From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 78 Date: 8/19/2004 8:16:02 AM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. RE: Drilling Stainless (Stephen Jacobs) 2. Re: aircraft data collection (Duncan) 3. Re: Engine Problems (J?rgen Thiesen) 4. Re: aircraft data collection (Dan Heath) 5. RE: Drilling Stainless (Dan Heath) 6. 76 hp VW 2100cc (Dan Heath) 7. Numbers (Dan Heath) 8. Re: aircraft data collection (Duncan) 9. Re: aircraft data collection (Duncan) 10. Re: aircraft data collection (Dan Heath) 11. Re: Blade angles Warpdrive (Martindale Family) 12. Re: Drilling Stainless (patrusso) 13. Re: Your EAA visit. (Mark Langford) 14. Re: Prop clearance (Martindale Family) 15. RE: Plan #'s (Wood, Sidney M.) 16. Re: the end of compass dip (Martindale Family) 17. RE: Plan #'s (Robert L. Stone) 18. Re: Plan #'s (orma@aviation-mechanics.com) 19. Plan #'s (Larry A Capps) 20. Re: @WL RE: KR> Plan #'s (gleone) 21. Re: Blade angles Warpdrive (Kenneth B. Jones) 22. Plan #'s (orma@aviation-mechanics.com) 23. Re: Plan #'s (Pat Driscoll) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 06:25:56 +0200 From: "Stephen Jacobs" Subject: RE: KR> Drilling Stainless To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c485a4$a2da9020$9264a8c0@home> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have (had) some stuff called "Boeing Lube". I am pretty sure it is Boeing as in 737, 747, 777 etc. It looks like soap and melts about like candle wax. I heat up the drill bit with a match - just enough to melt some onto the tip - works a treat with any metal, particularly good with stainless - even at faster speeds. I had a few guys get ready to heckle when I started drilling the holes in the s/steel exhaust for the EGT probes (6) on my IO 540 - each hole went through in seconds, but I melted on fresh lube each time. Wicked thing is that the Boeing Lube disappeared from the tool box shortly after that - so if anyone locates a source in the US, please let me know. The guy that gave it to me many years back said that it was also available as a liquid, but pretty expensive. The results with slow speed and GO-JO hand cleaner are impressive - worth remembering. Steve J ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 18:56:39 +1200 From: Duncan Subject: Re: KR> aircraft data collection To: KRnet Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20040819184516.03f9acc0@styx> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Hi, Well, things are taking longer than expected (isn't that always the case?) but they are progressing. I've created a few pages to house the new database, and have completed a working example of the "Add a new plane" page. The rest will come over the next few days. I've also read Wesley's suggestions, and will incorporate these also. Some great ideas. One has to guard against making the list so extensive that it becomes onerous to complete. Making it possible for a builder to return at a later time to 'update' his entry might be a good idea. in this regard, as well as being simply sensible. Any further suggestions - post them to the list, or email me direct if you wish. I hope to have it all completed within a week or so... Kind regards, Duncan Duncan of Devonport KR2-S (Plans: #9792, #1184) Auckland, New Zealand http://rtfmsoft.com/kr KR Database: http://rtfmsoft.com/kr/html/db.php ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:30:28 +0000 From: J?rgen Thiesen Subject: Re: KR> Engine Problems To: KRnet Message-ID: <200408190830.28716.j.thiesen@thiesen.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi Barry, the sizes on the Jabiru-Sides is for the "normal" airplanes... ;-) The diameter is limited by the "mach-speed"! Generaly is: if the diameter is bigger, the result of the prop is better... but if the tipps of the prop is "cruising" on Mach1 , the prop will be broken! So Jabiru take the diameter of the prop to the max by the 3300rpm. For this informations show the side from Ed Sherpa : www.greatplainsas.com/edrules.html On this side you can see all informations about propconfiguration. If you want to take the optimal prop for your plane, do this: 1. calculate the pitch for your max. speed 2. cut the tips of the prop (beginning from the max diameter), to have the optimal static run for your engine and form the tips. Don't forget the weights of the plates must be equal! 3. check this configuration in fly (for cruise-rpm/max-rpm), and if it will not be the optimum, do it once more... ;-) with best regards Juergen PS: My english is not the best, but I hope you understand, what I mean... Am Donnerstag, 19. August 2004 03:50 schrieb Barry Kruyssen: > Hi All, > > Well the decision has been made (I can sleep tonight, though much > poorer now). I'm scrapping the Hirth and replacing it with a 85hp > Jabiru engine (the 120hp engine is expensive and too heavy which would > require a major > rework) > > At the same time I'm replacing the retractable under carriage with the > Jabiru tail dragger gear, wheels, brakes and wheel spats, all for > $2500 Australian. There are 2 reasons to upgrade: 1. My retractable > gear is fixed down and looks like two barn doors in the slip stream, > 2. I need the extra height and bigger wheels as I'm operating from a > grass strip