From: krnet-bounces+johnbou=speakeasy.net@mylist.net To: John Bouyea Subject: KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 490 Date: 11/29/2005 9:00:13 PM Send KRnet mailing list submissions to krnet@mylist.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mylist.net/listinfo/krnet or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to krnet-request@mylist.net You can reach the person managing the list at krnet-owner@mylist.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of KRnet digest..." Today's Topics: 1. RE: Engine options? (Brian Kraut) 2. dueling primers (Oscar Zuniga) 3. Differing opinions (Dan Heath) 4. Re: Differing opinions (Joseph H. Horton) 5. Re: Differing opinions (Mark Jones) 6. RE: Differing opinions (Brian Kraut) 7. Re: dueling primers (Jerry Mahurin) 8. Re: Primer (Jerry Mahurin) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 18:32:07 -0500 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> Engine options? To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" There is a guy at my airport with a Jenny replica with the Geo in it. It is very narrow and has a wonderfull sound to it. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Stephen Teate Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 9:13 AM To: KRnet Subject: RE: KR> Engine options? "Besides the mazda, what's out there in the 70-80 HP range that is not 2 cycle? Any thoughts out there?" The Honda Prelude & Civic inline 4 cylinder engines have been popular with the BD5 folks. Also the GEO Metro inline 3 cylinder has been used in other aircraft. I believe you can find more info on these on the Contact Magazine website. Stephen -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net] On Behalf Of patrusso Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 5:12 AM To: KRnet Subject: KR> Engine options? I am looking for a narrower (smaller in physical size) engine for my single seat KR. My VW is too wide. I want to streamline the firewall forward to look more in line with P51, 109 etc. Besides the mazda, what's out there in the 70-80 HP range that is not 2 cycle? Any thoughts out there? Pat _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 17:35:42 -0600 From: "Oscar Zuniga" Subject: KR> dueling primers To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Jerry wrote- >the manual primer with just two 1/8" lines is MUCH simpler to work with >No wires complex plumbing, etc. Dan (his building mate) wrote- >I certainly disagree with that. You need more plumbing with the manual >system. The plumbing has to run into the cockpit. How can it be >lighter unless the manual plunger and additional plumbing are lighter >than the solenoid? Do you guys ever talk to each other? ;o) [classic "less filling... more taste" argument. Solution: more beer!] Sorry; I know it's not even Friday. Oscar Zuniga San Antonio, TX mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com website at http://www.flysquirrel.net ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:14:06 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: "Dan Heath" Subject: KR> Differing opinions To: Message-ID: <438CEECE.000021.01668@DANHOMECOMPUTER> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Well, sorry about that. I was just expressing my opinion that just happens to be on the other side of Jerry's opinion. Just because we built a plane together does not mean that we have to agree on everything. I think that when someone expresses such a strong opinion on something, it should not be left as thought that IS the way it IS. We should always look at different sides, as those new to building, may think that one way is the ONLY way, and in this case it certainly is not. Would you make the same point if Mark Jones made a point and Mark Langford countered it? See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics See you in Mt. Vernon - 2006 - KR Gathering There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for building is OVER. Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC -------Original Message------- Jerry wrote- Dan (his building mate) wrote- ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:28:11 -0500 From: "Joseph H. Horton" Subject: Re: KR> Differing opinions To: krnet@mylist.net Message-ID: <20051129.192812.2240.20.joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Well here is my unsolicited opinion. I had built and installed a push pull primer and never once used it. I took it off a couple month ago and it is laying here on the bench and still have not needed it. I have no reason why it works for me but it starts in about 2 blades every time. Your results will most certainly vary. Joe Horton, Coopersburg, PA. joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:14:06 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) "Dan Heath" writes: > Well, sorry about that. I was just expressing my opinion that just > happens > to be on the other side of Jerry's opinion. Just because we built a > plane > together does not mean that we have to agree on everything. I think > that > when someone expresses such a strong opinion on something, it should > not be > left as thought that IS the way it IS. We should always look at > different > sides, as those new to building, may think that one way is the ONLY > way, and > in this case it certainly is not. > > Would you make the same point if Mark Jones made a point and Mark > Langford > countered it? > > See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics > > See you in Mt. Vernon - 2006 - KR Gathering > > There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for > building > is OVER. > > Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC > > -------Original Message------- > > > > Jerry wrote- > > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:15:23 -0600 From: "Mark Jones" Subject: Re: KR> Differing opinions To: "KRnet" Message-ID: <006301c5f54b$8a3af880$6501a8c0@wi.