe that's not enough to worry about. I would think if ultimate accuracy is your goal, the pipette (or buret) would be best, but I'll bet this would get you close enough for KR work... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 11:56:27 -0400 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> CC ing the heads-Buret To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" If you are doing a VW you can also just get the kit from Great Plains for about $10.00 that comes with a syringe and a plexiglass plate. There are instructions on their web site. I will be doing my Corvair heads sometime soon. On the vair do you make the plate like the GP instructions show or do you just fill to the top of the head? Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Scott Cable Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 10:42 AM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR> CC ing the heads-Buret Ron & Orma, There are other alternatives, like the one below, As I mentioned earlier, you can pick up a veterinary syringe for $4-5 at a Feed and Farm Supply Store. Like Tractor Supply Co. --- Ron Butterfield wrote: > How about these? > > $15 > http://www.vwalley.com/images/head_cc_kit.jpg ===== Scott Cable KR-2S # 735 Wright City, MO s2cable1@yahoo.com __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? SBC Yahoo! - Internet access at a great low price. http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/ _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 11:05:54 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> CC ing the heads-Buret To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <014701c43cf2$00111c10$5e0ca58c@net.tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Brian Kraut wrote: > I will be doing my Corvair heads sometime soon. On the vair do you > make the > plate like the GP instructions show or do you just fill to the top of > the head? Same process. See http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/corvair/valvejob.html . Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 09:13:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Ron Smith Subject: KR> Thank you to Mark Langford To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20040518161309.84334.qmail@web80008.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I downloaded the templates for the New Airfoil off your web site. I had them printed at Kinko's 5 minutes from my house. They had a 36" printer and the drawings came out perfect. It cost me 24.00 dollars for two sets. I got a second set just in case I screw up the first. The guys at kinkos let me download the templates off the net right there at the store, since they had trouble with the cd I burned. I took about an hour for them to get it right. I measured the dimensions and they are perfect. Thank you Mark. God is in the details, Ron Smith ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 12:34:43 -0400 From: Subject: KR> SB: Holes vs No Holes To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20040518163445.BXOQ22459.fed1rmmtao09.cox.net@smtp.west.cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Netters; I am in the process of changing my 6 x 30 inch speed brake. It has 12, 2" holes in it. It does ok in terms of slowing the KR down, but it doesn't do much to lower the nose attitude on approach. Has anyone compared the two type of SB with respect to nose attitude on approach? If so, please enlighten me. RV ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 12:53:16 -0400 From: "Doug Rupert" Subject: RE: KR> Alternator/ Solar Power To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <006801c43cf8$a4bc0d00$953cd0d8@office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To my way of thinking, although a great idea, wouldn't it have an adverse affect on the GPS antenna? Since I plan of using internal antennas in the interest of drag reduction I think a better location would be in the header panel just behind the firewall and installed with a manual on-off switch on the panel. Doug Rupert ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 23:04:59 +0200 From: "Dene Collett \(SA\)" Subject: Re: KR> Microair 760 To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <003301c43d13$eca62180$37e5fea9@telkomsa127179> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi Jim I have been to "Microair's websight and I don't find any refrence to a built in intercom. They are offering bundle packages though (some including a 2 place and some a 4 place intercom). By the sound of it these intercoms are seperate units and the diagrams represent their intergration with the Microair radio. Maybe I should just wait till the thing arrives and take it from there. In the meantime I will just use the length of garden hose as someone suggested. The only problem is that I can't stick it far enough into my ear for it to stay put when I let it go.Might try some cotton flox mixture and sleep on it. Cheers Dene Collett KR2S-RT builder Port Elizabeth South Africa mailto: dene.collett@telkomsa.net P.S: checkout www.whisperaircraft.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "JIM VANCE" > Dene, > > The Microair includes a two place intercom. It can be set up with > either a hot mike, or push-to-talk. ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 08:25:32 +1000 From: "Barry Kruyssen" Subject: Re: KR> Microair 760 to X-Com To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <020501c43d27$0c05ebb0$c900a8c0@T1W419b> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" I currently have a microair and I'm replacing with a X-Com. Lighter, dual watch, many more features and a built in intercom. see at http://www.mcp.com.au/xcom760/index.html regards Barry Kruyssen Cairns, Australia AUF 19-3873 kr2@BigPond.com http://users.tpg.com.au/barryk/KR2.htm ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 18:50:52 EDT From: FIXERJONES@aol.com Subject: Re: KR> Microair 760 To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <1dc.21d5fc50.2ddbed4c@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" i have a microair in 212kr & i will attest that there is an intercom built in,,the manual shows the wiring provision to opperate it & also flew with a buddy in his rv4 & we use the intercom on his microair,,,,,,,,steve jones n212kr ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 18:58:25 -0400 From: Joseph H Horton Subject: Re: KR> Building my cowl mold To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20040518.185825.-430179.0.joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain On Mon, 17 May 2004 21:05:43 -0500 "Mark Jones" writes: > Joe, > I may be wrong, but that scoop looks like a Van's RV scoop which > Dana > Overall introduced us to. I actually ordered one and had it here but > returned it because I decided not to use it. Here is the link. > http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/catalog.cgi?ident=1084845833-162-234& browse=engines&product=cowl-airscoop > OK - I went to the site but they don't show a picture and there are 6 or 8 models listed. How do you figure out what is what.? Mark, what are you doing for air intake on yours? Joe Horton Coopersburg, Pa. joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 23:06:18 +0000 From: Subject: Re: RE: KR> Corvair engines To: KRnet Message-ID: <200405182306.i4IN6I2Z017207@mxsf29.cluster1.charter.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Kevin wrote. > Next step: Sandblaster! (and a lift to get the motors out of my > enclosed trailer!). My son and I lifted ours out of the truck by hand and set it on an engine stand. Steven Phillabaum Auburn, Alabama ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 18:32:49 -0500 From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Building my cowl mold To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <008701c43d30$6ec75be0$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >From Dana Overall "You need a fab-4-scoop-320, $60.00 from Van's at 503-678-6545. As I understand it, this scoop fits the KR cowl. " That is the one I ordered and it would have fit my cowl with some modification. I will not be running an air scoop with the Ellison carb. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph H Horton" To: Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 5:58 PM Subject: Re: KR> Building my cowl mold > > > On Mon, 17 May 2004 21:05:43 -0500 "Mark Jones" > writes: > > Joe, > > I may be wrong, but that scoop looks like a Van's RV scoop which > > Dana Overall introduced us to. I actually ordered one and had it > > here but returned it because I decided not to use it. Here is the > > link. > > > http://www.vansaircraft.com/cgi-bin/catalog.cgi?ident=1084845833-162-2 > 34& > browse=engines&product=cowl-airscoop > > > OK - I went to the site but they don't show a picture and there are 6 > or 8 models listed. How do you figure out what is what.? Mark, what > are you doing for air intake on yours? Joe Horton > Coopersburg, Pa. > joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 16:48:56 +1000 From: "Phillip Matheson" Subject: Re: KR> Larger KR Flaps / air brakes To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000201c43d32$fc135100$c596dccb@StationW2k04> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Larry and All I have been reading many articles on the list regarding air brakes and flaps and have being thinking about the following mods I'm thinking of using a larger flap cord by moving the aileron bell cranks to the front of the rear spar( nothing new ) But I want to join the two flaps together by using a (belly board without holes) to make one large Flap and shape to the bottom of the fuse. Use a single flap control as normal, The rear spar and main spar, I think would need some extra strength by using ply ribs to help transfer the load, but these would be needed anyway for my wing walk on the wing to get into the trigear KR. This would be similar to a mustang kit plane I looked not so long ago. Am I barking up the wrong tree?? Comments please? Phillip Matheson matheson@dodo.com.au Australia VH PKR See our engines and kits at. http://www.vw-engines.com/ http://www.homebuilt-aviation.com/ See my KR at Mark Jones web http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/pmkr2.html ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 19:13:12 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> SB: Holes vs No Holes To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040518191312.00838100@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > I am in the process of changing my 6 x 30 inch speed brake. It > has 12, 2" holes in it. It does ok in terms of slowing the KR down, but it doesn't do much to lower the nose attitude on approach. Has anyone compared the two