and Jabiru recommends a 60" diameter prop, which brings me > to my next question. (remember I know nothing about propping an > aircraft) > > The engine and prop should perform as follows: > static run up 2700 to 2900 (2800rpm 74hp 150ft lbs torque) cruise 2750 > to 3000 (3000rpm 81hp 140ft lbs torque) any lower rpm and it really > sucks fuel max 3300 (85hp 138ft lbs torque) > > Jabiru props come in the following sizes for their Jabiru aircraft > (see http://www.jabiru.net.au ) dia x pitch 60" x 42" recommended for > fast climb 60" x 44" recommended for slower climb but 5kts + speed > 60" x 48" for their 6 cylinder aircraft > 60" x 53" for their 6 cylinder aircraft > > Which of the above would be best for a standard KR2? > > Thanks > Barry > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > So I'm thinking of scrapping the Hirth and putting in a Jabiru 85hp > @ 60kg or 120hp @ 81kg. My Hirth is/was 92hp @ 52kg. The smaller > engine is preferable as the weight will be easier to deal with, But we > all want HORSEPOWER. > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 05:09:35 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> aircraft data collection To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <41246E4F.000001.00288@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" RE: Making it possible for a builder to return at a later time to 'update' his entry might be a good idea. How will you be able to insure that I am updating my airplane and not someone else's, either on purpose or by accident? "There is a time for building and a time for GOING TO THE GATHERING, and the time for building has long since expired." See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering http://KRGathering.org See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 05:17:02 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: RE: KR> Drilling Stainless To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <4124700E.000003.00288@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" You can get BoeLube from Avery Tools. They are a supplier of all things RV and metal working. You will want their catalog as they have a lot of neat stuff. I have been making a lot of holes in my firewall, both large and small. For drilling, I am using a good steel cutting bit I got from the hardware store and for the holes, I am using a bi-metal hole saw that I also got from the hardware store. The one thing that happened when I used BoeLube on the stainless while cutting a hole, is that the teeth just slipped over the steel without cutting. I had to do it dry to get it to cut. I completely wore off the teeth on the hole saw while doing it with BoeLube. This is just the opposite of what I expected. BoeLube is also great for putting screws into those metal "pinch" nut plates It keeps the screws from getting all messed up. "There is a time for building and a time for GOING TO THE GATHERING, and the time for building has long since expired." See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering http://KRGathering.org See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 05:27:28 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: KR> 76 hp VW 2100cc To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <41247280.000005.00288@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" RE: Kitplanes annual kit review quotes KR-2 performance, 180 mph cruise, based on a 76 hp VW 2100cc engine. Does a 2100cc VW really produce 76hp? If so, what does a 2180 produce and how do we know? "There is a time for building and a time for GOING TO THE GATHERING, and the time for building has long since expired." See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering http://KRGathering.org See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 05:30:10 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: KR> Numbers To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <41247322.000007.00288@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" RE: I'm already real happy with mine, and I'm not even flying it yet... Isn't it amazing what a little "real" airplane noise will do for Mark's disposition? "There is a time for building and a time for GOING TO THE GATHERING, and the time for building has long since expired." See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering http://KRGathering.org See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 21:44:22 +1200 From: Duncan Subject: Re: KR> aircraft data collection To: KRnet Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20040819214220.02484ec0@styx> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Hi Daniel, This isn't a problem. I'll be adding a login screen. Once logged in, the database will know who you are, and give you your data. Pretty simple, really. Duncan ====================================== At 09:09 p.m. 19/08/2004, you wrote: >RE: Making it possible for a builder to return at a later time to >'update' his entry might be a good idea. > >How will you be able to insure that I am updating my airplane and not >someone else's, either on purpose or by accident? > >"There is a time for building and a time for GOING TO THE GATHERING, >and the time for building has long since expired." > >See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering