From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 367 Date: 9/16/2005 9:00:39 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. RE: R?f. : RE: R?f. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition Systems, it Saved My Bacon - CORRECTION (Ron Freiberger) 2. Re: How to widen and KR2 (M & C) 3. Re: How to widen and KR2 (Tim Hoversten) 4. Re: Réf. : RE: Réf. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition Systems, it Saved My Bacon - CORRECTION (Scott William) 5. Nothing to do with Dual Ignition (Dan Heath) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 21:03:20 -0400 From: "Ron Freiberger" Subject: RE: R?f. : RE: R?f. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition Systems, it Saved My Bacon - CORRECTION To: "'KRnet'" Message-ID: <000001c5bb23$98df7d00$6400a8c0@Disorganized> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Interesting, but not "Dual Ignition". Ron Freiberger mail to ronandmartha@earthlink.net -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] On Behalf Of Robert Morrissey Sent: Friday, September 16, 2005 8:37 PM To: KRnet Subject: Re: Réf. : RE: Réf. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition Systems, it Saved My Bacon - CORRECTION Serge: As a former "Liaison Engineer' for a big aerospace company that was bought out by Boeing I will give you the SOP (standard operating procedure) for your aircrafts 'non conformance' that occurred during 'manufacturing' or 'depot level overhaul". (My text book answer) FOR THE; a. original WAFs with the oversize 3/8 inch hole---are they a standard oversize? Let us assume they are not a standard size. Looking at FWD WING ATTACH FITTINGS, drawing no. 18 in my RR book pg.23 ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 20:33:26 -0500 From: "M & C" Subject: Re: KR> How to widen and KR2 To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original I don't have a web site but if someone wants pictures I can send to someone and they can post them on their web site. I'm building gull wing doors instead of the usual setup for a canopy. Mike Turner Jackson, Missouri Swing the prop and light the fire, dance amoung the stars.........N642MC ----- Original Message ----- From: "Orma" To: "KRnet" Sent: Friday, September 16, 2005 7:19 PM Subject: Re: KR> How to widen and KR2 > If you don't already have pictures of the mod on he net, you should do > so. There might be others who are interested. What do you plan to do > with the canopy? > > Orma > Southfield, MI > KR-2 N110LR 1984 > See Tweety at http://www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com > See other KR spces at www.kr-2.aviation-mechanics.com/krinfo.htm > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 18:57:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Tim Hoversten Subject: Re: KR> How to widen and KR2 To: KRnet Message-ID: <20050917015711.79891.qmail@web54002.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 I have an original KR-2 in the boat stage in my hangar at the Baraboo-Dells airport - maybe trade? "L. D. Mueller" wrote:Help! I just bought the KR2S that was on Barnstormers in Sparta MI. The cabin width is 32"? The plane is at the boat stage with both spars in place. Any ideas of widening this fuse so my wife and I can fly together--without a complete rebuild? We would need 38" to be comfortable. Or should I put it up for sale . . . ; - ) And thanks for all the hospitality @ KMVN. We enjoyed all of it--Nancy especially enjoyed the rides and flying that she got. Larry and Nancy Mueller L. D. Mueller 521 North Madison Street Cuba City, WI 53807 608-744-3333 _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html Tim Hoversten Portage, WI timhoversten@yahoo.com --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 19:01:04 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott William Subject: Re: Réf. : RE: Réf. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition Systems, it Saved My Bacon - CORRECTION To: KRnet Message-ID: <20050917020104.87929.qmail@web31504.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Lemme give ya redneck Scott's answer to all of this: The sumbitch ain't right, get ya a new one!!! Scott --- Robert Morrissey wrote: > Serge: As a former "Liaison Engineer' for a big > aerospace company that > was bought out by Boeing I will give you the SOP > (standard operating > procedure) for your aircrafts 'non conformance' that > occurred during > 'manufacturing' or 'depot level overhaul". (My text > book answer) > FOR THE; > a. original WAFs with the oversize 3/8 inch > hole---are they a standard > oversize? Let us assume they are not a standard > size. > > Looking at FWD WING ATTACH FITTINGS, drawing no. 18 > in my RR book pg.23 > dated january 1990 the WAF is 1 1/2 inch wide and > has a 3/8 dia. hole > drilled 3/4 inch from the end. In my working days > I would go to a stress > engineer, show him the part drawing, identify the > 3/8 hole is oversize > and tell him what my method of repair was to be. > The stress engineer > typically went to his books and evaluated the over > size hole condition as a > 'lug analysis' with reduced edge distance (tear out) > and 100% of the time > went along with the installation of a larger > diameter fastener. For really > critical lugs, with really screwed up damage, I > actually had inspection > record > the tear out as well as the actual part thickness > and provided this data to > the > stress engineer. The hole could be drilled to an > oversize such as 1/64 > oversize, > 1/32 oversize or even a next full size standard size > as was required by the > part condition.. > Any hole increased in size must have the same > fastener/hole assembly > tolerances > as the rest of the WAFs. If there was a > possibility of the oversize bolt > being removed in the > future the area was marked to denote the hole and > special size fastener. > For those parts that would undergo constant bolt > removal and replacement > then a minimum 0.016 inch wall thickness bushing > would be pressed fit into > the discrepant part. The bushing would have a 0.0005 > to 0.001 inch press fit > and > be of the same material. This would bring the > discrepant part back to > blueprint. > > b. for your new WAFS-- my drawing referenced above > shows a series of 3/16 > inch diameter holes located 1/4 inch from the long > edge of the part. If I > take half of the 3/16 inch and subtract it from the > 1/4 inch we have 5/32 > (0.0156inch) of an inch for tear out. That is not > much edge distance. > As an intelligent guess, if you are looking at > tear out of less than 0.140 inch I would not use > them. > > I am going to ignore the fact that the WAF drawings > used are not to > aircraft standards. I have never seen fractions used > on such a critical > machined part. > Standard sheet metal tolerances are +- 0.030 inch. > Can you see what would > happen > on the WAF if that tolerance was used > indiscriminately during manufacture? > How about checking your WAF holes to see what kind > of assembly tolerance > your fittings have. > > I never did get involved in reliability engineering > during my work career > but I do love redundancy. I hope the above info > gives you a feel for what > you have on your hands > Do you have any friends that are stress engineers > that you can pass this by? > Regards > Bob Morrissey, New Bern NC > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Serge VIDAL" > To: "KRnet" > Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 5:16 AM > Subject: Réf. : RE: Réf. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition > Systems, it Saved My > Bacon - CORRECTION > > > Well, as a former reliability expert, I can give you > the text book answer: > > - Reliability is risk management; > - The universally accepted method of managing that > risk is what gives > birth to aircraft safety standards; > - The authorities (like ICAO) are supposed to define > what is your > acceptable level of risk for the activity (roughly, basically, deaths > per X flight hours). > - At designer level, you then find what is likely to > cause these risks, > and define "unwanted events" (example: power loss, > flight controls > failure, etc.) > - If failure of one component that is likely to > cause an unwanted event is > so unlikely that it is less than the acceptable risk > level, then you don't > have to do anything about it. You assess that by > estimating the > probability of failure (occurrence) and its > consequences (severity), to > define the level of CRITICITY. A part can be non > critical because it is so > unlikely to fail, or because .. If it is not the > case, then you have to > improve the reliability. You have many ways to do > that, (can be better > technology, better part design, monitoring, > maintenance, you name it.). Of > course, one method is redundancy. It is seldom the > correct answer, but it > is generally the easiest, and that's why it is so > popular in aviation. > > Now, this is the rule for expensive designs > (airliners, jet fighters, > nuclear power plants, space shuttles or whatever). > In general aviation, > the trouble is it is not affordable to calculate > exactly all the risks > attached to all the parts and equipment. So, we > apply a rule of thumb, > which is: no single failure may lead to an unwanted > event. That is what > you do with your ignition or fuel system. > > But we also apply criticity, through return of > experience of 100 years of > designing and flying. We know that single engine is > an acceptable > solution, so we don't make the engine redundant. But > we make the engine's > most critical components redundant. The ignition, > but not the carb... > > Likewise, we know that control cables are unlikely > to fail, provided you > rig them properly and inspect them regularly, so we > don't make them > redundant either. > > In my opinion, the statistics of engine failure in > aviation are an > absolute shame, and the ignition is the main > culprit. So, I go for a > better technology, and ultimately, as soon as it > will become practical, I > will go for an engine technology without ignition: > the Diesel engine. > > Serge Vidal > KR2 "Kilimanjaro Cloud" > Paris, FranceSent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 9:13 > AM > To: Corvair engines for homebuilt aircraft > Subject: Re: CorvAircraft> Dual Ignition Systems, it > Saved My Bacon > > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to > KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at > http://www.krnet.org/info.html > __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 22:42:54 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: KR> Nothing to do with Dual Ignition To: Message-ID: <432B82AE.000001.01876@DANHOMECOMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Did you mean to say, "It most likely cannot be corrected, therefore, you should get a new one"? Just wondering? See you in Mt. Vernon - 2006 - KR Gathering See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for building has expired. Daniel R. Heath - Columbia, SC -------Original Message------- Subject: Re: Réf. : RE: Réf. : KR> RE: Dual Ignition Systems, it Saved My Bacon - CORRECTION Lemme give ya cvxcvxvxcvc answer to all of this: The fsfwwewewr ain't right, get ya a new one!!! ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 367 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================