From: krnet-bounces+johnbou=speakeasy.net@mylist.net on behalf of krnet-request@mylist.net Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2004 9:50 AM To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 312, Issue 1 Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: KRnet logo stickers (David Lininger) 2. Re: KRnet logo stickers 3. Re: KRnet logo stickers (Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff) 4. Facet Pump Noise (Mark Jones) 5. KRnet logo stickers (Dean Cooper) 6. Larry, how big and how heavy? This is a far cry from the 195 many are said to achieve (Dan Heath) 7. spins (j stevens) 8. About the slip (Dan Heath) 9. Tri- gear conversion (plstrom) 10. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Virgil Salisbury) 11. Re: Tri- gear conversion (Dean Cooper) 12. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Dana Overall) 13. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Dana Overall) 14. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Dana Overall) 15. Re: Tri- gear conversion - Per (Dan Heath) 16. Progress report-reply (larry flesner) 17. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Mark Langford) 18. Need some info on the Revmaster Cowling (Dan Heath) 19. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport-Now KR1B (Dana Overall) 20. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Virgil Salisbury) 21. Re: Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport (Virgil Salisbury) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 15:10:23 -0600 From: David Lininger To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR>KRnet logo stickers Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20040214150536.00ab4010@mail.positech.net> In-Reply-To: <00fd01c3f241$dbab79b0$5e0ca58c@tbe.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 1 At 08:58 AM 2/13/04 -0600, Mark Langford wrote: >I'm not volunteering to run this >thing or to mail props, but I can see how I might end up doing it if >some other folks don't volunteer. Just an idea. I could help out here, covering the Midwest. I'm located in SW Missouri, about 50 miles from Springfield. I think someone volunteered to serve another region. >We'll need some volunteers to send these labels out. I don't know of >ANYBODY that wants to mail 500 stickers out. If we sell 500, we'll >need 10 guys will volunteer to stuff envelopes and mail them out. It >ought to take less than an hour to send out 50 stickers (many will get >2 or 3 per envelope), and the fund will furnish the stamps (volunteer >buys the envelopes). The stickers will probably be 3x3 and hopefully >on a clear background, but might be white or black, don't know yet. >There are some details still to be worked out. I'll volunteer to help out with the mailing. Let me know who needs my snail mail address. >I need a volunteer to take our KRnet logo and doctor it up into a high >res image. Somebody needs to PhotoShop this thing into a smooth, >respectable 300 dpi image to make the printers happy. I'll check Tuesday at school, but I'm pretty sure we can do it there if no one else has done it before then. David Lininger kb0zke@positech.net ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:07:35 EST From: JSMONDAY@aol.com To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>KRnet logo stickers Message-ID: <1cb.19a9f4c3.2d5ff627@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 2 In a message dated 2/13/2004 6:57:02 AM Pacific Standard Time, n56ml@hiwaay.net writes: Somebody brought up the issue of selling KRnet stickers to raise money for KRnet administration and the KR Gathering "seed" money. KRnet is caught up It would be really cool if we had KR-1 KR-2 and KR-2S logo stickers available that we could put on our plane (tail). There are a lot of people out there that have no idea how many KR's are out there.. and if everyone or alot of people put the stickers on their planes... It would help the KR series tremendously.... The only KR type logo I have seen is on the RR Accessory Catalog with a Red KR and two horizontal stripes on both sides. Are there any other ones out there??? Thanks, John S. Monday KR2S Laguna Beach, CA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 14:39:24 -0800 From: "Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff" To: "KRnet" Subject: Re: KR>KRnet logo stickers Message-ID: <005201c3f34b$65cc7220$6401a8c0@charlesmidkiff> References: <1cb.19a9f4c3.2d5ff627@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 3 My favorite is the one seen on the side of Chris Gardiner's KR2S. I liked it so much, I had him get his supplier to make me a couple of them for my project. It can be seen in the link below. http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/cgardiner.html Bud Midkiff KR2 Lynnwood, WA ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 2:07 PM Subject: Re: KR>KRnet logo stickers >> The only KR type logo I have seen is on the RR Accessory Catalog with >> a Red > KR and two horizontal stripes on both sides. Are there any other ones > out there??? > > Thanks, > John S. Monday > KR2S > Laguna Beach, CA > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 16:54:32 -0600 From: "Mark Jones" To: "KR Net" Subject: KR>Facet Pump Noise Message-ID: <005e01c3f34d$82f2fde0$6401a8c0@wi.