http://KRGathering.org > >See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics > >Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC > > > > >_______________________________________ >to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net >please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html Duncan of Devonport KR2-S (Plans: #9792, #1184) Auckland, New Zealand http://rtfmsoft.com/kr The KR Database: http://rtfmsoft.com/kr/html/db.php ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 22:23:43 +1200 From: Duncan Subject: Re: KR> aircraft data collection To: KRnet Message-ID: <6.1.2.0.2.20040819221909.03fbf858@styx> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Hi, The login screen has been added. Every page in the 'mini site' checks to see that you have correctly logged in. If not, you will be redirected to the login screen. The actual login page is: http://rtfmsoft.com/kr/html/login.php You can log in for the time being as kr2, with password ashok Once completed, the database will require that we all have usernames and passwords. Any ideas as to how to allocate these username/passwords? Regards, Duncan of Devonport KR2-S (Plans: #9792, #1184) Auckland, New Zealand http://rtfmsoft.com/kr The KR Database: http://rtfmsoft.com/kr/html/login.php ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 06:37:49 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: Re: KR> aircraft data collection To: "krnet@mylist.net" Message-ID: <412482FD.000015.00288@COMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" On my EAA site, I have a page where you can request a log in and it is mailed to the e-mail address on record. I generate a random password or let the user supply his ID and password. What are you using for a database? "There is a time for building and a time for GOING TO THE GATHERING, and the time for building has long since expired." See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering http://KRGathering.org See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC -------Original Message------- Subject: Re: KR> aircraft data collection Once completed, the database will require that we all have usernames and passwords. Any ideas as to how to allocate these username/passwords? Regards, Duncan of Devonport KR2-S (Plans: #9792, #1184) Auckland, New Zealand http://rtfmsoft.com/kr The KR Database: http://rtfmsoft.com/kr/html/login.php _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 21:15:56 +1000 From: "Martindale Family" Subject: Re: KR> Blade angles Warpdrive To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <004e01c485dd$e72eff20$75a0fea9@athlon2400> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hey Ken How did you convert blade angles set at the tips of the 3 blade Warpdrive to inches of pitch. Someone posted a table for two bladers a while back but I've had no luck in obtaining same for the 3 blader. Would there be much difference? John The Martindale Family 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA phone: 61 2 66584767 email: johnjane@chc.net.au snip.....................It has a Continintal A65 (65 HP @ 2300 rpm) and a 3 blade Warp Drive tapered blade > 58" prop set at 64.5" pitch..................... _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:19:51 -0400 From: "patrusso" Subject: Re: KR> Drilling Stainless To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001901c485de$75b756c0$d1a772d8@3z4xt01> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" If you don't find what you are looking for try JOBAOIL, LS-10 a blended vegetable-non toxic-non allergic-biodegradable drill and machining lubricant...in paste consistency. My ten year old can of paste has a phone number on it, 1-800-828-5823, wonder if it still works! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Jacobs" To: "'KRnet'" Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 12:25 AM Subject: RE: KR> Drilling Stainless > I have (had) some stuff called "Boeing Lube". I am pretty sure it is > Boeing as in 737, 747, 777 etc. > > It looks like soap and melts about like candle wax. I heat up the > drill bit with a match - just enough to melt some onto the tip - works > a treat with any metal, particularly good with stainless - even at > faster speeds. > > I had a few guys get ready to heckle when I started drilling the holes > in the s/steel exhaust for the EGT probes (6) on my IO 540 - each hole > went through in seconds, but I melted on fresh lube each time. > > Wicked thing is that the Boeing Lube disappeared from the tool box > shortly after that - so if anyone locates a source in the US, please > let me know. > > The guy that gave it to me many years back said that it was also > available as a liquid, but pretty expensive. > > The results with slow speed and GO-JO hand cleaner are impressive - > worth remembering. > > Steve J > > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 06:32:25 -0500 From: "Mark Langford" Subject: Re: KR> Your EAA visit. To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <00b901c485e0$33c9d3d0$5e0ca58c@net.tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Mark Jones wrote: > Do you have any photos of the EAA visit on your web site yet? Are you > the only KR