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" When I was experimenting with my Aerocarb, I never had to use a primer either. The Aerocarb works on gravity and is basically a controlled flow carburetor working on the slide principal, which you already knew. Our Ellisons require a primer, because different from the Aerocarb, it has a regulator which requires a certain amount of suction for the regulator to open and allow fuel to flow. It also requires a minimum of 3 psi for full power operation. The Ellison will run with no pressure as I have flight proven that when I lost my fuel pump two weeks ago. The Ellison will suck enough fuel from wing tanks if the engine is running to allow up to 2300 rpm. Anything past that and your engine will be starved for fuel. I again tested this this past weekend doing ground runs. I primed the engine, left the fuel pumps off, and started the engine. She idled perfectly and ran fine up to 2300 rpm never skipping a beat. Like I said, past that she was starving for fuel. Some carbs require primers and some do not. Some folks like manual primers and some like solenoids. That is the beauty of experimental aviation. We do not have to answer to anyone but ourselves. We just have to make sure what we do is safe and airworthy. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my NEW KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at www.flykr2s.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph H. Horton" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 6:28 PM Subject: Re: KR> Differing opinions > Well here is my unsolicited opinion. I had built and installed a push > pull primer and never once used it. I took it off a couple month ago > and it is laying here on the bench and still have not needed it. I > have no reason why it works for me but it starts in about 2 blades > every time. Your results will most certainly vary. Joe Horton, > Coopersburg, PA. joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com > > On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:14:06 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) "Dan Heath" > writes: > > Well, sorry about that. I was just expressing my opinion that just > > happens to be on the other side of Jerry's opinion. Just because we > > built a plane > > together does not mean that we have to agree on everything. I think > > that > > when someone expresses such a strong opinion on something, it should > > not be > > left as thought that IS the way it IS. We should always look at > > different > > sides, as those new to building, may think that one way is the ONLY > > way, and > > in this case it certainly is not. > > > > Would you make the same point if Mark Jones made a point and Mark > > Langford countered it? > > > > See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics > > > > See you in Mt. Vernon - 2006 - KR Gathering > > > > There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for > > building is OVER. > > > > Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > > > Jerry wrote- > > > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 21:28:00 -0500 From: "Brian Kraut" Subject: RE: KR> Differing opinions To: "KRnet" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" If the Aerocarb is like the Posa it is self priming, as in you just turn on the fuel valve and it pisses fuel out just sitting there. My KR with the 2180 and a Zenith carb would never start without the primer. My Sonerai has an 1835 with a Zenith carb and no primer and it starts in two or three blades every time. One of life's great mysteries. Brian Kraut Engineering Alternatives, Inc. www.engalt.com -----Original Message----- From: krnet-bounces@mylist.net [mailto:krnet-bounces@mylist.net]On Behalf Of Mark Jones Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 8:15 PM To: KRnet Subject: Re: KR> Differing opinions When I was experimenting with my Aerocarb, I never had to use a primer either. The Aerocarb works on gravity and is basically a controlled flow carburetor working on the slide principal, which you already knew. Our Ellisons require a primer, because different from the Aerocarb, it has a regulator which requires a certain amount of suction for the regulator to open and allow fuel to flow. It also requires a minimum of 3 psi for full power operation. The Ellison will run with no pressure as I have flight proven that when I lost my fuel pump two weeks ago. The Ellison will suck enough fuel from wing tanks if the engine is running to allow up to 2300 rpm. Anything past that and your engine will be starved for fuel. I again tested this this past weekend doing ground runs. I primed the engine, left the fuel pumps off, and started the engine. She idled perfectly and ran fine up to 2300 rpm never skipping a beat. Like I said, past that she was starving for fuel. Some carbs require primers and some do not. Some folks like manual primers and some like solenoids. That is the beauty of experimental aviation. We do not have to answer to anyone but ourselves. We just have to make sure what we do is safe and airworthy. Mark Jones (N886MJ) Wales, WI USA E-mail me at flykr2s@wi.rr.com Visit my NEW KR-2S CorvAIRCRAFT web site at www.flykr2s.