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 4 A week or so ago we were discussing Facet pumps and the noise it makes. = Trust me, with the engine running you can not even hear the Facet.=20 Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA=20 E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at =20 http://mywebpage.netscape.com/n886mj/homepage.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 18:10:43 -0500 From: "Dean Cooper" To: "KRnet" Subject: KR>KRnet logo stickers Message-ID: <012501c3f34f$c5872440$0502a8c0@office> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 5 I really like Chris' decal as well. Additionally, I came across this bumper sticker that my Dad had from years ago when he started the KR. http://www.geocities.com/djramccoop1/KR_Bumper_Sticker.GIF Dean Cooper Jacksonville, FL Email me at dean_cooper@bellsouth.net See my KR project at www.geocities.com/djramccoop1/KR2_Home.html ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Charles Buddy & Cheryl Midkiff" > To: "KRnet" > Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 5:39 PM > Subject: Re: KR>KRnet logo stickers > > > > My favorite is the one seen on the side of Chris Gardiner's KR2S. I liked > it > > so much, I had him get his supplier to make me a couple of them for > > my project. It can be seen in the link below. > > http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford/cgardiner.html > > > > Bud Midkiff KR2 > > Lynnwood, WA > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: > > Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2004 2:07 PM > > Subject: Re: KR>KRnet logo stickers > > > > > > >> The only KR type logo I have seen is on the RR Accessory Catalog > > >> with a > > Red > > > KR and two horizontal stripes on both sides. Are there any other > > > ones > out > > > there??? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > John S. Monday > > > KR2S > > > Laguna Beach, CA > > > _______________________________________ > > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > > > KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at > > > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 18:41:48 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: "krnet@mylist.net" Subject: KR>Larry, how big and how heavy? This is a far cry from the 195 many are said to achieve Message-ID: <402EB23C.000001.02240@Computer> References: <002201c3f309$4544d520$0202a8c0@lori8v5h2xi9m3> Content-Type: Text/Plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 6 I don't think that many achieve 195. Many are probably around 145 to 165.= =0D =0D See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering=0D =0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =20 ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:51:24 -0600 From: j stevens To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: KR>spins Message-ID: <402EB47C.70805@usfamily.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 7 Does anyone have knowledge of KR spin handling. Joel ------ http://USFamily.Net/info - Unlimited Internet - From $8.99/mo! ------ ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 18:53:30 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: "krnet@mylist.net" Subject: KR>About the slip Message-ID: <402EB4FA.000003.02240@Computer> References: <3.0.6.32.20040214075246.007a9ea0@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 8 Larry,=0D =0D While flying streight and level, apply hard rudder, right or left and see what happens. If this resemles what is happening in the slip, it may indicate too much rudder.=0D =0D See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering=0D =0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =20From n56ml@hiwaay.net Sat Feb 14 16:06:41 2004 Received: from smtp.knology.net ([24.214.63.101] helo=smtp1.knology.net) by lizard.esosoft.net with smtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1As9o1-000LWe-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 16:06:41 -0800 Received: (qmail 19926 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2004 23:57:18 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO basement) (24.214.88.148) by smtp1.knology.net with SMTP; 14 Feb 2004 23:57:18 -0000 Message-ID: <0e6d01c3f356$6fbead10$1202a8c0@basement> From: "Mark Langford" To: "KRnet" References: <402EB47C.70805@usfamily.net> Subject: Re: KR>spins Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:58:25 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KRnet List-Id: KRnet List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Joel wrote: > Does anyone have knowledge of KR spin handling. You'll get a lot of facts in a hurry if you'll go to the KRnet archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp and enter "spin" in the subject field. Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:23:14 -0500 From: "plstrom" To: Subject: KR>Tri- gear conversion Message-ID: <000b01c3f362$4904c5e0$62729a8e@y9n0v4> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 9 HiAll. I have been following the KR posts for several weeks now and have = finally decided to take advantage of the collective knowlege out there = in KR land. I started building a KR2 a long time ago with fellow builder, Kerry = Vaughn...he finished his I didn't... some of you may remember Kerry's = award winning KR.Anyway, this past summer I have seen, on several = occasions, two local KR's,Owen Macperson's and Chris Gardner's and this = has sparked a renewed interest in my own KR. I have therefore decided to continue on my KR and have taken on a = partner, who is willing to finance the balance of the project = (engine,instruments etc.) and,hopefully,I will be able to complete the = KR, this time.To date I have completed the fuselage,it sits on RR fixed = gear,has DD wing skins,rudder and elevator and I also have all the = premoulded parts . = Now for the question..I want to change the fixed tail = dragger gear to tri-gear using what I already have.Would it be possible = to do this by cutting the spring bar close to the bracket and moving = the whole thing(bracket and the cut off part of the spring bar) to the = rear face of the main spar on the stub wing.I would re-inforce the spar = with a 1/4 in. plywood,same as was done at the original location of the = brackets.I would also put 1/4 plywood ribs between front and rear spar = to provide more strength to this setup. Where the spring bar sits = slighty below the wing I would place a fairing to cover it = = You are probably = saying to yourself at this point" Why doesn't he just buy the DD gear = and be done with it?" The way I see it,... and I may be wrong,I already have what I need = (except for the nosegear) so now all I have to do is cut,..drill,...bolt = on and....done!(and saved a few pounds) The DD gear involves = considerably more work than this. Am I missing something?I have already = asked several people this question but I would like to have more = opinions before I decide what route to take Any advice will be = appreciated.Happy building and flying! Per Lindstrom=20 Mississauga Canada. ps.Can't put the spring bar on backside of spar, which has been = suggested , because of additional holes that would have to be cut = through fuselage and I would not be able to use the center bracket = anyway because of the control stick .I think that by placing it behind = the spar inside the fuselage would be more complicated!..with more = holes. Hope all this makes sense!From N886KR@insightbb.com Sat Feb 14 17:57:30 2004 Received: from sccmmhc02.asp.att.net ([204.127.203.184]) by lizard.esosoft.net with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1AsBXG-000MSg-00 for krnet@mylist.net; Sat, 14 Feb 2004 17:57:30 -0800 Received: from laptop (12-222-49-79.client.insightbb.com[12.222.49.79]) by sccmmhc02.asp.att.net (sccmmhc02) with SMTP id <20040215014405mm200ogva9e>; Sun, 15 Feb 2004 01:44:05 +0000 Message-ID: <008a01c3f365$2f79e530$6500a8c0@laptop> From: "Richard Collins" To: , "KRnet" References: Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:44:00 -0500 Organization: Home MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-BeenThere: krnet@mylist.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.1b3 Precedence: list Reply-To: KRnet List-Id: KRnet List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: Ron, I am, as you, interested in the sport pilot concept, mainly because I am aging and anticipate that I will not always be able to pass the physical. So, after this one runs out, I am going to forego anymore flight physicals. I am curious about how you came to the conclusion that the Hershey Bar wing x 10 ft x slotted will accomplish the sport pilot limitations. Could you send me some links you looked at or pictures, graphs etc that you studied? PS. When you're here this summer, I would really like to talk to you and Bill Thompson (I've asked him to get the thing flying again) and see what can be done, and how long it will take. I have about 20 months left on my license. Rick Collins "Little Beast" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ron Freiberger" To: "KRnet" Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 5:37 PM Subject: RE: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport > I researched this issue before giving up in disgust with the FAA on Medical > issues. I think the wing needs to be 10 feet long (outer panels, and > that you should have zero twist. The out half of the outer panel > should be a slotted airfoil, and the elevator/stabilizer ought to be > enlarged to power the larger,longer wing. Note; opinions free..... > Ron Freiberger > mailto: rfreiberger@swfla.rr.com > > rhartwig11@juno.com > said; > I am designing (stealing ideas) for a plane using KR construction that > would fit within the Sport Pilot rules. It will be single place, > Hershey > > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 22:39:44 -0500 From: Virgil Salisbury To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: <20040214.224037.360.3.virgnvs@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 10 K R 1b Motor Glider for your situation, Virg On Sat, 14 Feb 2004 20:44:00 -0500 "Richard Collins" writes: > Ron, > > I am, as you, interested in the sport pilot concept, mainly because > I am > aging and anticipate that I will not always be able to pass the > physical. > So, after this one runs out, I am going to forego anymore flight > physicals. > I am curious about how you came to the conclusion that the Hershey > Bar wing > x 10 ft x slotted will accomplish the sport pilot limitations. > Could you > send me some links you looked at or pictures, graphs etc that you > studied? > > PS. When you're here this summer, I would really like to