builder in your chapter? How do they view the KR overall? No, I didn't take any. Only eight guys showed up. I don't feel too bad though because that's about how many that showed up last month for a guy who'd just finished and painted his RV-7 (Ed Siegler). In our chapter, it seems that actually building and flying airplanes isn't exactly at the top of the list. Most meetings are held at the Moontown FBO and maybe thirty folks show up. For the last few years, the emphasis has been on the monthly third Saturday breakfast. People fly in from all around. I think they've been serving around 150 people lately. The real builders don't go to the meetings because they'd rather spend the time building and getting something accomplished. Moontown (http://www.airnav.com/airport/3M5) is the hotbed of homebuilding around here (well, RV building, with 6 under construction) as well as sport, glider, and ultralight flying. The EAA doesn't seem to play much part in it though. Maybe after mine is finished I'll spend a little more time hanging around the airport, but my guess is that I'll be too busy building something else instead... Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML at hiwaay.net see KR2S project N56ML at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 21:29:34 +1000 From: "Martindale Family" Subject: Re: KR> Prop clearance To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <008101c485df$cec90be0$75a0fea9@athlon2400> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi Barry Think about your prop clearance with tail up. 60" may be a bit too large but it will depend on the length of the Jab's gear legs. John The Martindale Family 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA phone: 61 2 66584767 > >snip..................... Which of the above would be best for a >standard KR2? ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:47:17 -0400 From: "Wood, Sidney M." Subject: RE: KR> Plan #'s To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" The Plan # is the serial number starting from day one when the plans were put on the market. That is also your proof number if the FAA wants to check back with RR that you have a legal set of plans. You are authorized to build one KR using that set of plans and no more than one. It's in the copy write laws and it is FAA policy to enforce this. If your FSDO checks on this, may be another matter. The Book Number is the update version. So, if you have a Book No. 82, that is the revision 82 edition. I got this info from personal conversation with Jeannette Rand. Sid Wood Tri-gear KR-2 N6242 Mechanicsville, MD USA Sidney.wood@titan.com >I am looking at my builders book and realized that I do not fully know >what the hand scribed numbers at the top right of my book mean. >On top is "# 6123" and on the bottom is "book 59". Does anyone >have the correct meaning of the top number. This is only an educated guess, but it is my understanding that RR keeps the name and address of the original plans purchaser (and possibly any known secondary) in notebooks in numerical sequence. Since they are over 10K on the KR-2 / 2S that makes for a lot of books. My basic KR-2 S/N is 9707, "Master File Book No.82". Allen G. Wiesner KR-2SS/TD S/N 1118 65 Franklin Street Ansonia, CT 06401-1240 (203) 732-0508 flashyal@usadatanet.net ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 21:54:20 +1000 From: "Martindale Family" Subject: Re: KR> the end of compass dip To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <008e01c485e3$440587a0$75a0fea9@athlon2400> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Folks, seems everyone is right but Peter is more right :-). I took out the compass today and tilted it up and down in a hinged aluminium bracket to hold heading well away from the aircraft. It definitely rotated whilst being moved/accelerated as Virg and others have predicted but it settled back to the same reading when held still either horizontally or on the tilt. As I offered to its mount in the aircraft there it was.... about a 7 degree swing on EW alignments but nothing on NS. The relative engine mass movement must impact more on the compass magnet/needle when the latter is at right angles to it and have less or no effect when aligned parallel. All I can do is adjust the compensating screws for straight and level (as I already had) and accept that it will never accurately reflect runway heading during taxi checks. Don't know why I didn't think to remove it earlier to check this....thanks Peter. The Martindale Family 29 Jane Circuit TOORMINA NSW 2452 AUSTRALIA phone: 61 2 66584767 email: johnjane@chc.net.au ----- Original Message ----- From: "StRaNgEdAyS" To: "KRnet" Sent: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 9:08 PM Subject: Re: KR> Compass dip > > > > All I am doing by raising the tail with the aircraft stationary on > > the ground is altering the angle made between the pivot stalk and > > the horizontal plane of the compass ring > > > > +++++++++++++++ > > > > you are also changing the angle between all that and the big magnet > > inside mother earth > > > > --------------------------- > > > You are also moving the large chunk of metal on the front of the plane > in relation to the compass, which will affect the transition