type of SB with respect to nose attitude on approach? If so, please enlighten me. >RV +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Is your wing incidence set to 3.5 degrees per the plans? To get a more nose down attitude on approach you need to add more drag. My brake (9" X 30") gives me a nice over the nose view all the way down to the flare. I loose the view when it drops into a three point attitude. That much drag also gives me a rather high decent rate, somewhere in the neighborhood of 800 or 900 fpm. I carry a bit of power until I get close to the numbers and then I cut the power and attempt to slow it down another 5 to 10 mph before I get into ground effect or it floats forever. I approach at 80 smph indicated. The size of the brake is determined mostly by the ground clearance you have. I have plenty with my 30 inch gear legs but even then my brake comes close to tall grass. Tri-gear might be to an advantage here. Moving it forward would help some with the clearance but I'm not sure how it would affect handling. I'm inclined to want to keep the drag forces behind the center of lift to help stabilize the aircraft rather then in front of the center of lift. If the drag loads are balanced side to side and basically centered and parallel to the direction of travel you probably don't have a problem. The brake behind the center of lift and C.G. would be acting more like a "drogue chute"(sp?). At least that's how my pea sized brain pictures it. Your brain could very well be larger and give you an entirely different view. :-)) As to which type of brake is better, the one with the most drag. Now all we have to do is figure out which one that is. Maybe a test rig hanging out the car window could tell us. Anybody up to that? Better yet, maybe one of the engineer types could just give us the answer. I did a quick search on the web and looked in the Tony Bingalis books but no luck. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 22:21:36 -0500 From: larry flesner Subject: KR> Larger KR Flaps / air brakes To: KRnet Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040518222136.007ab7a0@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > But I want to join the two flaps together by using a (belly board >without >holes) to make one large Flap and shape to the bottom of the fuse. > Phillip Matheson ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ That thought crossed my mind also but it seemed a bit complicated. Then I considered a two piece unit, flaps and speed brake, hinged separately, with a progressive linkage. First the flaps come down and then if needed the speed brake. After totally cluttering my mind I decided the KR lands slow enough without flaps and all I wanted was extra drag for approach and landing. I went with a simple speed brake with as much area as I could get. It would be nice to have a flap system to shorten the takeoff run at shorter grass strips. At this point however, unlike a Cessna, I think I can get out of any strip I can get in to. It seems to be working out fine and as much fun as building was it's a whole lot more fun flying !!! :-) Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Message: 23 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 22:25:01 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: KR> engine update To: "Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft" Cc: KRNet Message-ID: <001c01c43d50$e03675c0$2402a8c0@800Athlon> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" NetHeads, I did a little engine update at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/index.html#update . I'll publish more details later, but I didn't want y'all to think I'd become a couch potato or anything. Actual test runs may commence as early as the weekend, although I've been saying that for about four months now. Note: this engine, plenum, oil thermostat, lengthened prop hub, oil filler, dipstick tube, lengthened safety shaft, intake hose material, oil line, hose clamps, fuel pump hole plug, exhaust system, intake system, carburetor, and inlet system have not been engineered, tested, proven, or even suspected of actually working in an aircraft environment. Anybody considering doing anything remotely as stupid as what this picture depicts should surely be committed. Any suitabilty for flight purposes are solely the result of an overactive imagination, rather than the power of suggestion by the author, yada, yada, yada... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 24 Date: Tue, 18 May 2004 22:43:55 -0500 From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> engine update To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000f01c43d53$83046620$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" What is the little red button on top of the right plenum? A compression release button so you can start it? Now that should raise an eyebrow or two.... Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Langford" To: "Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft" Cc: "KRNet" Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 10:25 PM Subject: KR> engine update > NetHeads, > > I did a little engine update at > http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/index.html#update . > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 76 ************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================