talk to you > and > Bill Thompson (I've asked him to get the thing flying again) and see > what > can be done, and how long it will take. I have about 20 months left > on my > license. > > Rick Collins "Little Beast" > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ron Freiberger" > To: "KRnet" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2004 5:37 PM > Subject: RE: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport > > > > I researched this issue before giving up in disgust with the FAA > on > Medical > > issues. I think the wing needs to be 10 feet long (outer panels, > and that > > you should have zero twist. The out half of the outer panel > should be a > > slotted airfoil, and the elevator/stabilizer ought to be enlarged > to power > > the larger,longer wing. > > Note; opinions free..... > > Ron Freiberger > > mailto: rfreiberger@swfla.rr.com > > > > rhartwig11@juno.com > > said; > > I am designing (stealing ideas) for a plane using KR construction > that > > would fit within the Sport Pilot rules. It will be single place, > Hershey > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________ > > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > Virgil N. Salisbury - AMSOIL www.lubedealer.com/salisbury Miami ,Fl ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2004 22:44:51 -0500 From: "Dean Cooper" To: "KRnet" Subject: Re: KR>Tri- gear conversion Message-ID: <015e01c3f376$111f2490$0502a8c0@office> References: <000b01c3f362$4904c5e0$62729a8e@y9n0v4> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 11 Per wrote: >Would it be possible to do this by cutting the spring bar close to the bracket and moving the whole thing(bracket and the cut off part of the spring bar) to the rear face of the main spar on the stub wing Per, Am I understanding you correctly that you have a single spring bar supported by 3 brackes and you want to cut off the 2 ends (with brackets) and bolt them to the aft side of the forward spar? If so, I can't imagine that each bracket is designed to handle to pressure of a single spring. Also, I'm not sure the spring leg is designed to operate with one wheel and not count on the distribution of weight, etc. If I am understanding you correctly, then I would not go that route, but I may not be following you. If you have pictures, you can send them to me offnet and I will post them for you to show everyone. Good luck. Dean Cooper Jacksonville, FL Email me at dean_cooper@bellsouth.net See my KR project at www.geocities.com/djramccoop1/KR2_Home.html ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:08:35 -0500 From: "Dana Overall" To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 12 >From: Virgil Salisbury > > K R 1b Motor Glider for your situation, Virg > Virg, I respectfully mention the above comment may be jumping the gun. First of all, there is not much history out there on the motor glider. Second of all, I would seriously recommend one go to the actually document that proceeded the advisory board recommendations and read the pages upon pages of documentation, engineering papers, flight parameters, flight performance.........the list goes on and on, required for submission in determination. It is, and will be, a very exhausting process. My gut feeling, from reading the document, is they are not going to willy nilly hand these pink slips out. My opinion, and it is just that, the KR1 motor glide may be able to fall into the classification but lacks supporting documentation at this time. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY i39 RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg do not archive _________________________________________________________________ Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - and beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:17:43 -0500 From: "Dana Overall" To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 13 And, my comments are directed towards any "new design" that is just trying to get under the speed restrictions. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY i39 RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg do not archive _________________________________________________________________ Let the advanced features & services of MSN Internet Software maximize your online time. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200363ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:20:39 -0500 From: "Dana Overall" To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 14 And, my comments are directed towards any "new design" that is just trying to get under the speed restrictions. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY i39 RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg do not archive _________________________________________________________________ Click here for a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 08:00:55 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: "krnet@mylist.net" Subject: Re: KR>Tri- gear conversion - Per Message-ID: <402F6D87.000005.02240@Computer> References: <000b01c3f362$4904c5e0$62729a8e@y9n0v4> Content-Type: Text/Plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 15 Per,=0D =0D You said " hopefully,I will be able to complete the KR, this time ", and then you said "I want to change the ". =0D =0D I just want to raise the red flag for you here. These two statements conflict. Your best chance for success it to finish the plane without changing anything that does not have to be changed.