of the > earths' magnetic feild through the magnet in the compass card. however > it should not be that sensitive, should it??? Also a point to > consider, your friends' moth is probably somewhat longer and > has greater distance between the compass and the engine, which could > well account for why it does not occur on his plane. Cheers. > Peter Bancks > strangedays@dodo.com.au > http://www.homebuiltairplanes.com > http://canardaviationforum.dmt.net > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 06:58:57 -0500 (Central Daylight Time) From: "Robert L. Stone" Subject: RE: KR> Plan #'s To: Message-ID: <41249601.000001.02616@YOUR-AT5QGAAC3Z> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Not being a lawyer I do not know for sure but it would seem to me that if a plan is used to build a second airplane and there are many modifications as there are on almost all KR aircraft built, then it's not a KR but the plans were used as a guide for only a part of the building. What percentage of deviation form the plans would have to be made in order to have the aircraft legaly considered to be not a KR aircraft. Some of you guys who are lawyers, please coment on this. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx rstone4@hot.rr.com -------Original Message------- From: KRnet Date: 08/19/04 06:48:18 To: KRnet Subject: RE: KR> Plan #'s The Plan # is the serial number starting from day one when the plans were put on the market. That is also your proof number if the FAA wants to check back with RR that you have a legal set of plans. You are authorized to build one KR using that set of plans and no more than one. It's in the copy write laws and it is FAA policy to enforce this. If your FSDO checks on this, may be another matter. The Book Number is the update version. So, if you have a Book No. 82, that is the revision 82 edition. I got this info from personal conversation with Jeannette Rand. Sid Wood Tri-gear KR-2 N6242 Mechanicsville, MD USA Sidney.wood@titan.com >I am looking at my builders book and realized that I do not fully know >what the hand scribed numbers at the top right of my book mean. >On top is "# 6123" and on the bottom is "book 59". Does anyone >have the correct meaning of the top number. This is only an educated guess, but it is my understanding that RR keeps the name and address of the original plans purchaser (and possibly any known secondary) in notebooks in numerical sequence. Since they are over 10K on the KR-2 / 2S that makes for a lot of books. My basic KR-2 S/N is 9707, "Master File Book No.82". Allen G. Wiesner KR-2SS/TD S/N 1118 65 Franklin Street Ansonia, CT 06401-1240 (203) 732-0508 flashyal@usadatanet.net _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:44:10 -0400 From: Subject: Re: KR> Plan #'s To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <001201c485ea$3a727e80$698bd145@robbinsavm> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" "So, if you have a Book No. 82," For sure Jeanette should know what the numbers mean. However, the bottom right corner of my book has "Revised Aug 1979". Does anyone else with an older KR have a book with the hand written "Book 59". By the way, what is the current Book #? Also what is the highest serial number on new plans? Maybe the serial numbers start over with each increase in book #. Orma KR-2 N110LR, Aug 1984 to Present Mounting the new engine today ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 08:11:34 -0500 From: "Larry A Capps" Subject: KR> Plan #'s To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c485ee$0d99a420$0500a8c0@schpankme> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" It seems to me, if you can afford 20k to build your plane based on the KR Design (in other words, you need the plans to get started), you can certainly pay the plans fee to the company to which you referenced said plans. This notion of - I'm prepared to spend 20k to build my plane, I just don't want to spend the one (1) percent to get started - is clearly prevalent among this group. Larry A Capps Naperville, IL "Stealing one persons work is called plagiarism Steal many peoples work is called research" -----Original Message----- Not being a lawyer I do not know for sure but it would seem to me that if a plan is used to build a second airplane and there are many modifications as there are on almost all KR aircraft built, then it's not a KR but the plans were used as a guide for only a part of the building. What percentage of deviation form the plans would have to be made in order to have the aircraft legaly considered to be not a KR aircraft. ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 07:27:30 -0600 (Mountain Standard Time) From: "gleone" Subject: Re: @WL RE: KR> Plan #'s To: Message-ID: <4124AAC2.000009.03524@YOUR-FD6NVJCER4> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Does the word "thief" come to mind? If you want to build a plane that's legaly (sic) considered to be not a KR aircraft", then (a) buy plans for another "legaly. . .not a KR aircraft", (b) design your own based on a balsawood kit, or (c), PAY JANNETTE FOR A SET OF PLANS AND STOP TRYING TO FIND WAYS TO CHISEL HER OUT OF THE COST FOR THE PLANS. The company is her's now, has been for quite a few years, and since ONE set of plans is to build ONE aircraft as stated in the plans package, either build something other than the KR entirely or pay her for her plans. This is not rocket science! Gene Leone, Worland, Wyoming "Whatever else history may say about me when I’m gone, I hope it will record that I appealed to your best hopes, not your worst fears; to your confidence rather than your doubts. My dream is that you will travel the road ahead with liberty’s lamp guiding your steps and opportunity’s arm steadying your way." - Ronald Reagan -------Original Message------- From: KRnet Date: 08/19/04 06:00:00 To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: @WL RE: KR> Plan #'s Not being a lawyer I do not know for sure but it would seem to me that if a plan is used to build a second airplane and there are many modifications as there are on almost all KR aircraft built, then it's not a KR but the plans were used as a guide for only a part of the building. What percentage of deviation form the plans would have to be made in order to have the aircraft legaly considered to be not a KR aircraft. Some of you guys who are lawyers, please coment on this. Bob Stone, Harker Heights, Tx rstone4@hot.rr.com -------Original Message------- From: KRnet Date: 08/19/04 06:48:18 To: KRnet Subject: RE: KR> Plan #'s The Plan # is the serial number starting from day one when the plans were put on the market. That is also your proof number if the FAA wants to check back with RR that you have a legal set of plans. You are authorized to build one KR using that set of plans and no more than one. It's in the copy write laws and it is FAA policy to enforce this. If your FSDO checks on this, may be another matter. The Book Number is the update version. So, if you have a Book No. 82, that is the revision 82 edition. I got this info from personal conversation with Jeannette Rand. Sid Wood Tri-gear KR-2 N6242 Mechanicsville, MD USA Sidney.wood@titan.com >I am looking at my builders book and realized that I do not fully know >what the hand scribed numbers at the top right of my book mean. >On top is "# 6123" and on the bottom is "book 59". Does anyone >have the correct meaning of the top number. This is only an educated guess, but it is my understanding that RR keeps the name and address of the original plans purchaser (and possibly any known secondary) in notebooks in numerical sequence. Since they are over 10K on the KR-2 / 2S that makes for a lot of books. My basic KR-2 S/N is 9707, "Master File Book No.82". Allen G. Wiesner KR-2SS/TD S/N 1118 65 Franklin Street Ansonia, CT 06401-1240 (203) 732-0508 flashyal@usadatanet.net _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html _______________________________________ to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:19:34 -0400 From: "Kenneth B. Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Blade angles Warpdrive To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <038701c485f7$8dcd12e0$647ba8c0@oemcomputer> Inches of pitch is calculated the same for one or more blades. I think having more blades increases the "effective" blade chord if compared to two blades. BTW, I did my measurements at the tip per Warp instructions. Ken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Martindale Family" To: "KRnet" Sent: Thursday, August 19, 2004 7:15 AM Subject: Re: KR> Blade angles Warpdrive > Hey Ken > > How did you convert blade angles set at the tips of the 3 blade > Warpdrive to > inches of pitch. Someone posted a table for two bladers a while back > but I've had no luck in obtaining same for the 3 blader. Would there > be much difference? > > John > > The Martindale Family > 29 Jane Circuit > TOORMINA NSW 2452 > AUSTRALIA > > phone: 61 2 66584767 > email: johnjane@chc.net.au > > > snip.....................It has a Continintal A65 (65 HP @ 2300 rpm) > and a 3 > blade Warp Drive tapered blade > > 58" prop set at 64.5" pitch..................... > > _______________________________________ > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:47:05 -0400 From: Subject: KR> Plan #'s To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <003501c485fb$66572850$698bd145@robbinsavm> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" For those who wish to change the subject of this thread, please feel free to do so, just call it something else. The original subject was a discussion about the different plan numbers and it's meaning. My plans and my aircraft are a matched set and registered with RR. P.S. My engine is back on the KR and the accessories are going on. Orma L. Robbins A&P/IA KR-2 N110LR Southfield, MI ------------------------------ Message: 23 Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2004 10:15:16 -0500 From: "Pat Driscoll" Subject: Re: KR> Plan #'s To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <000701c485ff$5585c000$968dd440@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Mark, We had a saying in the printing business. "quantity, quality or cost. Take your pick of any two. You cannot get all three anywhere."Same applies to flying. Pat Driscoll patrick36@usfamily.net Saint Paul, MN ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 346, Issue 78 ************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================