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joseph H. Horton" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 29, 2005 6:28 PM Subject: Re: KR> Differing opinions > Well here is my unsolicited opinion. I had built and installed a push > pull primer and never once used it. I took it off a couple month ago > and it is laying here on the bench and still have not needed it. I > have no reason why it works for me but it starts in about 2 blades > every time. Your results will most certainly vary. Joe Horton, > Coopersburg, PA. joe.kr2s.builder@juno.com > > On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:14:06 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) "Dan Heath" > writes: > > Well, sorry about that. I was just expressing my opinion that just > > happens to be on the other side of Jerry's opinion. Just because we > > built a plane > > together does not mean that we have to agree on everything. I think > > that > > when someone expresses such a strong opinion on something, it should > > not be > > left as thought that IS the way it IS. We should always look at > > different > > sides, as those new to building, may think that one way is the ONLY > > way, and > > in this case it certainly is not. > > > > Would you make the same point if Mark Jones made a point and Mark > > Langford countered it? > > > > See N64KR at http://KRBuilder.org - Then click on the pics > > > > See you in Mt. Vernon - 2006 - KR Gathering > > > > There is a time for building and a time for FLYING and the time for > > building is OVER. > > > > Daniel R. Heath - Lexington, SC > > > > -------Original Message------- > > > > > > > > Jerry wrote- > > > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > _______________________________________ Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 21:44:32 -0500 From: Jerry Mahurin Subject: Re: KR> dueling primers To: KRnet Message-ID: <3812d7480511291844o34640362k152f665dad536921@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 .........we live about 50 miles apart and we do talk and are VERY good friends........ It is just that Dan is more apt to take advice from someone else..... All in very good spirity...........NO meanness intented..... Keep on keeping on, On 11/29/05, Oscar Zuniga wrote: > > Jerry wrote- > > >the manual primer with just two 1/8" lines is MUCH simpler to work > >with No wires complex plumbing, etc. > > Dan (his building mate) wrote- > > >I certainly disagree with that. You need more plumbing with the > >manual system. The plumbing has to run into the cockpit. How can it > >be lighter unless the manual plunger and additional plumbing are > >lighter than the solenoid? > > Do you guys ever talk to each other? ;o) [classic "less filling... > more taste" argument. Solution: more beer!] Sorry; I know it's not > even Friday. > > Oscar Zuniga > San Antonio, TX > mailto: taildrags@hotmail.com > website at http://www.flysquirrel.net > > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > -- Jerry Mahurin - aka - KRJerry EAA# 0034283 Lugoff, SC 29078 ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 29 Nov 2005 21:52:28 -0500 From: Jerry Mahurin Subject: Re: KR> Primer To: KRnet Message-ID: <3812d7480511291852t67a3817ckd41e3af71e93c337@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Pat, I'm with you and Steve Wittman....keep it Simple, Strong and Safe.... BUT you can't brag about a carb (Ellison) that cost six times as much and requires a couple of fuel pumps and a primer to start.........!!! You have less toys to play with, but I guess you would rather be flying..... In good spirit......... Keep on keeping on, On 11/29/05, patrusso wrote: > > Gosh, I have the Zenith carb supplied by Great Plains with a spring > loaded choke and never worry about priming! Starts every time without > hassle. Old fashion, isn't it? Throttle forward one third, pull choke > and press start button! Just like my very first car, a '34 plymouth! > > > _______________________________________ > Search the KRnet Archives at http://www.maddyhome.com/krsrch/index.jsp > to UNsubscribe from KRnet, send a message to KRnet-leave@mylist.net > please see other KRnet info at http://www.krnet.org/info.html > -- Jerry Mahurin - aka - KRJerry EAA# 0034283 Lugoff, SC 29078 ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ See KRnet list details at http://www.krnet.org/instructions.html End of KRnet Digest, Vol 347, Issue 490 *************************************** ================================== ABC Amber Outlook Converter v4.20 Trial version ==================================