=0D =0D Now to your question. If you really must do this thing to your project, I= do believe that you can just unbolt the whole thing and move it to the rear = of the spar. If I remember correctly, this entire assembly sits just below t= he fuselage with the brackets going through the fuselage skin. I had one ver= y much like it on the Little Beast and it is a great gear.=0D =0D DO NOT split this gear into two assemblies. I do believe that this gear h= as been used in the tri gear configuration and the stick can be dealt with. Cutting holes if the fuselage skin is not an issue to be concerned with. They are easy to patch and the whole center part of the spring bar, gets faired into the fuselage anyway and will not be seen.=0D =0D You are correct in your assessment of the Diehl gear. While it is a very good gear, switching to it, will further decrease your opportunity for success. I have done that also, so I know the difference between the two gears and the installation process of both.=0D =0D My best advise to you is to stick with what you have. The conventional ge= ar KR is a great airplane and the task is daunting enough without adding anymore to it. Rember, for every change you make, there are at least 3 ot= her changes that will be required and these changes often cascade into more changes which.........=0D =0D See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering=0D =0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =20 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 07:31:39 -0600 From: larry flesner To: KRnet Subject: KR>Progress report-reply Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20040215073139.007ab910@pop.midwest.net> In-Reply-To: <002201c3f309$4544d520$0202a8c0@lori8v5h2xi9m3> References: <3.0.6.32.20040214075246.007a9ea0@pop.midwest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 16 >Larry, how big and how heavy? This is a far cry from the 195 many are >said to achieve. +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ My KR is a 24" stretch, canopy raised for about 3" of head room for my 6'4" body, 30"Diehl gear legs with 600X6 wheels and brakes, and a 765 pound empty weight. Also, no wheel pants at this time. On a couple of short cross country legs yesterday it seems to settle in on 160 mph indicated. That appears to be pretty close from what the GPS was reading out and allowing for the wind. I think I'll see about 170 mph cruise at 2500 rpm when it's all said and done. Some of those 190+ mph speeds you hear about from other 0-200 powered KR's are for KR's pretty close to plan size and pulling 2700 - 2950 rpm. It's not hard to achieve but I'm happy with the size airplane I've got and the performance I'm getting. The same engine pulled the C-150 along at a blistering 110 mph !! I'm not going to chop on the prop any more until I get wheel pants and see if the extra speed lets the rpm come up a bit. After the 40 hours I may decide to re-do the engine by having the jugs rebuilt, rebuild or new cam and lower end bearings, etc. Thanks to everyone that replied, on the net and personally, with birthday wishes and congratulations. I turned out to be a wonderful day. Larry Flesner ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 07:59:55 -0600 From: "Mark Langford" To: "KRnet" Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: <006d01c3f3cb$ff5224f0$2402a8c0@800Athlon> References: <20040214.224037.360.3.virgnvs@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 17 The KR1B motorglider may not be such a bad idea after all. Maybe not for Sport Pilot, but registered as a motorglider. Below is something I posted in Nov, dug up from the archives in about 10 seconds. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------- There's an interesting article in the December 2003 Kitplanes (page 15) that discusses the Europa MOTORGLIDER. The guy that built it lost his medical, but discovered that all you need to fly a "motorglider" is a glider license! No medical required. It seems that we KR folks are sitting on the ultimate no-medical fighting machine, the KR1B Motorglider. The article didn't elaborate about what makes a plane a legal motorglider, but this thing had a gross weight of 1450 pounds and had a 115 hp engine in it. The "Kit Aircraft Directory" in the same issue lists the cruise speed as 174 mph, stall speed as 45 mph, 760 mile range, takeoff and landing in 600 feet, fuel capacity of 28 gallons, and two seats. Get the picture guys? The KR1 would certainly qualify. I'd call the local FSDO just in case, but it sounds like all you'd need is some longer wings and a glider license to keep on flying, regardless of Sport Pilot. My guess is that the definition of motorglider is based on wing loading, but I could be wrong. Does anybody actually OWN a set of KR1B Motorglider plans? If so, are there any structural differences to the spars? My guess is probably not. Anybody know the price differential in plans or parts? RR's website makes practically no mention of the KR1B plans or parts. Speaking of which, RR sent me an update to the price list for all models, parts, and supplies, which I've updated. Details are at http://www.fly-kr.com/ . New prices are in effect, as of November 2003. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL N56ML "at" hiwaay.net see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 10:54:33 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" To: "krnet@mylist.net" Cc: "Jerry" Subject: KR>Need some info on the Revmaster Cowling Message-ID: <402F9639.000013.02240@Computer> Content-Type: Text/Plain MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Precedence: list Message: 18 Philip J. Visconti,=0D =0D Please reply off net.=0D =0D See N64KR at http://KR-Builder.org - Then click on the pics=0D =0D Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC=0D =0D DanRH@KR-Builder.org=0D =0D See you in Mt. Vernon - 2004 - KR Gathering=0D =0D See our EAA Chapter 242 at http://EAA242.org=0D =20 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:47:50 -0500 From: "Dana Overall" To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport-Now KR1B Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed MIME-Version: 1.0 Precedence: list Message: 19 >From: "Mark Langford" >The KR1B motorglider may not be such a bad idea after all. Maybe not >for Sport Pilot, but registered as a motorglider. Here is a series of cut and pastes from the following website that addresses various gliders and motorgliders. While it does not address the glide or wing loading requirements (if there are any) to be classified as a motorglider. I'm sure it's out there somewhere to be found. http://vansaircraft.com/public/rv-11int.htm The term motorGLlDER implies that it is typically of lower performance, thus a GLIDER rather than a SAILPLANE. Later in this discussion the performance distinction will become more obvious Sailplanes: Simple; they just fly through air which is rising as fast or faster than their descent rate. If this parcel of rising air is of a size and shape that requires no turning (such as slope lift or wave lift), it is a simple process of comparing sailplane sink rates to the lift rate of the rising air. However, since the vast majority of lift used in soaring is thermal lift, sailplane circling performance must also be considered. Thermals are rising columns of warm air, and since columns are finite in diameter, one must circle in order to stay within them. More often than not, the diameters of thermals are so small that bank angles of 30-45° or greater are required to remain with their strong lift core areas. A sailplane which flies slower can circle tighter and thus remain in the stronger lift core of the thermals. In Figure 6 below, I have superimposed the sailplane sink rate drawing over a drawing showing relative lift rates within a thermal. From this it is easy to see that the low performance (slow) sailplane has a smaller turning diameter, and can more easily stay with the stronger lift. Often these slower sailplanes can climb as well or better than the higher performance ships with lower (level flight) sink rates. On the other extreme is the classic motorglider which has both a high sink rate and a high glide speed. It is relegated to the outer regions of the thermal where lift is less, yet it needs more lift than the other sailplanes charted here. The result is that, in marginal lift, the classic motorglider cannot soar and thus must either land or start its engine and look around for stronger lift. On the other hand, the self-launch sailplane soars nearly as well as its unpowered counterpart. It has a slightly higher sink rate because of the weight of the engine it is carrying around, but its drag is essentially the same as its pure sailplane equivalent. Statistics show that only 20 percent of the active glider/sailplane pilots in the US engage in cross-country flying. That means that 80% of them never venture farther than gliding distance of their home airport. There is nothing inherently wrong with that. Each pilot finds his rewards in different places. The pure joy of sustaining motorless flight is reward enough. For this majority, a sailplane of limited performance would suffice. Back in the 1950s, the international soaring community chose a 15-meter (49.2 ft.) span as a practical size for competition and sport sailplanes. Thus, the majority of single seat sailplanes today are 15-meter ships, and they have become the standard of comparison. Recently, we have seen the establishment of an 18meter (59 ft) class, largely inhabited by self-launch sailplanes. The added span helps carry the weight of the retractable engine and still offer very good minimum sink rates. Thus, let’s think in terms of a minimum 15-meter span as a basis for motor glider design concept. The best 15-meter fiberglass sailplanes achieve L/D ratios of 45 or slightly higher. The best of the 15 meter aluminum sailplanes can attain around 40:1 L/D. By rule of thumb, we might assume that the same basic wing used on a motor glider with a fixed tractor engine, a drag optimized cowl, and a feathering (or folding) prop, would achieve an L/D of 33-35. Sink rates of the better 15 meter ships come in at just under 2 ft/sec. (120 fpm), so we can hope for as little 2.5 fps (150 fpm) for the motor glider equivalent. These are numbers which translate into what should be a very acceptable sport sailplane. Dana Overall 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host Richmond, KY i39 RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic" Finish kit 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon. http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg do not archive _________________________________________________________________ Optimize your Internet experience to the max with the new MSN Premium Internet Software. http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200359ave/direct/01/ ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:27:38 -0500 From: Virgil Salisbury To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: <20040215.124100.800.2.virgnvs@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 20 Forget the Documentation for Sport Pilot! You can fly the motor glider without a MEDICAL, Virg On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 06:08:35 -0500 "Dana Overall" writes: > > >From: Virgil Salisbury > > > > K R 1b Motor Glider for your situation, Virg > > > > Virg, I respectfully mention the above comment may be jumping the > gun. > First of all, there is not much history out there on the motor > glider. > Second of all, I would seriously recommend one go to the actually > document > that proceeded the advisory board recommendations and read the pages > upon > pages of documentation, engineering papers, flight parameters, > flight > performance.........the list goes on and on, required for submission > in > determination. It is, and will be, a very exhausting process. My > gut > feeling, from reading the document, is they are not going to willy > nilly > hand these pink slips out. My opinion, and it is just that, the > KR1 motor > glide may be able to fall into the classification but lacks > supporting > documentation at this time. > > > > > Dana Overall > 1999 & 2000 National KR Gathering host > Richmond, KY i39 > RV-7 slider, Imron black, "Black Magic" > Finish kit > 13B Rotary. Hangar flying my Dynon. > http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero1.jpg > http://rvflying.tripod.com/aero3.jpg > http://rvflying.tripod.com/blackrudder.jpg > do not archive > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get some great ideas here for your sweetheart on Valentine's Day - > and > beyond. http://special.msn.com/network/celebrateromance.armx > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > Virgil N. Salisbury - AMSOIL www.lubedealer.com/salisbury Miami ,Fl ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2004 11:47:40 -0500 From: Virgil Salisbury To: krnet@mylist.net Subject: Re: KR>Hershey Bar wing/ KRSport Message-ID: <20040215.124100.800.3.virgnvs@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Precedence: list Message: 21 K.R.1b M otor Glider. Span 27' Wing Area 91 Empty 484 Gross 800 Vne 144 Vmax 130 Vman 100 L/D 20/1@ 65MPH. DO NOT EXTEND THE WINGS ON A K.R.2 !!! The center spar is not stressed to take the load!! Build the K.R.1 stock and get the 1b Plans. Outer wings built in the same way as the K.R.1, with longer THICKER (not deeper) spars. Get the Plans, Virg On Sun, 15 Feb 2004 07:59:55 -0600 "Mark Langford" writes: > The KR1B motorglider may not be such a bad idea after all. Maybe not > for > Sport Pilot, but registered as a motorglider. Below is something I > posted in > Nov, dug up from the archives in about 10 seconds. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- > ------------- > There's an interesting article in the December 2003 Kitplanes (page > 15) that > discusses the Europa MOTORGLIDER. The guy that built it lost his > medical, > but discovered that all you need to fly a "motorglider" is a glider > license! > No medical required. It seems that we KR folks are sitting on the > ultimate > no-medical fighting machine, the KR1B Motorglider. > > The article didn't elaborate about what makes a plane a legal > motorglider, > but this thing had a gross weight of 1450 pounds and had a 115 hp > engine in > it. The "Kit Aircraft Directory" in the same issue lists the cruise > speed > as 174 mph, stall speed as 45 mph, 760 mile range, takeoff and > landing in > 600 feet, fuel capacity of 28 gallons, and two seats. Get the > picture guys? > The KR1 would certainly qualify. I'd call the local FSDO just in > case, but > it sounds like all you'd need is some longer wings and a glider > license to > keep on flying, regardless of Sport Pilot. My guess is that the > definition > of motorglider is based on wing loading, but I could be wrong. > > Does anybody actually OWN a set of KR1B Motorglider plans? If so, > are there > any structural differences to the spars? My guess is probably not. > Anybody > know the price differential in plans or parts? RR's website makes > practically no mention of the KR1B plans or parts. Speaking of > which, RR > sent me an update to the price list for all models, parts, and > supplies, > which I've updated. Details are at http://www.fly-kr.com/ . New > prices are > in effect, as of November 2003. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- > ---------- > > Mark Langford, Huntsville, AL > N56ML "at" hiwaay.net > see KR2S project at http://home.hiwaay.net/~langford > > > > _______________________________________ > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > > Virgil N. Salisbury - AMSOIL www.lubedealer.com/salisbury Miami ,Fl ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 312, Issue 1 *************************************